32 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

I am not surprised he wasn't involved, not sure why you are

We did nearly fold years ago

This is business now, it is 2018, not meat raffles any more

I asked him a direct question and got a direct answer, trust him not to [censored] to me, which was the case

 

Missed the point again. Let's move on chap

Edited June 30, 20186 yr by Moonshadow

38 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Why do you need a presser?

it was all done with a cuppa last week

I know where this is leading but I will persist.

Because that was not an official club communication or press release. No one outside the club's four walls observed it.

I don't want fireworks, marching bands or animatronic robots. Just a picture of him in a club tie or polo shirt, a few words and then he can disappear into the mist until PJ needs him to return for the handover.

It's almost been like he has been announced as an after thought by the club with the bulk of the coverage coming from the media. Whatever statements we've heard have been from Bartlett and they have been in non club forums (i.e. SEN)

Edited June 30, 20186 yr by Colin B. Flaubert

Just now, Colin B. Flaubert said:

I know where this is leading but I will persist.

Because that was not an official club communication or press release. No one outside the club's four walls observed it.

I don't want fireworks, marching bands or animatronic robots. Just a picture of him in a club tie or polo shirt, a few words and then he can disappear into the mist until PJ needs him to return for the handover.

But he hasn’t started yet. There is still 3 months to go. 

Why have a press conference when Wilson can sit there and fire her agenda on camera.? 

It’s a club decision that has been made, i am more than happy with that

Pert has an excellent CV

Cool

38 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Missed the point again. Let's move on chap

I know your point, you were surprised why Jackson wasn't involved, the Board picks the CEO, they make seek informal advice from the incumbent if required, but they pick, same as any business, as soon as PJ told me he had no input, not surprised with Bartlett's words

I can't understand why you are surprised, I am surprised by the fact that you don't seem to think the club is a business any more, when everybody from the Chairman uses the words "the industry we are in", not the sport

16 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

But he hasn’t started yet. There is still 3 months to go.

It’s a club decision that has been made, i am more than happy with that

And I bet you will be the first one to do your cruet if things go south.

The reason being is that you should get ahead of the story and set the narrative (that is if you have nothing to hide). Caro couldn't force 'an agenda' on us during PJ's reign as she had nothing to work with. Now with a vacuum created, she is able to fill in the gaps.

5 minutes ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

And I bet you will be the first one to do your cruet if things go south.

The reason being is that you should get ahead of the story and set the narrative (that is if you have nothing to hide). Caro couldn't force 'an agenda' on us during PJ's reign as she had nothing to work with. Now with a vacuum created, she is able to fill in the gaps.

After the way Wilson wrote about the MFC a few years back, i wouldn’t let her in the door. The Age is a piece of junk anyway sadly. 

Why did you make that first statement??

Are you angry at how CS was treated? He deserved to be run out of town

Gary Pert is a real operator, if he fails to get the club firing, we are cooked. 

I don’t think that will happen at all

16 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

 

Why did you make that first statement??

Are you angry at how CS was treated? He deserved to be run out of town

Just look at any time we have hit a slump of some sort, you dead set go off your noodle. When it comes to this however, you never ask the hard questions and it's all rainbows and sunshine (see also: when we win by more than 8 goals).

There's negativity for negativity's sake and  who knows? Maybe the appointment does work out (which I hope it does). However as @ProDee has said, it's delusional to think the club can do no wrong. 

The second part is just plain silly. Read any of my posts from 2012 onwards and you will get a clear picture of what I thought of that bunch.

1 minute ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

Just look at any time we have hit a slump of some sort, you dead set go off your noodle. When it comes to this however, you never ask the hard questions and it's all rainbows and sunshine (see also: when we win by more than 8 goals).

There's negativity for negativity's sake and  who knows? Maybe the appointment does work out (which I hope it does). However as @ProDee has said, it's delusional to think the club can do no wrong. 

The second part is just plain silly. Read any of my posts from 2012 onwards and you will get a clear picture of what I thought of that bunch.

I have never said the club could do no wrong on this appointment, i don’t know if it’s the right decision, i have said that earlier in this thread. 

