deelusions from afar

Clearly don't understand all the permutations... but I would have thought that giving up our future 1st limits our ability to get pick 9 from the bombers? Maybe the saints are confident they will be able to trump our offer for it - the bombers might have already told us this? Otherwise why would we do this now when it seems like we are in the box seat to get 9 if we (or someone else) bids on Kako? What am I missing?

That's fair enough. But I actually really appreciate us having a go back for once. We've been under seige for more than a year and have just been copping it. I'm not against Goody and others' approach of being "a good Melbourne person" and being pragmatic and not dodoro when dealing with player movement... as I think these things are important to be successful ina sustainable way. But we are under seige and no one has flown the flag... Don't get me started on Maynard at Kings Birthday! So I actually appreciate Brad for pushing back - about time someone did!

Yes - but it all makes sense that Morris' mail is coming from the managers when you go over what he's saying: re Petracca after the Oliver tour of Geelong. Not exact quote but something like "Make no mistake, this is not Petracca pushing Oliver out - his issue was with the way Melbourne handled Oliver, not Oliver himself." Petracca was overseas when this was said. Would he really be prioritising getting this out into the media or is this something that he can leave with people that are paid to look after his affairs - like a manager? I'm not going to drag up all of the comments Morris has made on Petracca / Oliver over the last 3 months... but I think you'll find it lines up perfectly with what their management would know and want out in the public.

Surely for him to play, it means one of Petty / JVR / Disco need to be out of the side (or maybe in defence). What's his defensive pressure like? I think the competitiveness is what they like about the others and why someone like Weid did not make it. Despite what ppl think / say about Petty - I reckon his year was injury affected and he's a solid body and has a bit of mongrol in him (albeit he seemed to be down on confidence this year).

I reckon the leaks to the media are from player agents - it's no coincidence that Tom Morris was at the front of developments of both stories (with a reliable source) and Oliver and Trac have the same manager.

Essendon don't have a competent small forward - they need Kako really badly. Someone (us / Saints) could have them over a barrel if cards are played right. Unlikely for anything to happen until draft night. I imagine we'll want it known that we're keen on Kako and open to picking him but also looking at others (eg midfielders) at 5. Will actually be an exciting draft!

Surely they're not planning to play Campbell with Gawn? More as insurance if he's injured / needs a rest?

Geelong managed to effectively build a multi premiership list with a lot of talent coming in two strong drafts (note father son selections aside, most are not really high picks): 1999 Draft Pick 8 - Joel Corey Pick 31 - Paul Chapman Pick 38 - Cameron Ling Pick 47 - Corey Enright 2001 Draft Pick 8 – Jimmy Bartel Pick 17 - James Kelly Pick 24 - Steve Johnson Pick 40 (Father/Son Selection) - Gary Ablett Jr.

I like Goody so this is not intended to be saying he should go. But outside of sponsorship opportunities (eg big club like collingwood), surfcoast lifestyle / one team town (Geelong) and winning (we were the preferred destination of Cerra in 2021), I think part of what makes up a "destination club" is the gamestyle. If you look at Collingwood (22-23), Hawthorn (24) etc the winning is most important but it is also about how they win. Ie coach backing players to take risks. A lot of it is hype and BS - but clearly players at other clubs eat this up. I think Goody is a bit hamstrung by the list he has (which is evolving), the instability around him (don't think that's his doing) and certainly tried to tweak this in the first half of the season this year - but I think he has to continue to work on this. The setting up a defensive fortress and doing the percentage play makes a team too predictable and seemingly isn't as satisfying for players as well as supporters.

So hypothetically if something like this went ahead, we could slide back to Essendon's pick (5 to 9) and also gain their future 1st (would need other pick swaps you'd think). Then we use our or essendon's future first to try for another first rounder (eg freo / richmond or gold coast). That could mean we could end up with two first rounders this year and still have a first rounder next year (and still be in the running to get Brisbane's pick 20). I.e 3 picks in the top 20 (and still have next year's first). What I don't know is how much more value is pick 5 over pick 9 in this years draft. I know it is meant to be high quality and deep but depending on who you speak to, the top 5 or so are still a cut above.

Just realised GC are looking for points so ignore my post above

I assume that's because we weren't intending to use our future first for that? Could we use our future first for that and something else? eg a third round pick? Could be useful for derksen or to package with the ANB pick to go a bit higher?

