These two look very promising but have not seen a lot of Spencer.

Both big units and could really take the Dees to another level.

What do people think of both and will Martin make a great full back? are his disposal skills up to it ?

What do people think?

Martin is being groomed as a tall defender to combat the Franklin like skyscrapers that look like populating forward lines in our current stage of evolution; Spencer has big raps on him as a ruckman/midfielder. Martin played in the ruck a few times at Sandy owing to him being the tallest option available; this has led to a lot of pundits describing him as a ruckman. They seem to not notice that he played in a key defence position any time Jamar/PJ/Spencer was available.

Martin to solidify a key defensive position.

Spencer to be promoted to replace Jamar.

I really like the look of Martin.

I think Martin will continue to develop but think it's likely he may not keep a spot throughout the season.

I'm not sure about Spencer - probably still a fair way off but we should know more at the end of the year.

Spencer sounds like a real tall version of brock mclean.

i have big wraps on martin and im really hoping he turns into a gun backman! and he is only gunna get bigger too

Hi All,

I have seen something different in Martin. I can't stop talking this guy up enough. Balance, speed, height, body size etc etc.

He makes me think back to young bloke with a mop who if correct me if i am wrong started in the backline and ended up the best CHF I have seen (#5).

I was calling all late last year for martin to go forward and will continue to do so.

Who cares if he might kick a lot of points, so did the bloke who kicked a ton last year!

Spencer hopefully will get a chance to show what he can do, I think jamar's career might be on the line this year.

late 2009 onward

FF Davy, Miller, Robbo

HF Martin, Watts, Bate

This forwardline could be the best we have seen in 10yrs at melb. Just need to midfield to supply it

I'm hoping for Martin to settle down into a FB or CHB role, play most of the season and develop physically.

Spencer I don't know much about. I'm not expecting anything, but it'd be nice if he became an AFL standard ruckman so we don't have to rely on Jamar.

I'm not sure about Spencer - probably still a fair way off but we should know more at the end of the year.

Quite a few are saying that Spencer has a lot of potential. If he continues his development we may need to elevate him from the rookie list sooner rather than later. He's a Qld. boy and one or both of the Qld. teams may try to entice him back to the Sunshine State if he looks like making it at the top level.

I'm expecting more games for Martin, down back, perhaps even in the ruck. He may not play as many games as I would like, with the return of Rivers - but that remains to be seen.

As for Spencer, we haven't seen him at AFL level yet, despite him looking very promising at VFL. Prefer to see further improvement and would expect to see him debut at least before the end of the 2009 season finishes if he gets his chance.

late 2009 onward

FF Davy, Miller, Robbo

HF Martin, Watts, Bate

This forwardline could be the best we have seen in 10yrs at melb. Just need to midfield to supply it

FF Maric Watts Davey

HF Miller Martin Sylvia

FF Maric Watts Davey

HF Miller Martin Sylvia

thats a hell of a lot better

FF Maric Watts Davey

HF Miller Martin Sylvia

Probably right re maric v robbo. Sylvia v Bate is interesting, to me sylvia still has a lot to prove but bates runs are on the board. Back to the topic though I think others can see to potential of Martin as a forward more so then as a perm back. Lets hope he gets an opportunity even if its only the preseason games.

The more you read about spencer the better he is sounding.

The more you read about spencer the better he is sounding.

Its all nice in theory, but i'd prefer to be able to say 'the more I SEE of Spencer, the better he is looking...'

FF Maric Watts Davey

HF Miller Martin Sylvia

I'd highly doubt that for late next year though. Miller was looking like he was going deeper last year, so i'd hope if we've got another option up forward like Martin he'd go to CHF and Miller to FF. Can't expect Watts to be a focal point next year either. Hopefully a fitter Sylvia can have more of a Didak/Thomas role at collingwood, which would mean spending more time in the midfield so i'll leave him out. Same deal for Maric, hopefully if he has the tank he can play more as an attacking wingman as opposed to a full time forward, so i've left him out too. A fit Robbo is still in our best side, without Neitz he's our only really proven goal kicker.

All that said, this would be my forward line.