BUT Pert has a dam good CV at both The Filth and at Austereo (Radio is more cut throat than AFL, i assure you) so i will back him in at this stage, without bells and whistle’s thankyou. 

Who has a better CV for what this club needs right now?

We need to grow on and off field right now,  Sponsors and Real Estate are needed. 

Pert is the man to do that job, as well as standing firm within the AFL. No more being pushed around

11 years he drove the Filth, at least 8 of those highly successful.

Working with Eddie is not easy, i know cameramen and Sound Recordists who had to put up with his behavior during the late 80’s and early 90’s when he ws at ch 10

We don’t need internal appointments right now. We still need outside blood

3 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

I know your point, you were surprised why Jackson wasn't involved, the Board picks the CEO, they make seek informal advice from the incumbent if required, but they pick, same as any business, as soon as PJ told me he had no input, not surprised with Bartlett's words

I can't understand why you are surprised, I am surprised by the fact that you don't seem to think the club is a business any more, when everybody from the Chairman uses the words "the industry we are in", not the sport

The industry they are in is football, not a share price, dividend driven market. And yes, they still do the equivalent to meat raffles, eg. Silent auctions for wine, jumpers, president lunches, etc. CEOs in real business don't do that. Missed the point again. Keep going if you wish. I'm out.

Edited June 30, 20186 yr by Moonshadow

2 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

The industry they are in is football, not a share price, dividend driven market. And yes, they still do the equivalent to meat raffles, eg. Silent auctions for wine, jumpers, president lunches, etc. CEOs in real business don't do that. Missed the point again. Keep going if you wish. I'm out.

Shares      let me,  43000 shareholders?

I reckon it's a terrific appointment and I'm chuffed that we've got someone as good as Pert as our CEO.  I honestly don't understand the angst & unease. 

So what if there was fall-out at Collingwood - what do people expect with the massive ego's involved?  To me,  that conflict just stands to reason and what's wrong with a bit of conflict anyway?  It's often how things get done.

Pert oversaw a highly successful period at the Pies over a long period of time and now he's ours.  We should be so lucky. 

Ignore the noise.

I have such an absolute unhealthy disdain for Caro that I'd be banned for life if I shared my true feelings on Demonland. But while she could have perhaps touched a little bit more on the rationale for Pert's recruitment, I don't have a problem with this article at all. In fact, it shed some light on a few things that were giving off an uncomfortable vibe (the silence from AFL HQ etc.) and I actually feel better and more confident about the appointment for having read it. Two in a row, including the camp article. 

21 hours ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

But part of my question is why has Pert at the least not done a token press conference? I bet you London to a brick that had an internal candidate been appointed, there would have been some photo of him sporting a club tie and posing in front of a club backdrop.

Pert has been hidden away like Kane before the Undertaker's hell in a cell match against Shawn Michaels in 1997 (old school wrestling fans will appreciate that reference).

If his entrance is as remarkable as Kane's was I'll forgive him. Perhaps he will make his debut at the MCG one week after the GF during the Undertaker/Triple H match?

6 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

If his entrance is as remarkable as Kane's was I'll forgive him. Perhaps he will make his debut at the MCG one week after the GF during the Undertaker/Triple H match?

I believe the plan is for Glenn Bartlett to scream at an indignant Josh Mahoney 'He's ALIVE! PERTY'S ALIVE!' 

However, Glenn needs to put on at least 70kg for this to have the desired effect.

13 hours ago, Macca said:

So what if there was fall-out at Collingwood - what do people expect with the massive ego's involved?  To me,  that conflict just stands to reason and what's wrong with a bit of conflict anyway?  It's often how things get done.

I think there is room to ask questions but I reckon he shouldn't be written off over it.

It really does depend on if lessons were learned at Collingwood by Perty. If so, and the proof of the pudding will be in its eating, then it will be a great appointment.

It depends if he is PJ or CS on his second time around. PJ, thankfully, realized that he was getting tetchy when he finished up at Essendon and that the replacement of Sheeds could have been better in that he was going on about only getting someone with a 'record of success'. He then proceeded to hire Matty Knights, who didn't have the profile to step into those shoes, wasn't being pursued by anyone else with much vigor and came from Richmond when they were in their lowest trough. Second time around, he made sure he delivered what he promised when headhunting a coach (even if he didn't land Roosy, he was at least looking at Rocket and Choco). 

