Clash jumper 2011

[OPETH 0]

I wonder if my email prompted the response

It was good to get such a comprehensive explanation of the club's thinking. For a long time we have laboured over a lack of detail both from the AFL and the club, so we have had to speculate on a lot of issues. At least now we have a better framework for future discussions.

I look forward to the release of our new clash jumper. Then might be a good time for further robust discussion, eh.

Haha, don't take all the credit! I twitted him last night, and as usual he responds within minutes. Very good on the Twitter. Have a look at our tweets

Edited November 23, 2010 by OPETH

[daisycutter 29,737]

Haha, don't take all the credit! I twitted him last night, and as usual he responds within minutes. Very good on the Twitter. Have a look at our tweets

Haha, ok, you can take the credit then. Still, nice to know that supporters at MFC are not just numbers.

[Red Sox 2]

Nice update from CS.

The navy shorts as an addition certainly will look much better.

[titan_uranus 25,043]

I thought it was worth clarifying a few things.

Firstly, it is the AFL who decrees the need for clash jumpers.

As far as I am aware, they have never stated that they need be white, although that is a preference, consistent with other sports, particularly in the US. You might remember a few years ago, St Kilda had a yellow clash jumper.

A red jumper still clashes with some clubs, which requires us to have three jumpers. In 2009 year we wore our traditional jumper, a red jumper and a white jumper. In 2010, we had the traditional strip, and the white jumper.

Red is therefore not an option. As far as I’m concerned, a predominately red jumper is still not a Melbourne jumper.

Simply, a clash jumper can’t clash. For the same reason, the royal blue Melbourne jumper doesn’t work, and given that we managed to wear the jumper for 12 years and not make finals, it is not held in any esteem.

Given the lack of contrast, we are required to add a non-MFC colour into the design, which is the most disappointing aspect of this issue. We have chosen white.

Personally, I don’t support clash jumpers, particularly for the original clubs. I think clashes are generally overrated. I don’t think people have difficulty with Melbourne vs Essendon/Carlton/Brisbane/Port, and now with Freo taking red out of their strip, I doubt whether that is now a clash. We will continue to argue this.

In some cases, clashes are the result of clubs changing their designs and/or new clubs entering the competition. This was an issue when I was at Freo, and the club happily created the white jumper, which was very popular with Freo supporters.

Collingwood is a non-issue in this debate, and a distraction. Apart from North, they are able to manage their situation with their alternate white back, black back options. Essendon is different, and they shouldn’t be exempted from any requirement to have an alternate strip although I can understand why they have stood firm. Unfortunately, we didn’t make this stand a few years back but neither did most clubs.

Our new clash strip will be predominately white; the design is far more traditional and will be released shortly. It has an MCC feel about it, remembering that the MCC colours are navy, red and white. No cartoon characters. We will argue for navy shorts, and we will also argue that we shouldn’t have to wear it often, if at all.

There you go.

Thanks Cam.

If that logic regarding white doesn't finally make people shut up, nothing will.

I like the move away from 'cartoon characters', which I presume is a reference to the current design, which isn't terribly popular. A simple white jumper with a blue/red yoke would suffice.

[daisycutter 29,737]

Thanks Cam.

If that logic regarding white doesn't finally make people shut up, nothing will.

I like the move away from 'cartoon characters', which I presume is a reference to the current design, which isn't terribly popular. A simple white jumper with a blue/red yoke would suffice.

Really? Didn't you read too closely?

and we will also argue that we should'nt have to wear it often, if at all.

Doesn't sound like an endorsement to me - just a matter of practicalities within current interpretations

But YMMV

Edit: spelling

Edited November 23, 2010 by daisycutter

[Hobbits's 17]

I would like to see him explain the Carton situation,

or perhaps his lap dog Mr. A

i would like them to explain the "carton" situation as well. The Judd & VISY partnership.

[daisycutter 29,737]

OK,for those interested, here is the reply from club (GC may not be decided yet?)

Hello XXXXX,

The clubs that the AFL deem we clash with are:

Adelaide

Port Adelaide

Brisbane

Fremantle

St Kilda

Essendon

Western Bulldogs

Carlton

Kind Regards,

Maddie

Maddie Stewart | Customer Relations

Half the competition.

[rpfc 28,769]

OK,for those interested, here is the reply from club (GC may not be decided yet?)

Half the competition.

Which is one of the reasons why I would prefer the white as it would mean one bastardisation and not two.

And I agree that if if Cam can negotiate out of clashes with Freo, GC, Lions, then we may only have to wear it a couple of times a year.

[Hobbits's 17]

OK,for those interested, here is the reply from club (GC may not be decided yet?)

Half the competition.

western bulldogs ? port adeliade ? carlton ?

give me a break ! what is adrian anderson actually doing ?

Edited November 23, 2010 by Grimes to Watts

[rpfc 28,769]

western bulldogs ? port adeliade ? carlton ?

give me a break ! what is adrian anderson actually doing ?

If we want our navy blue from the past - which is something Cam has said we will get to - we are going to clash with PA and Carlton. Brad Miller tackled Matty Whelan at OO one afternoon...

