Time to go Goody?

[layzie 33,793]

We'd be stupid to change coaches right now 

[BAMF 4,345]

17 hours ago, fr_ap said:

The fault here lies squarely at the feet of Tim Lamb. 

His inability to recruit a single senior player to add to this team is a travesty. Worse, those he has added are genuinely negatives from a competitiveness and physicality POV. 

To maintain a competitive list you need both trading and drafting to be on point. We built our flag with draft + Langdon, Lever, Hibberd, Melksham, May. We haven't added a single solid piece since. 

I said at the start of the year that we were a Trac injury away from missing finals - I was right. I'm not sure what we expected tbh when our midfield depth consists of Laurie, Woewoedin, Tholstrup. They're just kids - but it's just not at the level. We knew Oliver would be poor. I don't think any of us thought Viney would be this poor. Deloitte might have broken him...

We simply had to add some senior, good players to this team after the flag. Richmond went and got Tom Lynch. We got Grundy...

The McAdams trade was a complete blunder. One that no doubt will get pointed out in trade period when we all start focusing on who we could have picked up with a very good second round pick in a deep draft. 

Fullarton was likewise terrible.

Billings I can live with as it was basically a Harmes replacement in trade value, albeit a downgrade in the end in both player quality and draft value marginally.

The trading of second and third round picks to upgrade 3 spots also woeful.

[BAMF 4,345]

17 hours ago, fr_ap said:

The fault here lies squarely at the feet of Tim Lamb. 

His inability to recruit a single senior player to add to this team is a travesty. Worse, those he has added are genuinely negatives from a competitiveness and physicality POV. 

To maintain a competitive list you need both trading and drafting to be on point. We built our flag with draft + Langdon, Lever, Hibberd, Melksham, May. We haven't added a single solid piece since. 

I said at the start of the year that we were a Trac injury away from missing finals - I was right. I'm not sure what we expected tbh when our midfield depth consists of Laurie, Woewoedin, Tholstrup. They're just kids - but it's just not at the level. We knew Oliver would be poor. I don't think any of us thought Viney would be this poor. Deloitte might have broken him...

We simply had to add some senior, good players to this team after the flag. Richmond went and got Tom Lynch. We got Grundy...

The McAdams trade was a complete blunder. One that no doubt will get pointed out in trade period when we all start focusing on who we could have picked up with a very good second round pick in a deep draft. 

Fullarton was likewise terrible.

Billings I can live with as it was basically a Harmes replacement in trade value, albeit a downgrade in the end in both player quality and draft value marginally.

The trading of second and third round picks to upgrade 3 spots also woeful.

[DeeZone 9,812]

Yeah / Nah we clear some space in Salary Cap open up 6-8 spots on the list, I’ll leave that to the club to manage, we bring in another midfield gun plus another 5-7 new faces. Get another full preseason into our younger brigade and newbies. Refocus and reset on 2025 and beyond.

[Demonsone 2,037]

4 minutes ago, Heart Beats True said:

They’ve won one but been there more times than Goodwin has. Tell me why he’s better than any other coach at people management? What makes him in your eyes clearly better than anyone else?

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

[Demonsone 2,037]

25 minutes ago, Heart Beats True said:

They’ve won one but been there more times than Goodwin has. Tell me why he’s better than any other coach at people management? What makes him in your eyes clearly better than anyone else?

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

[kev martin 9,859]

We have been shown to have a soft belly, at times lacking will power, and ruthlessness. 

 We are very much a momentum team. When not going our way we struggle to get it back on our terms.

It is our brand and culture that Goody has struggled with. His attempt to express what we stand for strikes me more as about hope then reality.

If Goody goes and he walks into a club (many would have him) with strong values then his job would have to be easier.

He works hard to get them playing for the jumper etcetera. It just takes time, persistence, and resilience to bolster our culture. Ever tried to change your personality. That is what he is up against. 

Stick with him, he is good for the club. If our brand doesn't change then it is not on him but on the entire organisation. 

Harden up MFC.