We have covered the baggage CS bought over from Freo that he couldn't off load ad nauseum so won't go over it again.

It would seem to me that Pert shares some of CS's weaknesses but differs in one key area in that he has worked in industries outside AFL. According to what I have heard, he was big on promising a lot on field when the Pies had no chance of backing up what he was saying. He also was allegedly instrumental in splitting up the Rat Pack (which I'm not sure really was his job). Gutting the core of Collingwood's spine while promising to for finishes every year sounds like a recipe for disillusionment (which was part of the reason he was moved on). Add in the fact that he had been there 11 years and he had definitely out stayed his welcome. Especially because of his more demanding and in your face style of leadership.

The noises coming out of the morning tea were promising but I'll still reserve judgement.

Edited July 1, 20186 yr by Colin B. Flaubert

2 minutes ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

I think there is room to ask questions but I reckon he shouldn't be written off over it.

It really does depend on if lessons were learned at Collingwood by Perty. If so, and the proof of the pudding will be in its eating, then it will be a great appointment.

It depends if he is PJ or CS on his second time around. PJ, thankfully, realized that he was getting tetchy when he finished up at Essendon and that the replacement of Sheeds could have been better in that he was going on about only getting someone with a 'record of success'. He then proceeded to hire Matty Knights, who didn't have the profile to step into those shoes, wasn't being pursued by anyone else with much vigor and came from Richmond when they were in their lowest trough. Second time around, he made sure he delivered what he promised when headhunting a coach (even if he didn't land Roosy, he was at least looking at Rocket and Choco). 

We have covered the baggage CS bought over from Freo that he couldn't off load ad nauseum so won't go over it again.

It would seem to me that Pert shares some of CS's weaknesses but differs in one key area in that he has worked in industries outside AFL. According to what I have heard, he was big on promising a lot on field when the Pies had no chance of backing up what he was saying. He also was allegedly instrumental in splitting up the Rat Pack (which I'm not sure really was his job). Gutting the core of Collingwood's spine while promising to for finishes every year sounds like a recipe for disillusionment (which was part of the reason he was moved on). Add in the fact that he had been there 11 years and he had definitely out stayed his welcome. Especially because of his more demanding and on your face style of leadership.

The noises coming out of the morning tea were promising but I'll still reserve judgement.

It wouldn't have mattered who was the CEO at Collingwood ... the ego's involved were always going to lead to finger pointing.  The changover from Malthouse to Buckley was always going to cause fall-out and whilst Eddie knows how to manouevor his way around these things ,  Pert became a casualty of sorts. 

You don't suddenly become a poor CEO after spending so much time being a successful one ... and if you and others recall Col,  the same questions surrounded Jackson when he was first appointed at our club.  That turned out alright. 

19 minutes ago, Macca said:

It wouldn't have mattered who was the CEO at Collingwood ... the ego's involved were always going to lead to finger pointing.  The changover from Malthouse to Buckley was always going to cause fall-out and whilst Eddie knows how to manouevor his way around these things ,  Pert became a casualty of sorts. 

You don't suddenly become a poor CEO after spending so much time being a successful one ... and if you and others recall Col,  the same questions surrounded Jackson when he was first appointed at our club.  That turned out alright. 

That's why I kept the question open Macca and bought up PJ's mishandling of the coaching situation at Essendon.

A good saying I heard once was that going through a rough trot allows you the ability to take the valuable lessons from that time with you and leave the mistakes behind. In essence, you get better the second time around. This could very well be the case with Pert (as it was with PJ).

I'm not trying to dog whistle when I say that we aren't sure if Pert has learned those lessons because I genuinely don't know. Hence my comparison of PJ and CS as to the two paths he could follow. If he has then this appointment could be sensational.

Edited July 1, 20186 yr by Colin B. Flaubert

1 minute ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

That's why I kept the question open Macca and bought up PJ's mishandling of the coaching situation at Essendon.

A good saying I heard once was that going through a rough trot allows you the ability to take the valuable lessons from that time with you and leave the mistakes behind. In essence, you get better the second time around. This could very well be the case with Pert (as it was with PJ).

