Unless the Tigers can produce a remarkable turn around in performance (and gameplan and possibly personnel) you'd have to think they've blown another shot at finals.

Surely if they miss them this year, Wallace would have to be a goner. There's only so many 5 year plans you can have.

Just goes to show how important building a good team culture is.

Wallace was not happy with the miller sacking he may just wlk but does have another year to go

They're pretty undermanned Richmond.

Good players are either getting on (Richo, Browny) or still a year or 2 away from really stepping up (Deledio, Cotchin, Tambling)

They're got a whole host of youngsters but like the Dees, you can't really see too many of them becoming 150-200 game players

Of their injury list, Richmond are missing 2, Adelaide 5, of their probable starting 22, so hardly undermanned.

Tigers haven't beaten a top 8 side this year, and i don't agree with putting Deledio in the same boat as Cotchin, let alone Tambling. I think Deledio is almost as good as he'll get (which is pretty good mind you) but i don't think Tambling has it.

Like us last year, they have a lot of drift wood in their team, and I wonder how long it takes them to shift them out

I would have thought that the Tigers and Port were as bad as what we were this round, except they were not playing Geelong. So we'll cop the usual [censored] about how crap we are, we should relocate, etc....

They're got a whole host of youngsters but like the Dees, you can't really see too many of them becoming 150-200 game players

or the bombers

I would've agreed with you 2 months ago, but a few have come along a bit in that time (even though they did lose to WC).

Melbourne, Dons and Tiges 2009 season could spell the end for a few of those youngsters if they don't continue to make inroads next year

I would've agreed with you 2 months ago, but a few have come along a bit in that time (even though they did lose to WC).

Melbourne, Dons and Tiges 2009 season could spell the end for a few of those youngsters if they don't continue to make inroads next year

i think it's way too early to call with melbourne and essendon. think back only a few short years when steve johnson was almost traded, cam mooney an average forward, milburn was just a player and bartel treading water. i would think 3/4 of melbourne's team should be given at least another 2 years. they only young players under question are the ones that have been there 3years+, and aside from silvia and bell, i can't think of many.

Didn't he tell the board he has put forward a 30 year plan?

They're pretty undermanned Richmond.

Good players are either getting on (Richo, Browny) or still a year or 2 away from really stepping up (Deledio, Cotchin, Tambling)

They're got a whole host of youngsters but like the Dees, you can't really see too many of them becoming 150-200 game players

He has had 4 years with the list and they are in a diabolical state. They have 2 talls in Richo 33 and Simmonds 31. They will both be gone in 2 years. After that they have nothing. Their recruiting and list management is worse than ours.

Unless his fortunes turn quickly Wallet will not see out his fifth year. He and Miller have been as thick as thieves at Richmond and Millers sacking should be a fair warning to him.

There's only so many 5 year plans you can have.

Neale Daniher.

They're pretty undermanned Richmond.

Good players are either getting on (Richo, Browny) or still a year or 2 away from really stepping up (Deledio, Cotchin, Tambling)

They're got a whole host of youngsters but like the Dees, you can't really see too many of them becoming 150-200 game players

Yes, I'm tipping another 9th or 10th finishing position for the Tigers...........god, you 've gotta love 'em!!

The Board might decide to go for Sheedy once and for all!!

Neale Daniher.

Good call, because Daniher is still coaching AFL and all...

His was more of a one year plan anyway

He has had 4 years with the list and they are in a diabolical state. They have 2 talls in Richo 33 and Simmonds 31. They will both be gone in 2 years. After that they have nothing. Their recruiting and list management is worse than ours.

Unless his fortunes turn quickly Wallet will not see out his fifth year. He and Miller have been as thick as thieves at Richmond and Millers sacking should be a fair warning to him.

He's had 4 years with a list that still has the likes of Fiora and Tivendale on it. If they rid themselves of those guys and weather the fallout from the retirement of Richo, Browny, Johnson and Simmonds the guys in the 1-4 season mark should see them through for the next 10 years.

Unfortunately unless something changes I can't see them challenging for the flag any time soon. Doesn't have a great deal with the coach (although they must too wear their equal share of the blame), more to do with the club in general (players, board members etc)

Unless the Tigers can produce a remarkable turn around in performance (and gameplan and possibly personnel) you'd have to think they've blown another shot at finals.

Surely if they miss them this year, Wallace would have to be a goner. There's only so many 5 year plans you can have.

Just goes to show how important building a good team culture is.

I know from a high up person in Richmond that richmond want Wallace out

After her comments on the Offsiders on ABC TV and on radio on Sunday, about the Dees, Caro might want to remind herself of the the current state of the Tiges.

They had a lot to play for yesterday and didn't even give a purr, let alone a roar.

After her comments on the Offsiders on ABC TV and on radio on Sunday, about the Dees, Caro might want to remind herself of the the current state of the Tiges.

What did she have to say about the Dees?

