Norm Smith's Curse

I think Martin has played a few more good games than that, but remains a fringe player despite a breakout season when Jamar went down. Seems surprised when he does something right most of the time which is a worry.

How is Dawes with forward defensive pressure?

Reported by mate and now on faceboom trades that ray has asked for a trade officially.

Just heard on the wires that Ray has officially asked for a trade from the saints who are somewhat reluctant given the perception of where their list is at. From a saints supporter.

As I said, the bloke i know cant believe we are going to get him for potentially such a miniscule pick. He was rated very highly in his earlier days. The quote this bloke used was that Ped would work out better for us than Dawes. Time will tell but im happy. Rumour is that Farren Ray has officially asked for a trade finally.

We in essense believe we have a solid list of young players who will take us to the next level. Clearly with the captaincy going to T and G its clear that there was a perception in the players and within the coaching staff that we lacked good leadership. Neeld's team seem to be making inroads into changing that. While we have no proper recruiter, a few people have told me that we have been sending out feelers to local level recruiters all over the place for info.

Dont agree on martin - early on his disposal and decision making was woeful. he came in and did some good work when jamar went down and surprised a few, made some good kicks either as inside 50s to a target or kicking his own goals but always seems genuinely surprised when his passages of play worked out. I see martin as another Pettard and just probably not what a Neeld future requires totally agree with Martin v Spender - Martin is clearly better but I get the feeling Neeld loves spencer's giving-it-all mentality.

yeah it does seem off. perhaps Bruce, Davey when fit added something?

My personal opinion is that Bailey could talk the talk but he set an already somewhat lazy team backwards a long way. Think about it this way - recruiting wise - we came from a forward 50 inhabited by such names as Neitz, Vardy, Farmer, Schwartz, Robbo and Uze which Daniher then dumbed down to a few fails, Holland, Miller, Moorcroft and then Bailey came in and added such unfulfilled flakey talent as Wonna, Jurrah and well no one really... Where we are at in 2012 is much less a reflection of Mark Neeld as a coach as it is a reflection of the culture of the players when Neeld started. cancelling time trials or the classic under Daniher of Byron Pickett smsing in that he wouldnt be at a game because he was too hung over. LOL. its about much higher standards at training and at commitment to be elite - about players 'behaving their way in or out' - he has set high standards. Not all of the players I thought would respond have and some of the players that seem to have responded I am surprised by. And lastly now in the trade and FA period all the holes I personally have assessed and seen myself are the targets of aggressive trade movements. Im impressed. neeld seems to be a realist rather than another blind faithmonger of potential that we have a history of squandering or spoiling with kids gloves.

Would you agree that Dunn, Bail and Spencer are pretty safe? And that our fringies would be: Bate - midfield experiement failed Gysberts - has raw talent and got 29 disposals in one of his first games but injury has taken a tole or is there something more? Sellar - tall utility that hasnt exactly set the world on fire with the potential arrival of a number of new talls Morton - nuf said previously Davis - seems ok but there are queries Couch - struggled to break in Cook - another key position pick up that hasnt panned out Martin - has done some good things, but appears set for a trade given that Spencer is rated by Neeld and Pederson/Dawes are coming our way? Sheahan - delisted? Thought he looked alright myself... Moloney - gawn Reckon these blokes might all be on the outter? Consider what we have brought in to the club and what our needs are going forward - speed, spread ?? Dunn locking down a position in defense when rivers went forward seems like about the only safe player for 2013??

What's your take on Sellar? Pederson coming in as a tall utility and all?

bate was told by bailey that he wouldnt get a game because they wanted games into Watts (who Bailey saw as a CHF). Bate was then retained by Neeld to play in the midfield. Its been an epic fail for mine and sadly I think the bater wont be a dee next year.

Youd hvae to hope that Grimesy and trenners will be back and up next season... But your right. Viney will slot in next year based on talent but also based on need.

