deelusions from afar

I think it would be partly because we will struggle to attract talent that is in demand due to how we have gone the last few seasons on and off field. Secondly just because someone can't get a game in one side doesn't mean they can't be an asset in another. They're not superstars but Toby Bedford wasn't a regular when GWS picked him up from Melbourne (we wanted to keep him and were blindsided) and has become a much better player. Even Jordon at Sydney - they didn't win the flag but he was in their grand final team in a very deep midfield after being on the outer at Melbourne.

Agree 100% - there's not much to say right now. Decisions have to be made, but they can't be made without the new president / CEO in place and it would make us look like we're panicking off field in the same way we did on field in the last quarter (and particularly the last 8 seconds). So maybe it's better to say nothing? But then we have supporters / media saying we're hearing crickets from the president / the club and that obviously means they're ok with this result. It's a no win position for Brad and the board. At a minimum he's saying the performance is not up to scratch (duh) and setting the foundations for change. Whereas last year a trade of Oliver / Trac was off the table... it seems like those sorts of things won't be this time round. (Maybe Goody too... but who knows) We're all p!ssed off right now - but a knee [censored] reaction / statement will make us even less attractive for prospective players, coaches, other staff who WE NEED to attract to get better.

It could actually be the other way round... the players seem to LOVE SG. From their point of view the onfield performance could be more about other factors - off field management, players behaviour off field etc

Isn't the problem though that it is reportedly a weak draft and in addition to that very compromised with academy and father sons - so draft picks are less valuable this year? It's why trading out our first last year and netting Lindsay is a win pretty much regardless of where we finish. And why it made sense for Richmond to load up with so many draft picks last year. We could potentially trade for future picks.. but that delays the rebuild (and I have no idea on the quality for that draft)

That criticism is fair. Though I feel like the Viney decision was more of a PR one with him and Max commiting / extending in the middle of the storm at the end of last years season. Having said that, Langdon is still playing at a decent level so with his fitness and speed, 3 years doesn't seem that bad? Lever is young enough to still be playing good footy in 3 years time... I guess it comes down to if his body can hold up. I don't think that's Lamb's fault - we seem to have tried to lure everyone we can since 2019 when we realised post Hogan that Tmac and Weid weren't going to cut it forward. We are always linked to forwards but other than BBB we've never got one. I think until this year, a manager would be in the players ear saying "mate have you seen how Melbourne enter's their forward 50?". I wouldn't have wanted to play key forward in those teams! Potentially if we didn't have so much coin tied to May, Lever, Trac, Oliver, Max we might have been able to get one in... but I can't think of too many quality KPFs we've missed out on (we were never in the running for Lynch, Cameron etc). And re McKay - would he have made much difference? He won the coleman medal in 2021 from memory so we would have been trading Oliver / Trac at the peak of their powers after winning a flag to get him. Maybe (maybe?) in hindsight it makes sense, but there's no way we were going to do that after they just won us a premiership.

That criticism is fair. Though I feel like the Viney decision was more of a PR one with him and Max commiting / extending in the middle of the storm at the end of last years season. Having said that, Langdon is still playing at a decent level so with his fitness and speed, 3 years doesn't seem that bad? Lever is young enough to still be playing good footy in 3 years time... I guess it comes down to if his body can hold up.

While I'm normally a defender of Goody, after the weekend I find myself wondering if it's time to part ways. At the same time, if I'm being honest I think I'm just wanting to see better performances and after what we've lived through since 2021 it seems moving the coach on will make all the bad go away and things will immediately turn around... but will it really? I've been pretty critical of Goody's coaching style / game plan since 2021... but I actually think the changes this year make the team more attacking and watchable... we just don't quite have the cattle to do it consistently (yet). If Goodwin were sacked and we do make major changes to the list, is that really going to make us better - or will it actually resign us to the doledrums for 5 years (in a time when the AFL is pumping resources and draft picks into the new club).

I know it's an unpopular opinion but I don't understand the hate for Lamb on here. The established players he has brought in since 2021 haven't been much chop - but with the gamestyle we had in 2022-2023 and the off-field issues that plagued our club since 2021, I don't think that's his fault. Players didn't / don't want to come to Melbourne. He seems pretty shrewd when it comes to trading for picks etc.

