Lucifers Hero

Here: http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-10-16/trade-wrap-motlop-set-to-stay-at-cattery "The proposed deal that would send Hawks Billy Hartung and Brendan Whitecross to the Brisbane Lions for one of the Lions' early second-round picks, No.16, No.19 or No.21, is no closer to being finalised and could fall over...The clubs still can't agree on elements of the deal, and one source close to the negotiations expected the proposed trade would be abandoned, a turn of events that would further complicate the Hawks' negotiations with Gold Coast on Jaeger O'Meara". Quite amazing if Hawks lose Mitchell and Lewis, take a huge whack in their PR and supporter backlash, then not get there BIG FISH, JO'M. While its fun to watch the Hawks reputation as smart operators getting a bit tarnished, I'm sad for O'Meara. He is the meat in the sandwich.

"EXCLUSIVE: HAWTHORN vice-captain Jordan Lewis has rejected a proposed move to the Gold Coast to help facilitate the Jaeger O’Meara" My translation is - Hawks to Lewis: "we don't really want you to stay and not only are we pushing you out to get this young gun, JO'M in, on money you could only dream of, just be a good lad now and agree to go to GCS (not the Demons) so we can get JO'M here quick smart! That adds insult to injury, for mine. Hawks certainly can't block the trade to the Dees after that!

Verrrrrrrry Interesting: A number of posters with an excellent track record of info have quite diverse insights from respective sources: Generation Dee - trade in pipeline, working out the finer details. gwsampso - wouldn't be surprised if we get him dr dee - who registered today to tell us we haven't spoken to him...in a way that is kinda persuasive. Chook in Perth - he ain't coming Abe - said he was aware of a trade not unlike that Gen Dee outlined but different picks involved. Where is @Harbinger43 he usually has good intel! Apologies if I missed any others. Well, I'm confused Some of you will need to give your sources a jolly good talking to! But seriously, thanks for continuing to post what you hear- if nothing else makes for great entertainment~

That won't happen. Trades are a case of 'buyer beware'. Receiving clubs must do their own due diligence. Anyway, there are ways of reducing risk: I would expect mfc to load up his contract with 'good behaviour' (on and off field) clauses with corresponding sanctions/rewards. We aren't run by dills anymore!

Collingwood have really snookered themselves! They will not get an AFL FA Compensation pick for N.Brown because they have brought in Wells as an FA so they offset. They only have a 2nd and 3rd round pick of any value. Hard to see them getting better unless they trade out a very good player next week. And they are trying to bring in Will Hosken-Smith and recruit Father/Sons, C. Brown and Daicos. Buckley may have cooked his own goose in this trade period! 2017: another bottom 8 year for them, along with Port, North, Lions, Richmond and probably 3 of Freo, Saints, Essendon, GCS, Geelong!

Maybe, if Ess are hearing the scuttlebut about Rockcliff and Lewis they might be getting worried they will have to keep Hibberd, after all he said he is happy to stay. Ess had better hurry up and accept our offer - or it might be gone or diluted by the time trade period is over. Let them sweat, I say - they have no leaverage at all.

If reports are correct Lewis has been treated shabbily by Clarkson and they are now trying to redeem themselves. Like other clubs' champs he wants to play on beyond 1 year. If mfc treated Nathan with disrespect and as a result in his heart he felt he could no longer wear the red and blue, then yes I would want mfc to accept pick 70. Nathan has earnt the right to go elsewhere under similar distasteful circumstances, even more so than Lewis who has 4 premiership medals for his work. For me it is not about age, it is about respecting a champion of the club. Look at Geelong - they have let all their champions get to where they wanted to go: Chapman to Ess, pick 84. Hunt to Giants, pick 75. Podsiadly to Crows, pick 64. Johnson to Giants a future (2016) 5th round pick. Love your work Macca but on this one I see it differently to your good self. Having said all that I'm not too fussed what pick he goes for as long as mfc end up with the players they want to balance our list by the end of the draft. Edit: just saw your next post. Pick 48 might be very valuable to Hawks to weave into the trade for O'Meara. Doubt they would take 48 to the draft.

