we now have meesen, have got rid of trav, now to get benny mckinley

I want to keep Cj at least for another year or 2 and see what bails can do with him, hopefully give him 7-8 games in a row and see if he settles in.

I havnt been impressed with CJ, but Im not sure about this. People can name all the late-pick success stories they like, the reality is they're an anomoly.

I agree that he hasnt done much, but really, he's 21 and the juries still very much out. I dont even disagree with people who say he's soft, but that doesnt really set him apart from most 21 year old skilled flankers, the question is if he can get passed that as he matures. Its hard to buy the argument that trading him for a pick in the 40s would be a gamble that *could* land us a good player, when keeping him would be a gamble that could land us a good player. If he was 23 I'd be happy enough to see him traded for a late draft pick- he'd still be very young and even if his improvement is only marginal he'd have more currency by then if anything. Even for a pick in the 30s it would be different, but I just worry that we're biting off our nose to spite our face.

He's got skill that's why i think we'd be better off giving him another year. Considering Brown and Ward are goneay get a few games. Put him on s Half Back Flank for seven or eight games in a row and see how he goes.

Has this trade happened?

If we can offload CJ fopr a pick in the 40's this trade period is going to be magnificent

Bell was picked up the year before Johnson and he's only found consistent form this season. Thompson was another late developer as was Robertson.

Johnson has shown something, if he has an average 2008, then he'll probably be delisted. But if pick 42s the best we can do, I'd prefer to keep him and take a gamble.

Bell was picked up the year before Johnson and he's only found consistent form this season. Thompson was another late developer as was Robertson.

Johnson has shown something, if he has an average 2008, then he'll probably be delisted. But if pick 42s the best we can do, I'd prefer to keep him and take a gamble.

Based on CAC's radio interview today on SEN, a CJ trade could be dying a natural death. I think he might be back on that plane to China.

Bell was picked up the year before Johnson and he's only found consistent form this season.

good point. bell was given a solid run too, whereas cj has been picked then dropped repeatedly. my problem is that he has rarely dominated at vfl level like i would like him too...

hey, give him a new coach and he could turn around. we know he is a lovely kick and that is a very sought after skill...

good point. bell was given a solid run too, whereas cj has been picked then dropped repeatedly. my problem is that he has rarely dominated at vfl level like i would like him too...

hey, give him a new coach and he could turn around. we know he is a lovely kick and that is a very sought after skill...

He had quite a few BOG for Sandy this year.

Must suck knowing that no matter how well you perform at VFL level, the coach won't give you a sustained run in the seniors. That sort of lack of faith eventually takes its toll.

Oh and CJ was drafted the same year as Sylvia. Sylvia has played 31 more matches, yet averages less disposals and less marks per game. If CJ was a pick 3, and Sylvia was pick 36, CJ would be getting all the game time in the world and Sylvia would be talked about as a 'dud'.

cj was named as bog a number of times, but in the sandy reports i thought i read that he often just went, and prob didnt deserve bog...i didnt see many games however (just one or two on tv) sio id like to hear from an expert on this matter...

Oh and CJ was drafted the same year as Sylvia. Sylvia has played 31 more matches, yet averages less disposals and less marks per game. If CJ was a pick 3, and Sylvia was pick 36, CJ would be getting all the game time in the world and Sylvia would be talked about as a 'dud'.

...and Sylvia gets far more game time.

Frankly, if he stays or goes, it is of little concern. Might be good to have another pick but...

Cannot see him playing a huge part next year. Who knows, maybe this is the spur he needs, because at the moment most of us would say that he is a soft HBF who can't get his own ball.

Things can change quickly though.

I dont know if I'd compare him to Sylvia. Sylvia's struggled with OP since we got him, and even though he's yet to kick on the way we all hoped he would, he still made a significant improvement last year and cemented his place in the best 22. Thats actually a fair effort when you consider he still has OP and is yet to have a full preseason. Whether CJ would have contributed as much as Sylv if he'd had the same opportunities is a point of contention.

I still wouldnt trade CJ for a pick in the 40's at 21 years of age, because again, I think the jury is still out. But as far as Sylvia goes, I can understand the criticism this time last year, but with all things considered his '07 season was actually pretty good.

CJ has completd a few pre-seasons

The Kid SYlvia has completed none

In 2008, Sylvia will tear the AFL to pieces

I am talking about Ablett-like. Sylvia has no weaknesess in his game, it is all physical (groin)

75 goals and 20 touches per game for the KID in 2008, along with a B and F and a top 3 finish in the Brownlow

I want to keep Cj at least for another year or 2 and see what bails can do with him, hopefully give him 7-8 games in a row and see if he settles in.