And the WB have both our colours.

I really think you have missed the mark with this post.

[titan_uranus 25,043]

Really? Didn't you read too closely?

Doesn't sound like an endorsement to me - just a matter of practicalities within current interpretations

But YMMV

Yes, I did read closely.

He says we don't like wearing a clash strip.

He doesn't say we don't like wearing white specifically.

White is the only option for a clash strip we have to have. We don't want one, we'd prefer not to wear one, but given that it's not our decision, white is the colour of the clash strip.

[Hobbits's 17]

If we want our navy blue from the past - which is something Cam has said we will get to - we are going to clash with PA and Carlton. Brad Miller tackled Matty Whelan at OO one afternoon...

And the WB have both our colours.

I really think you have missed the mark with this post.

ok. maybe it is my point of frustration that may have missed the mark. Piont is if accepted, it will be far more than just a couple of games a year wearing the clash jumper based on the post above of the clubs listed. 8 clubs.

Edited November 23, 2010 by Grimes to Watts

[beelzebub 23,383]

Ive come to accept we need to have white. Big of me no doubt some will say and who cares others. All fair comments. Im just voicing my thoughts as I like a handful of others here have been dallying with ideas for years on this forum.

Cam tells a good account. Im glad to hear it will have a MCC feel. Im wondering if it wil be along those lines Clint Biscuit , I and a few others toyed with some whiles back. Looking forward to seeing them. I have faith they will look like a decent FOOTY jumper with heritage origins entirely suitable for this great club of ours.

I do like that he ( CS) desires dark shorts as I just dont like the all white look for us.

Funny , we, as a club were told we had no brand. Seems we do

[The Jacks 0]

Daisy Cutters is the kind of thing I've been asking for a while.

Having to wear white shorts when playing as the 'away' team, regardless of what the 'home' team is wearing makes absolutely no sense. I feel the same way about having to wear a predominantly white clash jumper.

Surely teams can wear their home jumper (and shorts and socks) in away games if there is no clash with the 'home' team. For games where the 'away' team has a clash with the 'home' team, surely they can design a uniform that is designed not to clash with those 'home' teams. Not sure what the jumper being white has to do with anything.

Who do we clash with, even "loose" clashes?

Adelaide - could easily wear daisycutters "reverse", mainly red jumper with mainly red shorts & sock

Brisbane - I think our home uniform is fine, maybe wear different socks if they clash with Brisbane's (not sure if they do)

Carlton - Reverse uniform

Essendon - reverse uniform

Fremantle - reverse uniform

Bulldogs - reverse uniform

Richmond - white shorts and we're fine

West Coast - reverse uniform

That's fine isn't it?

Richmond

[daisycutter 29,737]

Daisy Cutters is the kind of thing I've been asking for a while.

Having to wear white shorts when playing as the 'away' team, regardless of what the 'home' team is wearing makes absolutely no sense. I feel the same way about having to wear a predominantly white clash jumper.

Surely teams can wear their home jumper (and shorts and socks) in away games if there is no clash with the 'home' team. For games where the 'away' team has a clash with the 'home' team, surely they can design a uniform that is designed not to clash with those 'home' teams. Not sure what the jumper being white has to do with anything.

Who do we clash with, even "loose" clashes?

Adelaide - could easily wear daisycutters "reverse", mainly red jumper with mainly red shorts & sock

Brisbane - I think our home uniform is fine, maybe wear different socks if they clash with Brisbane's (not sure if they do)

Carlton - Reverse uniform

Essendon - reverse uniform

Fremantle - reverse uniform

Bulldogs - reverse uniform

Richmond - white shorts and we're fine

West Coast - reverse uniform

That's fine isn't it?

Richmond

Jack, the powers to be think the reverse jumper is still too dark. We were made to change the red clash strip of a few years ago because it was seen as too dark and red still clashed with other teams red. We may have a different view but today it won't float

The ultimate solution would be no clashes, play home strip always like we did for a 100 years when grounds were muddier, no lights were employed etc. The "clash" lobby has power at the moment but at least Cam says it is being challenged. Little steps at a time.

[rpfc 28,769]

Daisy Cutters is the kind of thing I've been asking for a while.

Having to wear white shorts when playing as the 'away' team, regardless of what the 'home' team is wearing makes absolutely no sense. I feel the same way about having to wear a predominantly white clash jumper.

Surely teams can wear their home jumper (and shorts and socks) in away games if there is no clash with the 'home' team. For games where the 'away' team has a clash with the 'home' team, surely they can design a uniform that is designed not to clash with those 'home' teams. Not sure what the jumper being white has to do with anything.

Who do we clash with, even "loose" clashes?

Adelaide - could easily wear daisycutters "reverse", mainly red jumper with mainly red shorts & sock

Brisbane - I think our home uniform is fine, maybe wear different socks if they clash with Brisbane's (not sure if they do)

Carlton - Reverse uniform

Essendon - reverse uniform

Fremantle - reverse uniform

Bulldogs - reverse uniform

Richmond - white shorts and we're fine

West Coast - reverse uniform

That's fine isn't it?