I hope not. he doesnt have a super attractive wife to justify him overstaying in that case does he? How did we go from a forward 50 of Neitz, Vardy, Uze and Schwartz to Older Neita, Holland, Miller and Robbo to Green, Wonna, robbo, and Jurrah. When you consider that you've got to wonder what was going on - sure Nolan and a few others were fails, but we really never had a chance...

I think looking at where we are at we have put a pretty tidy effort trade wise into suring up our forward 50. I think speed and spread are the weaknesses in the midfield and perhaps need to be addressed. Whether Neeld sees Rory Taggert and Gysberts coming in and doing that or perhaps a Dom Barry type in years to come (or is he going to play the Yarran role?) or whether there is room for more speed from elsewhere time will tell. I think Ray would be an ok pickup despite his age just for that speed. Lets face it we have a collection of fringe players that other sides might just believe (and might successfully) turn around. Morton, Martin, Sellar, Bate, Pettard, etc. It might nice to offload these just simply because I cant see some of them in our future - perhaps not so much because of a lack of talent or application, but more that they offer things that we dont need

I think this sums up the old soft mentality of the club - and the mentality I believe Neeld is doing a prettygood job of ironing out. trengove and grimes are demons through and through - as was big Neita and greenie. Doing thing slike sacking jnr probably didnt do us any past favours in this regard. Viney is also a demon through and through and this is what we need to make the move up the ladder. After a season that honestly was depressing at times I can just see some real core changes now in the off season that all make logical sense and for the first time I honestly believe we are on the right path to sustained success. As for favourite players - mine have been Neita, Uze, Scotty Thompson, Angry Phil Read, Byron Pickett - those that generally added a bit of grunt and agro to our list have been my favourites. Always rated Nathan Carroll for pure character.

Dawes will play the second option presenting forward - drawing defenders allowing Clark to go one out and allowing Byrnes and someone else to crumb up. Im excited for Hogan (2014) and Fitz as well because these big blokes around will make it soooo much easier for them to learn the trade.

If you look at our forward area on paper now with Clark and Dawes the twin towers, Byrnes as a crumber and allowing Fitzy and Hogan to be nurtured with the right hardbody protection around him I think Neeld has effectively sorted the basis for a power forward line for the next 6-8 years potentially. Crumbers are a problem but small forwards are generally easier to find that key position bigs. Now the midfield needs a superstar. Toumpas? Viney? Wines? man i must say 2013 is just looking awesome really.

If you look at our 2012 list you see that its prettymuch devoid of a lot of natural leadership or something similar that I cant quite put my name on. Martin has done some good things for the club - although tends to see surprsied when he does - but i think he just has a lack of something that a lot of players on our list lack that I cant quite name - just a presence or maybe confidence. Dunno. But I think pederson is the way to go and with him and Dawes in the side Id think that Martin and Sellar might not have much room left.

Pederson was VERY highly rated in his younger days. I bloke i know in the know all be it at a local footy level remembers him being a stand out talent early on. Whether he fell out with Scott or what ever this bloke reckons Ped will be a great pick up for the dees. Has leadership and discipline and this bloke reckons he will bigger than Dawes for us. Time will tell i guess but interesting comments.

I just get the feeling that spencer doesnt have the talent of martin but he is such a trier that Neeld just loves the bloke.

martin has done some good things but he just seems to lack something that a lot of melbourne 2012 players lack - im not sure if leadership is the right word but something like that. Just a bit direction-less at times. I think at a new side he would do well. Would think he would slot into the saints before he'd fit into the Lions personally but time will tell. Pederson will be a gun for the demons. I know a bloke that knew him early on and he was VERY highly rated on things like discipline so I think we will have a win with him in the side. Cant see there being much room for sellar if he does come across though.

A bloke I know told me that Pederson was very highly rated back when he started but fell out of favour with Scott. He said the anything below pick 35 would be a big win fir the dees.

Toumpas if available.

gees wizzz