I'm not trying to dog whistle when I say that we aren't sure if Pert has learned those lessons because I genuinely don't know. Hence my comparison of PJ and CS as to the two paths he could follow. If he has then this appointment could be sensational.

Why are you so convinced that Pert has lessons to learn?  You make it look like he mucked up in a major way.

What major poor decisions did he make?  Minor ones don't count or matter.  No one is perfect.

There's a time to be pessimistic or optimistic.  Right now I believe I'm looking at this appointment as a realist would.  Zero MFCSS involved ?

Right up there with the Jason Taylor appointment ... also from Collingwood.

2 minutes ago, Macca said:

Why are you so convinced that Pert has lessons to learn?  You make it look like he mucked up in a major way.

What major poor decisions did he make?  Minor ones don't count or matter.  No one is perfect.

There's a time to be pessimistic or optimistic.  Right now I believe I'm looking at this appointment as a realist would.  Zero MFCSS involved ?

Right up there with the Jason Taylor appointment ... also from Collingwood.

Clearly by the end what was being promised on the field was not what was being delivered. Every year the promise was that they would finish top four when we all knew they weren't even close to that. I already mentioned the stuff with the Rat Pack earlier. 

The great thing with PJ was that while he never undersold us, he never went off the deep end either by overselling us (in the early days he was downright brutal in his assessment of us). I think that's an example Perty should follow. 

No MFCSS here. I think the appointment can work. Just trying to look at things dispassionately.

1 minute ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

Clearly by the end what was being promised on the field was not what was being delivered. Every year the promise was that they would finish top four when we all knew they weren't even close to that. I already mentioned the stuff with the Rat Pack earlier. 

The great thing with PJ was that while he never undersold us, he never went off the deep end either by overselling us (in the early days he was downright brutal in his assessment of us). I think that's an example Perty should follow. 

No MFCSS here. I think the appointment can work. Just trying to look at things dispassionately.

And I am looking at things dispassionately as well.  By the way,  whilst many here questioned the PJ appointment,  I never did.

And Pert could end up being a step up from PJ too ... in sport;  there's always someone better. 

Unless you're Floyd Mayweather ?

40 minutes ago, Macca said:

And I am looking at things dispassionately as well.  By the way,  whilst many here questioned the PJ appointment,  I never did.

And Pert could end up being a step up from PJ too ... in sport;  there's always someone better. 

Unless you're Floyd Mayweather ?

I think this time around is a fairly different set of circumstances to PJ's appointment.

At the time of 148,  we seriously had called the priest in to perform last rites (an ironic analogy to use for a mostly Protestant elite club). The CEO that the club had gone all in on after 186 (it really did come down to a choice of CS and Bails) could no longer be taken seriously as a mouthpiece of the club. The coach was clearly in over his head and players were looking for life rafts. The financial losses we would have made that year would have been breathtaking had we not reached out to HQ for help. The patient was going to die on the operating table had we not moved fast.

We really had no option but to accept PJ as there aren't a great load of willing candidates available. History showed he was an excellent candidate but he was very much Winston Wolf from Pulp Fiction. I could even imagine him giving that comeback to uncooperative staff members that Harvey Keitel gave John Travolta when he asked for him to be more polite.

That he hung around for 5 years has been a plus but also remember that he was only signed on for six months initially too (hence the Winston Wolf comparison). That was how urgently he was appointed.

The good thing this time around is that we have had time to think. So there is time to be a little circumspect about things. 

Edited July 1, 20186 yr by Colin B. Flaubert

Ah Gary.....could you find us a decent coach....cheers.

1 hour ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

The good thing this time around is that we have had time to think. So there is time to be a little circumspect about things. 

At this rate good old 'Perty' might be having 2nd thoughts!  ?

Not sure if you've got access to the game over there in the land of the rising sun but we've stunk it up today Col.  We'll need a major turnaround to win this game.

 

2 hours ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

That's why I kept the question open Macca and bought up PJ's mishandling of the coaching situation at Essendon.

I'm not at all sure he did mishandle the coaching situation at EFC...subsequent events would say they should have kept with Knights.

By my reckoning we haven't won a game since he was announced as the new CEO.

Looks like he's lost the players before he's even started.