[Demonsone 2,037]

26 minutes ago, Heart Beats True said:

They’ve won one but been there more times than Goodwin has. Tell me why he’s better than any other coach at people management? What makes him in your eyes clearly better than anyone else?

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

[Demonsone 2,037]

28 minutes ago, Heart Beats True said:

They’ve won one but been there more times than Goodwin has. Tell me why he’s better than any other coach at people management? What makes him in your eyes clearly better than anyone else?

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

[Demonsone 2,037]

29 minutes ago, Heart Beats True said:

They’ve won one but been there more times than Goodwin has. Tell me why he’s better than any other coach at people management? What makes him in your eyes clearly better than anyone else?

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

[Demonsone 2,037]

29 minutes ago, Heart Beats True said:

They’ve won one but been there more times than Goodwin has. Tell me why he’s better than any other coach at people management? What makes him in your eyes clearly better than anyone else?

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

[Heart Beats True 1,218]

1 minute ago, Demonsone said:

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

I think you’ve made your point 🤣

[Sir Why You Little 37,016]

34 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

And Mr Recruiter, was there any available or do you just want to throw money around in the hope it works. Strange that all the good senior players are on long term deals don't you think. And any suggestions?

So it’s all smooth sailing then Saty

As long as you are happy….

Our Trading has been atrocious since 2020

They are all Casey Standard Players, you cannot argue that. 
Other Clubs Top up regularly, but we can’t do it 

[Demonsone 2,037]

36 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

How long has Longmire been at Sydney and how many flags have they won under him? 

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

[DeeZone 9,812]

13 minutes ago, Demonsone said:

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

Demonsone are you deliberately reposting the same post or do you have a glitch in your pc????

[Boots and all 1,000]

I think we place too much emphasis on injuries overall. Most teams have a lengthy injury list during at least part of the season. Some have horror runs but ours was OK. I think depth and gamestyle is our problem. Specifically, we don't have depth in the playing ranks that can deliver a contested gameplan so we are in the process of altering our gamestyle but we are in transition and not the finished product.

Edited August 3 by Boots and all

[Gorgoroth 12,942]

I'm not and never have loved Goodwin, but he won't go and we prob shouldn't sack him either.

Stafford must go, even if it's to full time ruck coach but we need a proper forwards coach and tbh I'd love Chaplin on too. Backline has gone backwards and it's as predictable as a May kick in.

[Demonsone 2,037]

7 minutes ago, DeeZone said:

Demonsone are you deliberately reposting the same post or do you have a glitch in your pc????

Must be a glitch .. 

[Sir Why You Little 37,016]

10 minutes ago, Gorgoroth said:

I'm not and never have loved Goodwin, but he won't go and we prob shouldn't sack him either.

Stafford must go, even if it's to full time ruck coach but we need a proper forwards coach and tbh I'd love Chaplin on too. Backline has gone backwards and it's as predictable as a May kick in.

I don’t think Goodwin will go either, but this continuous push for “Contest & Defence” has gone too far. They are important elements, but the balance is out of alignment 
We need to get Run and Flair into the side. Look at the way GW$ carved us up wide on the ‘G

and a Key Forward, maybe JVR or Jefferson will be going forward, but i still think we need to Trade in a Forward for 2025

Fullarton, Schache and McAdam gave us a big zero 

I think the whole Club needs a fresh start, last off season was a very bad time

Edited August 3 by Sir Why You Little

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,601]

2 hours ago, Deemania since 56 said:

I still hold the opinion that the mindsets of Clarrie, Gawn, Tracca and Viney, coming onto the ground after half-time in a little puddle of conversation and gesturing, won us the flag, ignoring Badloss' directions and making the play to a glorious victory from their own wisdom, guts and bravery, and determination to rip the far Ken game apart. 

So you are saying that Goodwin did not want Jackwon to replace Gawn in the third quarter? Has that been confirmed and verified?

[Adam The God 30,216]

36 minutes ago, Demonsone said:

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

You do realise that Sydney not only have had the COLA salary cap bonuses, they've got academy accesses that has enabled them to grab pretty much all their elite players (captain Mills, Heeney, Gulden and Blakey are all academy).

