Due Diligence

[timD 994]

FMD. I reckon this post and the issue highlighted is like an IQ test in disguise.

This is not about neeld; it is about the way we got him.

Think of it this way: EVERYTHING a footy club does is about people. The product is the quality of footy you play - dependent on the players, their coaches (the footy club culture is mainly a product of the interaction of these two variables) and the facilities. The facilities are dependent on the board and the footy admin (business side).

So, every single thing that you need at a footy club is produced by a person or utterly depedent on a person (or team of them). This makes PEOPLE the most crucial resource of the club.

In my mind this means that, if you want success, you need good people. Maybe great people. How do you get great people? Now, I would presume that this would be different for each area you looked at. However, at the heart of things is that you need an emphasis on how you find, attract and retain great people.

The recruiting of the coach, the firing of DB, the selection of players are all examples of areas where we have failed to have a thorough and/or successful process. If we stuff up the basic business of footy - getting great people - then we are effed.

[Johnny Karate 559]

I too have no issue with Neeld but it's becoming apparent that the process to hire him was pretty flawed. It's frustrating that Ross Lyon was never an option because of Hairy Garry's media career.

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

Can we set the record straight now that NO ONE knew Ross Lyon was moving from St Kilda

His management didn't know (Craig Kelly at ESP)

St Kilda didn't know

the media didn't know

the MFC didnt know

The only people that knew were Fremantle and Ross Lyon. Any discussion about Due dilligance and Ross Lyon is absolute [censored] and people should do thier own due dilligance

[Hardnut 327]

FMD. I reckon this post and the issue highlighted is like an IQ test in disguise.

This is not about neeld; it is about the way we got him.

Think of it this way: EVERYTHING a footy club does is about people. The product is the quality of footy you play - dependent on the players, their coaches (the footy club culture is mainly a product of the interaction of these two variables) and the facilities. The facilities are dependent on the board and the footy admin (business side).

So, every single thing that you need at a footy club is produced by a person or utterly depedent on a person (or team of them). This makes PEOPLE the most crucial resource of the club.

In my mind this means that, if you want success, you need good people. Maybe great people. How do you get great people? Now, I would presume that this would be different for each area you looked at. However, at the heart of things is that you need an emphasis on how you find, attract and retain great people.

The recruiting of the coach, the firing of DB, the selection of players are all examples of areas where we have failed to have a thorough and/or successful process. If we stuff up the basic business of footy - getting great people - then we are effed.

Very well said 'timD' - nailed it in a few lines.

[Johnny Karate 559]

Can we set the record straight now that NO ONE knew Ross Lyon was moving from St Kilda

His management didn't know (Craig Kelly at ESP)

St Kilda didn't know

the media didn't know

the MFC didnt know

The only people that knew were Fremantle and Ross Lyon. Any discussion about Due dilligance and Ross Lyon is absolute [censored] and people should do thier own due dilligance

I'm sure somebody else will pick your post apart. I would, but suspect it might be difficult for you to interpret while you're playing ostrich.

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

Sadly I have to agree with TimD as well......

Off field I am keen to see how McLardy and co deal with keeping/retaining and attarackting sponsors and new opportunities and revenue coming in to keep funding the Footy Department so we have a chance of being a contender again....

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

I'm sure somebody else will pick your post apart. I would, but suspect it might be difficult for you to interpret while you're playing ostrich.

I don't understand your vague refrence....

And I'd like to know how to process was flawed??? - please elborate rather then making smart ass remarks. Any chance of stating some facts?

[King Kunta 97]

Can we set the record straight now that NO ONE knew Ross Lyon was moving from St Kilda

His management didn't know (Craig Kelly at ESP)

St Kilda didn't know

the media didn't know

the MFC didnt know

The only people that knew were Fremantle and Ross Lyon. Any discussion about Due dilligance and Ross Lyon is absolute [censored] and people should do thier own due dilligance

Yes nobody knew he was leaving, but everybody knew he was out of contract and Melbourne FC owe their supporters the due diligence to at least seek him out to see what his intentions were.

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

Yes nobody knew he was leaving, but everybody knew he was out of contract and Melbourne FC owe their supporters the due diligence to at least seek him out to see what his intentions were.

I am not going to waste too much time on this......

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/expert-opinion/did-ross-lyon-reall-decieve-st-kilda/story-fn6cisdj-1226142920349 this article dosen't answer all the questions but hopefully it answers why he was not approached by the MFC

The bloke was contracted until the end of 2012 - why would the MFC approach him???