Red, we are saying the same thing! The only way to upgrade a rookie is to use a draft pick at the NAB draft. AFL rules say a club needs to take 3 picks to (in) the draft. Ipso facto the rookie upgrades picks on draft night are included in the AFL's obligatory 3 picks. Will leave the semantics at that. Anyway, my main point was how good will it be for Smith and Wagner to be on our seniors list next year.

That is what I said - rookie upgrades are part of the 3 draft picks!

Our draft picks currently are: 29, 48, 66, 84, 102, 120. The first two or three are in play for Hibberd/Lewis/ Rockliff and if rumours are correct there are some high 1st rnd/low 2nd rnd picks to come back which may also be in play for those players. Not sure where we end up with early picks but there won't be many inside the top 50 (1 maybe 2 at this stage). To cover the AFL requirement to take at least 3 picks to the draft I would say there is a very good chance that Smith and Wagner will be upgraded with the last two picks (using draft picks for rookie upgrades are counted as part of the 3). A nice reward for those guys.

The womens league/teams are already bringing money into the game: NAB is the major naming rights sponsor of the AFWL. I read an article recently where sponsors are falling over themselves to sponsor the teams. http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-2016-the-great-contradiction-pay-no-good-but-pies-bat-away-womens-sponsors-20161011-grzo58.html http://www.smartcompany.com.au/marketing/74798-sports-marketing-new-ball-game-brands-flock-afl-womens-league/Then there are television rights income to be factored in. I'd be very surprised if the income from all these do not cover the whole AFWL payroll for the 10 teams, of about $1.5m several times over. And if crowds were the measuring stick for player wages there are many AFL male teams/players that would not get paid for much of the year. The main point is players should have the same rights as any other employee in our country - be paid the minimum wage and have their tools of trade paid for. If it was your daughter/sister/wife in one of the teams what would you want for them?

Right on cue:

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/the-afl-owes-women-so-much-more-20161015-gs35j1.html The hashtag #bootsoff is to draw attention to the measly pay for female players in the AFWL. For most it is $5,000 for the whole season! It is difficult to argue with this: "Every woman playing in the AFL Women's first season should, as a base rate, be paid the Australian minimum full-time wage for their training and playing period November to the end of March – which would amount to about $14,500." Even that is a trifling amount, in my book. Nonetheless it would be an improvement. So, no-one is saying they should be paid what the male AFL players earn. Far from it! But to be paid less than the minimum wage is just wrong! The article draws attention to what women playing professionally in other sports, earn: Under Netball Australia's new pay deal, players in the domestic competition earn a minimum wage of $27,370 and an average of $67,500 The NSW women's cricket team will earn at least the minimum wage of $35,000 The AFL recently announced a major sponsorship of the AFWL by NAB. Where will this money go? The AFL should be ashamed to ask players to pay for their boots and health insurance from the measly $5,000. So AFL do the right thing, otherwise one wonders whether all this is just tokenism and an opportunity to get some good PR and for the AFL to feel warm and fuzzy. Well, that PR may quickly turn south if they don't rectify this pay problem!! #bootsoff

Gr8 news, Gen dee. As for 'source' you have more than enough credibilty on here you don't need to give that info to doubters, imo. Keep up the good work!

Exactly why they are desperate! And desperate people do desperate things! It may not be Ollie but wouldn't be surprised to see one of their better mids head to where the sunshine is! GCS will be agitating for mids from somewhere - they have too many picks (vs list spots) to take to the draft and they don't need their 1st rounders to get their Academy players. Later draft points will do. Will keenly watch what they do.