Like imagine if we'd just needed a bunch of junk picks to pick up those 4.

Comparing the QLD and NSW list management builds to any other club is ridiculous and not comparing apples with apples.

As for Geelong and Collingwood, they've had at least 2 champions each in the 21st century that were father sons. That's luck. Not real list management. 

Compare that with us. We've had one in Viney.

[Sir Why You Little 37,016]

5 minutes ago, Norm Smith's Curse said:

So you are saying that Goodwin did not want Jackwon to replace Gawn in the third quarter? Has that been confirmed and verified?

Gawn told Goodwin to leave Jackson on in the middle during the 3rd, whilst Max was on the Bench 

[Jaded No More 68,880]

1 hour ago, Heart Beats True said:

They’ve won one but been there more times than Goodwin has. Tell me why he’s better than any other coach at people management? What makes him in your eyes clearly better than anyone else?

Because we rarely lose any player we want to keep, and that includes players who have strong family connections interstate. Every man and his dog would have lost their mind if Kosi left. He stayed categorically because of Goodwin. 
 

Longmire has been at Sydney a lot longer than Goody has been at Melbourne. He also inherited a premiership list, not cellar dwellers. Under Longmire Sydney won one singular flag and been smashed in more than one grand final. 
Yet he’s universally considered one of the best coaches in the game. 
Scott won a flag the year he became coach with virtually the same list that won two flags already. It then took him a decade to get another one. Again he’s considered one of the very best. How often did Geelong get done in prelims?
 

And let’s not forget the insane advantages that both Scott and Longmire have at their disposal, from home ground advantage to academy picks. 
If we got to play at Casey every week and had access to the best Victorian talent for peanuts every year, we too would be constantly pushing for flags under Goodwin. 

History will show that Goodwin has won a flag and got us two top 4 finishes in a 3 year period. For a variety of reasons this season has gone pear shaped. So of course we need to make changes and review both the list and the FD. But to suggest Goodwin needs to be thrown out is simply idiotic.

For anyone who wants him gone, please can you tell us who is available that will come in and do better? 

[Jaded No More 68,880]

49 minutes ago, Demonsone said:

Longmire 1 x flag 3 x GF losses host of finals a lot more though 13 seasons vs 8, need to look deeper at their recruiting the Swans getting older players is excellent and highlights their quality recruiters/ list mgrs … not sure what Taylor & Lamb strategy has been since 21 as our u23s are great but scratch your head at the older players traded in and what we let go… Is this Goodwin doing???

You might want to look at Sydney’s list and review how many of their best players were gifted to them via academy picks for the low low price of SFA. They are not winning a flag because of JJ or Adams or even Grundy. 

We managed to get May, Lever and Langdon under Goody and they delivered us a flag. Let’s also not forget that we got Grundy too. It didn’t work out, but clearly Grundy was impressed enough to come to us over a host of other clubs who were interested. 
 

As for JT, given the draft picks we’ve had at our disposal since 2021, he’s done pretty damn well. JVR, McVee, Disco, Windsor, just to name a few are all best or close to best 22. Not bad considering of those only one was a top 10 pick. 

Edited August 3 by Jaded No More

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,601]

Trades post flag:

2022:

- Bedford out for pick 44 

- Jackson out for pick swap and pick 13

- Weids out for pick 37

- Grundy in for pick 27

- Hunter and Schache in for 3rd and 4th rounders. 

= lost a small forward, a forward and a tall ruck/forward, gained an aged winger and some decent picks

2023:

- Jordan out as free agent

- Harmes out for third rounder

- Brayshaw out retired

- Grundy out for pick 46

- Fullarton in for pick 47

- McAdam in for a second rounder

- Billings in for a third rounder

= lost three midfielders and Brayshaw's linking up role from the back half. Gained a ruck who does not seem likely to make it, a forward who hasnt shown much at all so far and a depth player that is a downgrade on Jordan or Harmes.