Fact is R Lyon went behind St Kilda's and his managements back and negotiated a contact with Freo - why Fremantle I can't answer that

[Nasher 33,607]

Can we set the record straight now that NO ONE knew Ross Lyon was moving from St Kilda

His management didn't know (Craig Kelly at ESP)

St Kilda didn't know

the media didn't know

the MFC didnt know

The only people that knew were Fremantle and Ross Lyon. Any discussion about Due dilligance and Ross Lyon is absolute bullshit and people should do thier own due dilligance

Freo managed to work out that he might move if the right buttons were pressed and guess what? They circumvented his manager. No doubt it's a bit dirty - though Ross could just have easily "talk to my manager", but if the opportunity was there then you'd hope we'd have at least explored it. Even if Ross had told us to take a long walk off a short pier, the fact that Freo got him is indication that we should've at least put the feelers out. Clearly we didn't.

[Sir Why You Little 36,987]

I am not going to waste too much time on this......

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/expert-opinion/did-ross-lyon-reall-decieve-st-kilda/story-fn6cisdj-1226142920349 this article dosen't answer all the questions but hopefully it answers why he was not approached by the MFC

The bloke was contracted until the end of 2012 - why would the MFC approach him???

Fact is R Lyon went behind St Kilda's and his managements back and negotiated a contact with Freo - why Fremantle I can't answer that

WA Mining $$$ is why the deal was done. Privately between Freo & Ross.

The MFC are not to blame for this one.

[Nasher 33,607]

The bloke was contracted until the end of 2012 - why would the MFC approach him???

Why would Fremantle approach him?

[Adam The God 30,130]

Plenty of supporters would be happy that we don't have Ross Lyon as coach, but within the industry he's recognised as being in the top echelon of coaches; and this is evident with how Freo are now playing. I distinctly remember Paul Roos dropping hints when he was On the Couch that Melbourne could do with a coach like Lyon. Then there were unsubstantiated rumours that Lyon was interested in the Melbourne job only for the bombshell to be announced a couple of weeks later that he was going to Freo. Not withstanding our poor showing this year I suspect that Lyon would have preferred to not uproot his family and move halfway across the country. Apparently Garry Lyon was told that Ross would be staying with the Saints; and seeing he and Ross shared the same manager in Craig Kelly he didn't go behind Craig's back and contact Ross directly. Why not ? Weren't we after the best coach we could find ? It seemed to me at the time that Ross Lyon would have been one of the first calls you'd make. It had been in the media that he hadn't re-signed with St.Kilda so you at least had to make direct contact and ask the question. Or even make him an offer he'd find hard to refuse. Whether Demonland posters personally wanted Ross, or not makes no difference to the process we should have followed.

Now I hear on the radio tonight from Mark Robinson that he was chatting to Leigh Matthews recently who revealed that Melbourne didn't contact him at all. Not even a phone call. At the time there was speculation that Leigh could have almost been cajoled into the job. Shouldn't we have at least made contact ?

I don't want to pot Garry Lyon, because I respect him as a dedicated Melbourne person and know that he was a reluctant participant in finding a coach having previously stated that he didn't want be involved again. He'd been there and done that with Bailey. But he wasn't the only one on the committee.

WTF is going on down at Melbourne ?

Matthews is too old. While the players were told their new coach was Ross Lyon, only for him to be appointed at Freo and then Neeld to be instated the very next day.

I'd say Lyon took the biggest pay packet and stronger list in Freo.

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

Why would Fremantle approach him?

I've been told he approached Freo and it had a lot to do with cash which Freo have. People on here were balking at the money Cloke is being offered - i have heard Freo offered him similar money to coach.

Thats all i really know and care to elborate on..

I don't disagree the MFC could have chased harder if they were genuinely interested.... I do not agree the MFC were careless in respect to R Lyon. I also don't think R lyon would have come to the MFC due to the list and he wouldn't have gotten the money he was after

[Sir Why You Little 36,987]

Why would Fremantle approach him?

Big $$$ talks & Ross was in big debt.

[daisycutter 29,604]

Why would Fremantle approach him?

which raises the question. did freo do due diligence? by all accounts they didn't talk to anyone other than Lyons

if we had done what freo did would we still be arguing about due diligence?

i just dunno

[King Kunta 97]

I am not going to waste too much time on this......

http://www.heraldsun...j-1226142920349 this article dosen't answer all the questions but hopefully it answers why he was not approached by the MFC

The bloke was contracted until the end of 2012 - why would the MFC approach him???