Are Port still in the AFL? After the Hartlett fire sale fell thru they have gone to ground... Licking wounds? Imploding? Getting ready to fire up again? They are supposedly desperate to get into the draft; current picks: 9, 49, 67, 85, 103, 121. I wouldn't be surprised if they start wheeling and dealing with GCS who will have a juicy set of first round picks to offload. GCS current picks: 4, 8, 22, 24, 26, 30, 44, 62, 80, 98, 116. They will get 6 and 10 for Prestia and O'Meara then give (say 10) for Hanley. So GCS then have 4, 6, 8 in the first round and are known to want midfielders! Also, the middle picks (draft points) they have will get them their Academy player so taking the the first round picks to the draft is a 'waste' for them... SEN did mentioned whispers about Ollie Wines during the week but didn't follow up. Would be insane if Port let him go but would they if they could 2 get top 10 picks for him? Note: this is complete and total hypothesising on my part - Saturday entertainment But Port is desperate and have been quite for too long and something is brewing...

Current pick status is: Hawthorn: 10, 57, 68, 70, 88, 90, 108, 126 Melbourne: 29, 48, 66, 84, 102, 120 Can't see us giving up pick 29. So the discussion is 48, 66, 84. Of course Hawks want 48 at least, to save face. By all accounts the Hawks (except apparently the Board after supporter agitation) are happy for him to go. And, given that Mitchell went for 88 one would think it is 66 or 84.

Additional cap space this year from player departures, especially of Grimes and probably Dawes, both on big $$$. This year or next year more cap space available from player departures especially of Dunn and probably Lumumba, again both on big $$$. I would guess those guys add to somewhere close to $1.5m in cap space. I think our cap will be fine.

Agreed. The trust is well deserved.

Yep, can confirm this about Abe. Via pm he has told me that Watts would stay, the Trengove and Tyson deals and a few others. More recently about the Hogan contract. Abe is well connected in the industry. But you won't see him blurt stuff on forums before they are official. He just hints at things, so folks need to read between the lines or just trust him.

Stephen Quartermain Verified account ‏@Quartermain10 The @WestCoastEagles reveal @HawthornFC will be paying part of Sam Mitchell's salary next year. Deal of the century! Methinks, Hawthorn have lost the plot!!

I meant that North (and Hawks) blindsided their legends ala Harvey (Lewis) so other players may be disillusioned ala Wells and perhaps Goldstein. Ummm...you can pm me re the bit about friction in the playing group if you like...please

SEN said they had the mfc statement and chose to only read the line I quoted. Am checking the club website for a copy. Edit: SEN just read out a bit more of mfc's statement - couldn't type fast enough but the additional bit was that Lewis approached the Dees or words to that effect. http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-10-14/we-remain-interested-dees-still-sniffing-around-lewist

MFC have issued a statement saying 'we understand that Jordan is a contracted player but we remain interested'! Translation: He is on his way!! Edit 1: Source SEN who apparently have mfc's complete statement. Edit 2: Here is the statement: http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-10-14/we-remain-interested-dees-still-sniffing-around-lewis The pertinent part: "We received an approach from Jordan Lewis’s management earlier this week regarding the possibility of him joining Melbourne. This was after discussions Jordan had with Hawthorn," the statement read..."We understand that Jordan is contracted to Hawthorn, but we remain interested in looking at this option." Makes it pretty clear we did not do the chasing despite the picture Hawthorn are trying to paint! Well done mfc to not let the Hawks paint us as the bad guys to save their own skin!!

Todd Viney - the gift that keeps on giving: " It's understood Lewis' link to the Demons stemmed from a strong relationship with former Hawks assistant and now Melbourne player personnel manager Todd Viney. Lewis mentored Viney's son, and now Demons star Jack Viney during Jack's days playing in the TAC Cup: . http://www.theage.com.au/afl/hawthorn-hawks/afl-trades-2016-hawthorn-say-jordan-lewis-wants-to-stay-despite-melbourne-hopes-20161014-gs2lnm.html Its almost like Lewis is one of the Dees family!