You might be right. But I think backing up finals year after year is hard - we had the jump on finals teams in 2021 as we didn't play finals and had those extra few weeks to recover and train. Is that why our fitness struggled? I also think the game style of other teams evolved and ours is very taxing to keep up all season. I don't feel we've had a heap of injuries due to training / management - a lot have been collision injuries which the fitness / medical staff can't control. The issue I have had is bringing top 23 players in while underdone - why aren't they made to earn it via the VFL. Clarry's situation is different but surely he should have had to earn his stripes there this year before coming into the seniors.

I don't know but from the outside it has to be partly B - do you remember there were matches last year where Oliver was not selected but he was wearing the sub top and training / stretching on the boundary line - while the game was being played? It's like giving an 10yo a sense of purpose to be part of the team who can't deal with not playing. Clearly Clarry is a handful - it seems this was managable until last year - as others have said things came crashing down for him after breaking up with his gf and getting his first significant injury. I'm sure the club hasn't been perfect but I don't think there's a manual for what they've had to deal with. Ironically (so Melbourne), that if he does leave, it is because we stuck by him last year and helped him get to a better place mentally that we will now only be able to extract a fraction of his value. We've done the right thing by him as a person - but ultimately it seems to have played a role in fracturing the club and now we're far worse off.

I went on to the Cats Big Footy to get a sense of the trade yesterday and they seemed to ahve a lot of intel on what went on

Agree its hard to know what to believe. But if this is true... then it's not like Pert would be doing this independently of Goody / Tim Lamb / Jason Taylor etc. If it is true, the Dees must think there is more risk of ongoing problems / fractures etc with Clarry staying or that he won't get back to his best. Definitely hope its not true but after the last few years it feels like there does need to be some big changes / difficult calls to move forwrad. Hopefully they make the right ones.

If they wanted to trade him, they wouldn't need to do this - clearly there is plenty of interest (eg Crows last year). Many teams still tagged him even though he was not match fit and had a broken hand. He is clearly highly rated - a multiple coaches award winner. To do what you are suggesting would be stupid as it reduces his trade value.

I feel much the same. As supporters you get attached to following players and for some turn into champions. How can we rewatch / relive the 2021 GF if the stars that made it happen are playing at our most hated rivals. What's the point of investing in the draft when it means giving up some of the best players we've ever had?

No it was deliberate - and it could be unfair. But I don't really rate Port because they have been flat track bullies and capitulated in big games more than most. I'm not saying they / they're coaches wouldn't have anything to offer us (I don't mind watching them as a neutral). But I don't think they have a great system - I think it is more based around some very good stars. Admittedly they beat the hawks but the hawks are younger, played an exciting brand which took them a long way while missing crucial chess pieces (eg defenders that will join in the offseason, Mitch Lewis and maybe another midfield star). If it wasn't about the list of players we have, I'd love us to play more of a run and gun style that is still defensively sound which many of the better teams are doing / starting to do.

Not exactly sure how the soft cap works but assume this means we've got a bit more to work with to attract an assistant coach than we normally would. Hopefully can get a good tactition / communicator with good IP from recently successful clubs / gameplans eg Bris, Swans, Pies, Hawks, Geel. Interestingly, Geelong after their desastrous end to 2021 revamped their whole footy department which seemed to make a big difference. I hope we shake things up in a similar fashion. I remember hearing them talk about rebuilding their gameplan based on the players they had and maximising their strengths. This is from Wikipedia:

Yikes. This seems a bit harsh! I actually think McVee is faster and more agile than Rivers - just doesn't (yet) have the tank to play midfield. If Bowey and Salem are average by foot, then why are they in the team - surely that is their strength?

I thought what made him so appealing is his long accurate kicking which opens the ground up in transition. There's stats gurus that know this better than me but most scores come from turnover. Salem and Bowey can open the game up with precise kicking (if encouraged to take the 45 degree corridor kick) but they don't have the ability to kick the sort of distance that Houston can which makes our transition more predictable. If I'm seeing the future with my red and blue coloured glasses on, we have largely fixed our forward issues this year in terms of personnel. They were actually ok - it was more our midfield fell apart with no Gus, Clarry down / injured and Trac missing the second half. We get them back at their best with a bit more speed in there from Rivers, McVee and Windsor and the missing piece might actually be the long kicking architect coming out of defence... ie Houston.

We're not getting him... so any other defenders we're looking to bring in?

I like Spargo because he doesn't waste it when he has the ball. But I do remember him on the wing in a few games last year. As a concept it makes sense and probably works with the right matchup - but I remember him getting beaten in the air, for pace and strength where he was a liability. I think the role doesn't fit his strenghts. Def agree re Windsor in at centre bounces - he looked very calm and composed in congestion this year which surprised me

If Rivers and McVee are intended to be used more up forward next season, I'm surprised we're not linked to players needed to play their role in defence - or have I missed something?