Fact is R Lyon went behind St Kilda's and his managements back and negotiated a contact with Freo - why Fremantle I can't answer that

St kilda wanted to give him a contract extension and he wasn't willing to sign, plus the fact he had a contract clause allowing him to leave practically meant he was on the market.

Have a read

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/lyon-to-honour-saints-contract-20110913-1k7w8.html

Garry even talks him up yet fails to make contact that shows signs of ineptitude.

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

I don't disagree with what you are saying New Age hipster,

Did we do the wrong thing??????????? That is a very hard to answer..... We approached his management and were rejected - is that not due dilligance?? The problem with the R Lyon situation is that he went behind everyones back to get the Freo job. He didn't even tell his manager.... He told his manager he inteded to stay at St Kilda... not sure what else the MFC could do as it was R Lyon who approached Freo.

I personally don't feel R Lyon wouldn't have come to our club anyway - he was chasing $$$ and Freo offered him $ and a decent list.

[fuchsia 37]

Malthouse is massively overrated in my opinion. 1flag in 15 years, and with the cattle he had at collingwood?

Considering the midfield of pendlebry swan and thomas with cloke and dawes (in good form) as well as the plethora of support players he had and i reckon he underperformed over the last few years.

Even freo has the likes of pavlich sandilands...they may only be 2stars but name the 2bona fide match winners on melbournes list.

Give neeld a chance to put together a list of his own and then hurl you stones from the cheap seats if you still feel the need

GOOD COMMENT...thought i was alone ..

all this kowtowing to infantile media hyped headlines come soap opera is embarrassing...

malthouse had over 10 years at the highest MONEY bagged club WITHOUT success.;was being sacked when planets aligned through swan pend. thomas..

west c. were the only club in town when he got job.( what money,players did he have at disposal?)

what results did he get at WB.?

malthouse is brilliant at playing the media for his own gain.he only cares about himself & what he can manipulate.

hypocrite , liar,drama queen;;

what did sheedy rightfully comment ; he is a genius to be at a club for 16 years ( col & wc ) with NO result.

[timD 994]

Very well said 'timD' - nailed it in a few lines.

Thanks Hardnut - though I have to say that the post is the result of a lot of thought about stuff that I know I only know a small amount about.

What I don't get is why it took me so long to see this?

We might not get great players but a system/philosophy/method/emphasis needs to exist so that we maximise our chances. So to with every 'line' or 'staff' position.

And it is this devotion to 'excellence in process' that the board, admin and FD need to embody. So when things work we'll know why...and when things fail we'll know why. I'd guess that things are not always going to work no matter what you do. However, if you can figure out why, you are able to make change that are based on real insight rather than emotion, moment-to-moment fashions, groupthink etc.

[Deers 202]

When you have Garry Lyon around the club, one is blinded by the notion that everyone is a "good bloke" or a "superstar".

[censored] good footballing people or good business people.

[rpfc 28,265]

which raises the question. did freo do due diligence? by all accounts they didn't talk to anyone other than Lyons

if we had done what freo did would we still be arguing about due diligence?

i just dunno

Well, there is an interesting point.

Freo surreptitiously headhunted the head coach of another team.

Is that the 'right' process?

What is the 'right' process?

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

It's called buying out a contract.

Malthouse is barely 60, compare that to sir Alex ferguson who is approaching 70. If you think Malthouse will only coach for 3-4 years that's your opinion. He may not even coach at all but I wouldnt put limitations on what he is capable of.

You're really bonkers man.

Buying out contracts?! Cop a tip, we're not Man U.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

In my mind this means that, if you want success, you need good people. Maybe great people. How do you get great people? Now, I would presume that this would be different for each area you looked at. However, at the heart of things is that you need an emphasis on how you find, attract and retain great people.

The recruiting of the coach, the firing of DB, the selection of players are all examples of areas where we have failed to have a thorough and/or successful process. If we stuff up the basic business of footy - getting great people - then we are effed.

Well said. And it covers other off field areas as well of the Football Club that we have not done well.

[Jaded No More 68,867]

Paul Roos said he'd be available to coach again in 2014 when his son finishes school.

If we don't pursue that sh*t, we're fools. Just saying.