Richmond

I reject most of that. I'm sorry.

The 'reverse uniform' is a bastardisation of our guernsey and it wouldn't alleviate all clashes and therefore we would need a second bastardisation - most likely white.

Let's get the one white guernsey, wear it fleetingly, and finish top so we don't have to wear it in finals.

[rpfc 28,769]

The ultimate solution would be no clashes, play home strip always like we did for a 100 years when grounds were muddier, no lights were employed etc. The "clash" lobby has power at the moment but at least Cam says it is being challenged. Little steps at a time.

The 'clash lobby'?

I hope you are being flippant.

Sports all over the world have clash guernseys and we would have one of those sports that is the most in need of differentiating between teams.

And the historical - we played for 100 years with no problems - doesn't fly because the game is quicker than it has ever been.

It's no longer 'one-on-one, get it and turn around and bomb it' footy. It is either overpopulated scrums, or incredibly quick handball and short passing.

[old dee 23,871]

I reject most of that. I'm sorry.

The 'reverse uniform' is a bastardisation of our guernsey and it wouldn't alleviate all clashes and therefore we would need a second bastardisation - most likely white.

Let's get the one white guernsey, wear it fleetingly, and finish top so we don't have to wear it in finals.

You have my vote especially that last bit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[old dee 23,871]

old dee, it was always going to be white, at least for the short/medium term. I am a realist underneath

I thought there were plenty of positives though

1. Navy shorts (maybe). This has a big impact on % of white

2. Reduced number of clash definitions (maybe) working towards none

3. No cartoon like graphics

I would consider these significant "wins", but then I'm a glass half-full kinda guy

I wonder if my email prompted the response

It was good to get such a comprehensive explanation of the club's thinking. For a long time we have laboured over a lack of detail both from the AFL and the club, so we have had to speculate on a lot of issues. At least now we have a better framework for future discussions.

I look forward to the release of our new clash jumper. Then might be a good time for further robust discussion, eh.

Thanks Daisycutter I think I always knew that.

Agree with you on above.

I hope this is my last comment on this theme.

Lets get on with winning our next flag

Go Dees

[daisycutter 29,737]

The 'clash lobby'?

I hope you are being flippant.

Sports all over the world have clash guernseys and we would have one of those sports that is the most in need of differentiating between teams.

And the historical - we played for 100 years with no problems - doesn't fly because the game is quicker than it has ever been.

It's no longer 'one-on-one, get it and turn around and bomb it' footy. It is either overpopulated scrums, or incredibly quick handball and short passing.

maybe exaggerating a tad. Point was that the "clash" lobby have gone overboard and see clashes everywhere even where there isn't any significant clash. I thought cam made that point too

[titan_uranus 25,043]

maybe exaggerating a tad. Point was that the "clash" lobby have gone overboard and see clashes everywhere even where there isn't any significant clash. I thought cam made that point too

Maybe this point is valid. I don't agree with all the clashes the AFL proposes.

To me the worst ones don't even involve us. Collingwood-North, North-Geelong, Geelong-Collingwood, those are clashes that can be a bit confusing at times.

But we all need to accept the fact that a red clash jumper doesn't cut it, and thus we need a white one.

[rpfc 28,769]

maybe exaggerating a tad. Point was that the "clash" lobby have gone overboard and see clashes everywhere even where there isn't any significant clash. I thought cam made that point too

Yeah, but when we play Carlton away with our new jumpers of dark navy - I think we should wear a clash strip.

I'm not saying we should against Freo, or the Lions, but where there is one clash - there is a need for a clash strip.

[daisycutter 29,737]

Yeah, but when we play Carlton away with our new jumpers of dark navy - I think we should wear a clash strip.

I'm not saying we should against Freo, or the Lions, but where there is one clash - there is a need for a clash strip.

white shorts were always a pretty effective clash strip

yeah I know - being flippant again, but there is some truth in it

Re Carlton, don't you think the presence of red on the front and back of our strip plus red sox would be enough? You could toss in red shorts. Red is a pretty powerful differentiator.

Seriously, I don't see a clash then. Or is it just me?

Edited November 24, 2010 by daisycutter

[beelzebub 23,383]

On one hand all this clashing is somewhat bemusing . God knows how we all managed years ago . How did we ever survive days of muddy grounds ? And yetsomehow we did .

But if the powers that be demand a clash strip and if we for the moment worry less about what others do or don't do in this regard and purely focus on what WE do then it needs to be practical and befitting this great club . I applaud the club for now veering away from the pop-graphic or cartoonish efforts. Let's get it right and stick with it so in time it will become as entrenched and as recognizable as our glorious home guernsey !!

[Summer Blease 0]

You could toss in red shorts.

Only if they have a massive front rise and an elastic waist.

I actually heard that police use red and blue lights because the colour scheme attracts the eye quicker than any other colour.

Make the blue a lighter blue and that is all. Can't we just keep our exact same jumper and lighten the shades to an almost pastel?