Agreed.

I can not forget that 1st half of that prac game against the toiges, he absolutely dominated, if bailey can unleash that player come the big stuff I tell you what watch out...

CJ has completd a few pre-seasons

The Kid SYlvia has completed none

In 2008, Sylvia will tear the AFL to pieces

I am talking about Ablett-like. Sylvia has no weaknesess in his game, it is all physical (groin)

75 goals and 20 touches per game for the KID in 2008, along with a B and F and a top 3 finish in the Brownlow

1650 goals for the year wow. haha yeah na agree with u

Look I'm not trying to compare Sylvia to CJ.

Sylvia clearly has more natural ability and has had to battle injuries. CJ on the other hand has had no problems with injuries, yet has been given little to no opportunity to have a sustained run. Even in the second half of the season, he was not given a run with the likes of Ward and Brown. Those two are now gone, while CJ is still just 21.

When he gets a game, his ground time is limited, yet he still manages to accumulate a few possessions, and overall his disposal is good.

No doubt he has limitations, and he also doesn't have a defined position. With the delisting/retirement of Brown, Ward and Pickett, there are now 3 more openings for CJ, who could play as a half-back flanker, a half-forward flanker, or on the wing.

He is one player who would IMO benefit enormously from having a new coach. Worse can scenario he doesn't improve much after some more game time, he turns 22 and we trade him. I'm sure we'll still get a late third round pick next year if we really wanted. This is not a matter of 'now or never'.

like someone mentioned above..CAC said we are involved in no more deals...but he also said...never say never...

so if CJ was being talked about as a nearly done deal i am sure he would ahve mentioned it

Must suck knowing that no matter how well you perform at VFL level, the coach won't give you a sustained run in the seniors. That sort of lack of faith eventually takes its toll.

It's a bit hard to give him a sustained run in the team when he is pathetic every single time he takes the field.

CJ has completd a few pre-seasons

The Kid SYlvia has completed none

In 2008, Sylvia will tear the AFL to pieces

I am talking about Ablett-like. Sylvia has no weaknesess in his game, it is all physical (groin)

75 goals and 20 touches per game for the KID in 2008, along with a B and F and a top 3 finish in the Brownlow

you heard it first. sylvia can kick goals with his mind...

If St.Kilda is CJ's destination it might be tougher. They gave 26 for Schneider & Dempster and still have King to chase, although he may go through to the PSD.

He is one player who would IMO benefit enormously from having a new coach. Worse can scenario he doesn't improve much after some more game time, he turns 22 and we trade him. I'm sure we'll still get a late third round pick next year if we really wanted. This is not a matter of 'now or never'.

I'm with you Jaded. We are risking very little if we keep him, and he has another nothing year

However, we stand to gain a valuable player, if he lives up to his potential

I'm with you Jaded. We are risking very little if we keep him, and he has another nothing year

However, we stand to gain a valuable player, if he lives up to his potential

I agree with that logic. If for example a three way deal was done and we picked up say Moran or better still Murphy with some alteration to picks it would be a different story.

I agree with that logic. If for example a three way deal was done and we picked up say Moran or better still Murphy with some alteration to picks it would be a different story.

I'm keen to have a 3rd round pick - a lot of players can be rated fairly evenly through the late 2nd round and 3rd round and we could easily pick up someone we really like who has been overlooked. If it takes CJ to do it I'm willing. The Saints may be reluctant to trade 3rd round after trading 2nd round to the Saints. I read on BF they were thinking 4th round 59 - that's a lot less helpful. Maybe they'd do a pick trade CJ + 53 for 43 + 59.

I'm keen to have a 3rd round pick - a lot of players can be rated fairly evenly through the late 2nd round and 3rd round and we could easily pick up someone we really like who has been overlooked. If it takes CJ to do it I'm willing. The Saints may be reluctant to trade 3rd round after trading 2nd round to the Saints. I read on BF they were thinking 4th round 59 - that's a lot less helpful. Maybe they'd do a pick trade CJ + 53 for 43 + 59.

But to trade CJ for a third round pick, you're essentially trading someone we know to have promise but has not yet delivered, for someone who has been regarded by clubs taking picks before him to not have exceedingly high promise who has not yet delivered.

given johnson's age i don't see any harm in one more year, especially under a new coach