Getting a bit sick of talking about the players. FTR I don't think the list is that bad. We have major depth issues (we knew that when we let Godfrey/Ward/etc go), and we lack leg speed for sure. But I want to discuss the gameplan.

Two weeks, 199 points aggregate in loss, we over handball and put our own guys in to trouble repeatedly. When we deviate from the game plan and move the ball quickly by foot, we look a little better. When we did it today with Miller at CHF it created space behind and Neitz got a few marks. Continue to do it and there's space for midfielders to float in to or other guys to be hit on the lead.

A very crappy illustration:

Allows for dual CHFs if need be.

This is like the start of 07 all over again. Refusing to play to our strengths and not surprisingly we get smashed. Injuries last year slightly covered up just how bad our gameplan was, and it was no surprise the coach was sacked mid-year, especially after some of the players were openly (and rightly) criticial of the style of footy we were trying to play.

We don't have the assets to play run and carry, and the teams that have made it their style (WC, Port) would have killed for a forward line like ours. And if we had their midfields and a poor forward line I'd expect us to play that way, but we don't.

The poisonous snake of run and carry is back, and either we wait 5 years to regenerate a list with a great midfield or no forward line like the teams we seek to emulate or we kill this style of footy from our playbook and get back to doing what we do best, which is moving it quickly into our forward line and giving our good forwards half a chance.

Our ineptitude and lack of skills makes any game plan look ridiculous. The game plan is fine the cattle are not.

Im not sure if the game plan is this...but the game as played by Melbourne is a composite of Hot Potato - Hot Potato combined with a lot of Hospital Handpass.

It seems we are very good at kicking to outnimbered contests, waitin gfar ttoo long to inbound a behind. We love to handpas til the opposition finally gets it. Our style is to watch the opposition but not harm them in any way.

If there is a choice of actions...far better to wait and give off to no advantage ( much better than kicking ) or better still stand and wait til the bgall is taken off of you.

It very important not to take tackling too seriously...only a tap and a nudge is required; no need to get fair dinkum.

Yes we have depth problems.. scratch the surface and theres not much underneath !!

How was the cattle making three consecutive finals with a different gameplan and since then only losing one first 22 player (TJ)?

What's changed? The gameplan. Not the players.

And I'm not saying the players are perfect. We definately have holes and they definately have workrate and skill issues, but the fact is when they play this style they get smashed. To regenerate 90% of the players for the sake of a failed football theory would be ridiculous.

we had skills today ??

a novel idea to trial at training.... its new fan dangled.. its called SHEPHERDING !!!!!!

now this is a great tactic by the way... when shooting for goal...from around 50...apparantly we all need to get out of the way.. on a number of occasions I think I counted 2 or 3 only Dees in forward 50 !! wtf is this about ????

  Rhino Richards said:

Our ineptitude and lack of skills makes any game plan look ridiculous. The game plan is fine the cattle are not.

What the hell is the gameplan? I am too busy watching guys turn over the ball to understand what it is.

A classic example was Wheatley ( the longest kick in the side ) running into goal from 50 and he handballed to a guy standing still. Possession lost and goal to Dogs. Go figure.

Junior ought to have had a ping too ( sorry Junior )

Is it just me .. when a player is having a crack form a pocket or futher out we were always told to have an "insurance' player in opposite pocket.. just in case kick carried or got a knock on that way.. We NEVER do this

  Hards said:

How was the cattle making three consecutive finals with a different gameplan and since then only losing one first 22 player (TJ)?

What's changed? The gameplan. Not the players.

You are wrong.

The players names may be largely the same but the players are not. All our senior players have deteriorated to the borderline or below AFL standard. Our younger players have stalled or have taled off. Other teams have continued to improved as we have falen behind. Furthermore the game has changed wioth

I am not so sure you want to hang onto a game plan for yesterdays players many of whom will be gone or not around within in one or two years.

Its up to DB to cut the wheat from the chaff and to identify which of the younger brigade have the capacity and discipline and follow instructions. At the moment few are and most cannot execute enough skills to tie their own laces.

  Redleg said:

What the hell is the gameplan? I am too busy watching guys turn over the ball to understand what it is.

A classic example was Wheatley ( the longest kick in the side ) running into goal from 50 and he handballed to a guy standing still. Possession lost and goal to Dogs. Go figure.

I could mention 100s of them. When stupidity is displayed on masse like that where player wont (cant think) and players think they should imitate pillars of salt when they dont have the ball I dont think you can have any reasonable game plan despite best intentions.

  On 29/03/2008 at 07:12, beelzebub said:

Im not sure if the game plan is this...but the game as played by Melbourne is a composite of Hot Potato - Hot Potato combined with a lot of Hospital Handpass.

It seems we are very good at kicking to outnimbered contests, waitin gfar ttoo long to inbound a behind. We love to handpas til the opposition finally gets it. Our style is to watch the opposition but not harm them in any way.

If there is a choice of actions...far better to wait and give off to no advantage ( much better than kicking ) or better still stand and wait til the bgall is taken off of you.

It very important not to take tackling too seriously...only a tap and a nudge is required; no need to get fair dinkum.

Yes we have depth problems.. scratch the surface and theres not much underneath !!

The above post from 2008 could relate to  our current side.

how depressing 

Still over handball and to people in worse situations and still don’t shepherd... sigh.

  On 16/04/2018 at 03:42, bandicoot said:

The above post from 2008 could relate to  our current side.

how depressing 

Good God. 

10 years of NOTHING

My thoughts while reading that started with mild amusement before passing onto interest and finishing with depression.

Please tell me there were golden highlights to come and we only had to give the players or the coach a chance.

Look at the positives. It only got worse from there and now years later we’re back where we started. 

Makes you wonder what it must be like to be a Hawks supporter.

"Oh hell we missed the finals one year and we did not get our fourpeat."

Perhaps they will be bored into oblivion by success

How many down years did they have before they picked up Buddy and Roughead? (3-4)