He's had 4 years with a list that still has the likes of Fiora and Tivendale on it. If they rid themselves of those guys and weather the fallout from the retirement of Richo, Browny, Johnson and Simmonds the guys in the 1-4 season mark should see them through for the next 10 years.

Unfortunately unless something changes I can't see them challenging for the flag any time soon. Doesn't have a great deal with the coach (although they must too wear their equal share of the blame), more to do with the club in general (players, board members etc)

Wallace came with a golden 5 year contract and had a big opportunity to remould Richmond and address some of its deficiencies. He has done neither so far.

Ever since Wallace has been there Richmond have had significant deficiencies in leadership, skill and KPPs. In that time Wallace has focussed recruitment of light bodied running players and punted on a couple of hacks from other Clubs (eg Knobel, Graham, Heath Black and Stafford).And he has still got Tivendale!. He traded Fiora for Black.

The fact that they are not going to challenge for the flag soon has everything to do with the Coach. Its been his poor game plan that has driven the recruiting, trading and drafting under the wizard Miller than has got him there. Miller is gone and rightly so. The list still has serious basic questions about it. It is key player reliant and does not have the toughness necessary to win big games.

Wallace's window is narrowing sharply and another season like this will see him being removed before his five year term is up.

What you would expect.

"Deplorable effort", "long way to go". "If I were a Melbourne supporter, I would find it extremely difficult to take any positives out of Friday night's performance". "The current list is a long way behind anyone elses in the AFL." "Doesn't appear to be any future with this current playing list"

So Caro, just out of interest, what about your beloved Tiges? They were once an endangered species, given the Miller affair, Terry Wallace's 2011 plan and their recruitng over the last few years, will they be endangered again?

What you would expect.

"Deplorable effort", "long way to go". "If I were a Melbourne supporter, I would find it extremely difficult to take any positives out of Friday night's performance". "The current list is a long way behind anyone elses in the AFL." "Doesn't appear to be any future with this current playing list"

So Caro, just out of interest, what about your beloved Tiges? They were once an endangered species, given the Miller affair, Terry Wallace's 2011 plan and their recruitng over the last few years, will they be endangered again?

If your quotations are factual and not argument serving then her comments on the MFC were on the mark given Friday nights effort.

She has been equally harsh on the Tigers over the last couple of years. I have no doubt she would be castigating them for their performance which did happen after the show went to air. Wallace would have to be on a fine line ATM.

Wallace came with a golden 5 year contract and had a big opportunity to remould Richmond and address some of its deficiencies. He has done neither so far.

Ever since Wallace has been there Richmond have had significant deficiencies in leadership, skill and KPPs. In that time Wallace has focussed recruitment of light bodied running players and punted on a couple of hacks from other Clubs (eg Knobel, Graham, Heath Black and Stafford).And he has still got Tivendale!. He traded Fiora for Black.

The fact that they are not going to challenge for the flag soon has everything to do with the Coach. Its been his poor game plan that has driven the recruiting, trading and drafting under the wizard Miller than has got him there. Miller is gone and rightly so. The list still has serious basic questions about it. It is key player reliant and does not have the toughness necessary to win big games.

Wallace's window is narrowing sharply and another season like this will see him being removed before his five year term is up.

Good assessment. Time is ticking for him. Its only a matter of when and it could come straight after Round 22 - that is my tip now that Miller is gone.

What you would expect.

"Deplorable effort", "long way to go". "If I were a Melbourne supporter, I would find it extremely difficult to take any positives out of Friday night's performance". "The current list is a long way behind anyone elses in the AFL." "Doesn't appear to be any future with this current playing list"

So Caro, just out of interest, what about your beloved Tiges? They were once an endangered species, given the Miller affair, Terry Wallace's 2011 plan and their recruitng over the last few years, will they be endangered again?

Iv'a she is just stating the obvious, Friday night was all of those quotes.

"The current list is a long way behind anyone elses in the AFL." "Doesn't appear to be any future with this current playing list".

She is right.

Good assessment. Time is ticking for him. Its only a matter of when and it could come straight after Round 22 - that is my tip now that Miller is gone.

Iv'a she is just stating the obvious, Friday night was all of those quotes.

"The current list is a long way behind anyone elses in the AFL." "Doesn't appear to be any future with this current playing list".

She is right.

If you read my post again, I said, "What you would expect". Friday night was deplorable and there was no joy there at all. But I would dispute that there does not appear to be any future in the current list. I for one am confident we will move forward. We have some exciting young kids and with the right drafting and possible trades, we will be OK. We also have the right coach and Footy manager.

Contrast our deplorable performance with the flogging Richmond received, at a time when it was playing for a possible place in the 8. Then look at the defeats of Port and Brisbane, with far better lists than ours at this time, who did not play the top side. IMO, there is daylight between the Cats and the rest

Caller on SEN mentioned Hardwick to Richmond done and dusted. Dont know how much faith you can put in that.

Caller on SEN mentioned Hardwick to Richmond done and dusted. Dont know how much faith you can put in that.

Was it Judd's grandma that called in?

point taken