HF Bate Martin Watts

FF Robbo Miller Davey

That gets me excited. It is very tall, but Bate doesn't play up to his height and we'd have player like Maric & Sylvia rotating into the forward line. That HF line is Massive, but they're all big blokes who've got big tanks. I'd expect Watts to maybe take a run on the wing if he plays any games, so the 2 on the flanks could be rotating in short stints on the wing.

I'd highly doubt that for late next year though. Miller was looking like he was going deeper last year, so i'd hope if we've got another option up forward like Martin he'd go to CHF and Miller to FF. Can't expect Watts to be a focal point next year either. Hopefully a fitter Sylvia can have more of a Didak/Thomas role at collingwood, which would mean spending more time in the midfield so i'll leave him out. Same deal for Maric, hopefully if he has the tank he can play more as an attacking wingman as opposed to a full time forward, so i've left him out too. A fit Robbo is still in our best side, without Neitz he's our only really proven goal kicker.

All that said, this would be my forward line.

HF Bate Martin Watts

FF Robbo Miller Davey

That gets me excited. It is very tall, but Bate doesn't play up to his height and we'd have player like Maric & Sylvia rotating into the forward line. That HF line is Massive, but they're all big blokes who've got big tanks. I'd expect Watts to maybe take a run on the wing if he plays any games, so the 2 on the flanks could be rotating in short stints on the wing.

Yeah, I'm still wary of putting Martin at CHF just yet, but i do like the look of this forward line. It has size & potency, & some decent players to rotate in there if you include Wonaemirri too.

But I still prefer having Martin as a gorilla down back.

In 2010 though when hopefully Macnamara has put on some weight...

Yeah, I'm still wary of putting Martin at CHF just yet, but i do like the look of this forward line. It has size & potency, & some decent players to rotate in there if you include Wonaemirri too.

But I still prefer having Martin as a gorilla down back.

In 2010 though when hopefully Macnamara has put on some weight...

I see your point, but Rivers, Garland, Warnok as a core should combat most tall forward lines. So therefore by having martin as well maybe too top heavy for many sides. Therefore it is important to have players that can go to either end be it garland or martin. CG's year in 08 was unbelievable i can only think of 1 bag that was kicked on him and seemed to grow as a leader down there as the year went on. So leave him be and let him take the mantle off scarlett and rutton thus releasing martin or even rivers to go forward. We have to kick goals to win games. Watts will be at least 2 years off from holding a snr spot in the forward line so Miller needs backup in the mean time and the last thing I want to see is PJ there thus allowing MJ to be 1st ruck or MJ as our 2nd tall. Therefore what do we have to loose by giving martin an opportunity to shine up forward in pre-season or early season propper?

if it doesn't work we know martin can play down back anyway.

I see your point, but Rivers, Garland, Warnok as a core should combat most tall forward lines. So therefore by having martin as well maybe too top heavy for many sides. Therefore it is important to have players that can go to either end be it garland or martin. CG's year in 08 was unbelievable i can only think of 1 bag that was kicked on him and seemed to grow as a leader down there as the year went on. So leave him be and let him take the mantle off scarlett and rutton thus releasing martin or even rivers to go forward. We have to kick goals to win games. Watts will be at least 2 years off from holding a snr spot in the forward line so Miller needs backup in the mean time and the last thing I want to see is PJ there thus allowing MJ to be 1st ruck or MJ as our 2nd tall. Therefore what do we have to loose by giving martin an opportunity to shine up forward in pre-season or early season propper?

if it doesn't work we know martin can play down back anyway.

Yeah, the way I see our backline - Martin & Warnock the 2 gorillas to fill the key position spots, Rivers as a 3rd tall and I like Garland playing on a small forward. Then 2 flankers like Grimes & Petterd.

To me, that is a really strong backline and its where we should start.

The forward line will be small but i think ok without him. And if Juice comes along, then...

if juice comes along?