I think there is merit in giving him a game or two in the final few rounds. By "giving" I'm not meaning his form doesn't warrant it - but more due to how far back he has had to come from this season, it's a big step up. But often this can give players a bit of extra motivation over the summer - they have a better understanding of what's required. I haven't given up on JVR and Jefferson. I reckon Jefferson has shown a lot - he's taken some good marks, shown a competitive streak (albeit in bursts) and his VFL form shows he is a good kick for goal (which hasn't been seen much at AFL level). Another pre-season building fitness, strength and confidence and he could go another level. I wonder whether JVR should be tried in defence - even if it's a short term thing, it might round out his game and give him some insights into how to be a difficult forward to play on.

Will be very interesting to see what happens at the end of the season. I love all our players and would hate to see any traded - particualrly those from the 2021 premiership team.... BUT we obviously have to look to improve and you have to give something to get something. When I look at our key defenders, we seem to suddenly have more than we need - particularly if Petty is in the mix there (which I suspect he is if we had another big body that can play forward). I'd hate to see him go but I think May would be the one that could make a difference for a team that is otherwise looking really solid - eg the Dogs have a great list but their defence is still their achilles heel. Lever is another that has potentially been passed by Disco. Or is he just injured? Would hate to see him go but with Petty, Disco, Adams, TMac (surely gets another year) and Howes I think we have enough coverage there.

I think this is actually changing though. We are now (believe it or not) one of the fastest ball movement sides. We've had a huge game plan overhaul and it's not there yet... but it is so much better than the last couple of years. Had we kicked straight the narrative would be different. I know goal kicking has been a constant issue - but I think previously that was a lot to do with our slow down the line play and mobing it in... we do a lot less of that now. Things can turn quickly. When we played Hawthorn early last year, they looked an absolute rabble. By the end of the year they were the hollywood hawks.

I read somewhere that we are into Ollie Lord - is there anything to this?

Don't rate Buckley's analysis overly highly most of the time... but I thought some of his comments on us with Whately yesterday were interesting. It's easy to throw the baby out with the bathwater. He mentioned that we've come a long way in changing our game style but still need to work on the last part (ie ensuring its engrained to not dump kick forward when we're under pressure). This means we might have to cop getting tackled and holding the ball in the defensive 50 from time to time. But reduces the long kicks down the line / turnovers as we're no longer setup for that. This season has been very disappointing - but in some respects I can see some similarities with 2020 when after a terrible start (we were altering our gamestyle then too), for much of the season we were one of the most compeditive teams but fell short (partcularly due to poor performances against Freo and Sydney in Cairns). Obviously there's still a bit to go and a lot of question marks over a number of players - particualrly regarding whether they can get back to their best. It's never as good / bad as you think it is etc. It may be the best thing for the long term if we see the back half of this season as part of the pre-season for 2026. Who do we need to develop more - can we fast track this by playing them in other positions, who has currency that is not adding value to us next year / going forward etc

A little bit of devil's advocate here* - but if we have four quality key defenders playing well enough to be in the team, and only three spots, you play the best forward of them forward. Over their career, that's TMac but right now it's Turner. Yes he may be our best defender at the moment.... but that may also make him our best option to play forward. JVR out, TMAC in and Turner takes JVR's place. I actually don't think Petty's doing too badly.... it would be a lot better though if he kicked the goals! * Don't think this will actually happen.

Not having a go at you - more for my (and maybe others') education. But wasn't collingwood's issue a few years ago that they had a tight salary cap. Isn't this possible when you commit to players to long term deals (more than 6 years) and then they perform below expectations and other players perform at a higher level than expected and thus demand more $$... but because you have committed to long term deals for other players you can't afford it? So maybe it's not tight - but you're locked in to long term deals which reduces your ability to increase what the next tiers of players should get paid which means they may mov elsewhere to get what the market will pay them?

Just clicked on this thread to see the reaction to kozzie's news and saw this - how funny that Freo were having a go at us for talking about Luke Jackson!

I remember her on the Real Footy podcast earlier in the year talking about our culture - really sticking the boot in and saying we have a lot of work to do (might have been before we'd won a game). When asked more about it, she referred to after the AFLW Dees won the flag, their time in the sun was overshadowed by the drama from the mens program and culture issues. I got the impression that she felt the mens program had too many egos and didn't get behind the women's team like they had for the mens team when they won in 2021 Having read what everyone else has said above, maybe most of this is more about her hurt from being traded etc. But I suspect there is (or was) some truth in what she had to say. From memory she spoke glowingly about Mick Stinear and Daisy so she wasn't potting everyone at the club. Wins paper over cracks (for every team). Clearly the mens team did a lot of work on culture, connection and game plan in the off season. I hope part of this is also translating to better connection with everyone else at the club - including off field staff and the women's team. There is great power that comes from the whole organisation pulling together.

Would be worth every cent. Everytime I see Port play he plays well ... and I watch us every week so... 🤣 But he seems to be good one on one, great intercepter and as far as I can tell is an excellent metres gained player.

I'm surprised the headline isn't GAWN IN HEATED EXCHANGE WITH OLIVER

Surprised for the love of Bevo - he has underachieved with the list they have. He has a flag which is an incredible achievement... but has never made top 4 in the season. I think he can coach and is definitely creative... but since their premiership season his teams have largely been underwhelming with the talent he has had at his disposal.

I'm in two minds - I think the players like to troll the media a bit and part of me thinks good on 'em But as you say it's not a good look for the club and just encourages negative headlines which I wouldn't think are in the best interests of the club or Kozzie.

Who's the likely skipper?

Haven't read all the responses here but they are far more negative than they should be in my opinion. It is a pre-season game. We are not the finished product. I remember getting smashed in 2021 by the Dogs in the pre-season and thinking we are miles off it. We know how relevant that was ultimately! A few reasons why I'm buyoed by yesterday: Fremantle are a good side for us to have played. Their defence is one of the best in the league, they are very good at clearance and can open you up on turnover. They also have some very dangerous forwards. They arguably have the best list in the AFL (though their gamestyle / performance over a season doesn't live up to that). It is a critical year for them and so they would have taken this match seriously. The conditions were very hot which definitely favoured the dockers over us. We were close but not quite at full strength - Pickett (until last Q), Petty, McVee, JVR (injured early). They're pretty hand players. Yes we won clearance, inside 50 and kicked a lot more points (and lost the match) but it felt a bit different. There was definitely a real effort from some to lower the eyes (eg Trac to Clarry) rather than bombing. Still a lot of work to do but this is something we will be working at all year if we're to reach our potential not something that can be fixed over night. I liked the different combinations in the middle which meant that at times Clarry, Viney and Trac all started forward which gave a different feel. Having Langdon (and Pickett) in the centre square made us look less vulnerable to opposition sets where they have have smaller, quicker players in there. Johnson competed really well - I think he could play the role that Goody was wanting Petty to play last year as in compete in the air, get the ball to ground, fight and scrap and snag a goal or two if ones for the taking but more about competing and fighting. His give to Fritsch for a goal when on the ground in a pack to me shows he could be very valuable (even without being a big goal kicker) Clarry kicking goals (even set shots) was fantastic. If he can kick 20 to 30 this year, he will probably win the Brownlow. There's a lot to tidy up but a lot to like. Langford and Lindsay weren't as prominent but they seem like hard workers - it gives them a good sense of the next level they need to get to which I'm sure they will rise to it. We had more scoring shots than a team that should be finishing top 4 in our first proper outing (in tough conditions in the west). There's a lot to like and of course a lot of 'learnings'. Bring on round 1

I think people also forget that pre-knee James McDonald was turning into a very special player (I think it happened towards the end of the 2000 season?). He was still a very special player but seemed to lose some of his athletic abilities post knee surgery and yet still went on to be captain, BnF winner etc.

I feel like I'm missing something here. Has dominated pre-season, has a number of weapons as a player, apparently is a good person, was well liked by all at West Coast... and yet was delisted by West Coast who are one of the bottom teams. Why did they get rid of him? Was it injury? Off field stuff?