Big question mark in our current side. probably more importantly if our midfield can supply juice on the chest he has a big future. He is a big unit but runs on train rails and cannot turn quick enough. Martin has the x factor that no other big man at melbourne has (PJ excepted) that could do anything and I really feel is wasted in the backline. David Schwarz was the same started back but was always going to be a better forward then back and see some real similarities in them. Body size, balance, leap, can have the ball on a string etc etc............ We need to have more strings in our arsenel

David Schwarz was the same started back but was always going to be a better forward then back and see some real similarities in them. Body size, balance, leap, can have the ball on a string etc etc............ We need to have more strings in our arsenel

No, I don't think Martin and Schwarz have real similarities. Body size maybe. But balance, leap, having a ball on a string definitely not. Did you ever see Schwarz?

No, I don't think Martin and Schwarz have real similarities. Body size maybe. But balance, leap, having a ball on a string definitely not. Did you ever see Schwarz?

I watch him from his early days down back DEFINATELY! and had a #5 on my jumper from not long after that!

forget the champion schwarta turned into look back to the real early days.

Thats why Martin needs a opportunity to show what he could be capable of. Being locked into a backman means he has no opportunity to show what magic he could be capable of unleased in a forward line with high bombs coming in ala 2005-2008. Run, jump and smash packs etc, etc. Keep in mind robbo may never be the same, miller while a very good tall is better on a lead, and juice looks fragile to me.

So the question is of martin????? - yes raw and requires development, but have real similarities to the above, am I seeing something in him that nobody else does?

The more i see of Martin the more he looks capable of playing at Centre Half Forward

I cant compare him to Ox as he was special before his injury but this kid has some key attributes IMO

IMO Martin will be a player who's career is defined by his kick. Seems to have a lot of good aspects, including most importantly a work ethic... but he's very blue-collar. Fits in in defence as a tall cos he won't be required to kick much. As far as that is concerned, I get the feeling sooner or later dees fans will tire of his delivery, no matter how good he is as a spoiler, defender, contest-maker...

I still like him, I just don't know that he's a champion footballer in the making.

IMO Martin will be a player who's career is defined by his kick. Seems to have a lot of good aspects, including most importantly a work ethic... but he's very blue-collar. Fits in in defence as a tall cos he won't be required to kick much. As far as that is concerned, I get the feeling sooner or later dees fans will tire of his delivery, no matter how good he is as a spoiler, defender, contest-maker...

I still like him, I just don't know that he's a champion footballer in the making.

yeah, thats the feeling i get too.

And I'm loathe to put an underdeveloped player with question marks over his disposal in the most important position on the ground.

But then again, if we have another season like this year, we have to try him there. It would at least further his development.

yeah, thats the feeling i get too.

And I'm loathe to put an underdeveloped player with question marks over his disposal in the most important position on the ground.

But then again, if we have another season like this year, we have to try him there. It would at least further his development.

BINGO!!!! Thats my point, it won't hurt 1 bit. It does not have to be long term just give the kid a go and see what he can do.

BINGO!!!! Thats my point, it won't hurt 1 bit. It does not have to be long term just give the kid a go and see what he can do.

Yeah, that's fine if we are getting slaughtered & need to shake things up.

And there's a big difference between trying him there to 'see what he can do' & projecting him as being our preferred option for CHF.

He might come good there eventually, but you'd be silly to hold your breath

IMO Martin will be a player who's career is defined by his kick. Seems to have a lot of good aspects, including most importantly a work ethic... but he's very blue-collar. Fits in in defence as a tall cos he won't be required to kick much. As far as that is concerned, I get the feeling sooner or later dees fans will tire of his delivery, no matter how good he is as a spoiler, defender, contest-maker...

I still like him, I just don't know that he's a champion footballer in the making.

That's a really good point. No point having a lead up CHF who's agile & a great mark but who cant then deliver the ball to the FF or chip in with a few goals.

I actually can't remember what his kicking is like? I don't remember it being terrible, so maybe he should be spending some time with our goal-kicking coach (or we could get him to spend some time with Schwarta) to see if he could potentially play there. Not wanting to move Garland, Rivers and Warnock a bit older and less likely to make the transition, I really like the idea of Martin at CHF. I also think he's most athletically adaptable, tallest, quick of the mark, great agility & good hands. If he's got a good enough kick i see no reason not to try it. People are also forgetting we've got Frawley as another up & coming KP defender.

If we could eventually have a group of tall forwards of Miller, Martin & Watts, what teams defense can match-up against those 3, with Watts & Martin both being +196cm?