Demon Dynasty

6 - McKenzie (amazing tank, tackling/intensity and 2nd 3rd efforts. Potential upside....scary) 5 - Rivers (best game in years. Getting back to his solid best) 4 - Martin (led the way from the 1st bounce with many first touches and nice disposal to advantage. Improving tank/efforts/execution slowly each week. Best game for mine so far) 3 - Jones (led the way with the intensity and attack on the ball carrier all day. Capable of taking himself to a new level from here if he keeps this up) 2 - Gysberts (couldn't split with Bennell...2 each if i could. Great link man and line running. A few more pre-seasons to build tank and body & to start sticking some tackles and... HELLO!) 1 - Bennell (sublime finish both outside & in close. Option selection 1st rate in most cases. Burnt off opponents giving us that extra chaos and unpredictability creating space & time for others to work their magic. And dare i say it, straightens us up through the middle when he's thereabouts with his ability to find players running forward!) Apologies to MacDonald, Moloney, Jetta, Evans (amazing 3rd game and great work rate!) & Howe (adds an extra dimension to our forward line and some good work up the ground as well! Loved his attack on the ball and carrier. Exciting 1st up game.)

~ Thinks this means Choco's predicting a draw. Not sure my nerves can handle another one!

I did say ..... "I always felt we could beat pretty much anyone when he was in the team, fully fit and in form" Yes, your point is a good one re his unpredictability and what he might bring each week. I remember the side shows as well but can't agree on the Bennett comment. Bennett was a B grader forward in comparison, albeit probably more consistent from week to week. But even certain other KPFs are volatile. Fev a classic example, albeit not the greatest of examples lol. Plugger also went off the rails on occasions. As did Barry Hall. I guess it's the way they're made....born angry and like to bully lol. Don't think you'll find too many successful KPFs making it in the big league who play flakey footy. My comments relate to when Jakovich was 'on' though. As i said earlier, I'm not saying i want a reincarnation of Jakovich. Just that i would take something like him (ie., a KPF) if i was offered that opportunity. And yes, the mid field elites too tyvm!

I'm goin with Billy on this one mate. Decent targets up forward are needed, even if they aren't dominant on GF day. I'd still rather have a KPF or 2 rather than not have them (rather than just have an elite mid field) or at least 1 or 2 decent targets who may not be your atypical KFP if i was offered for general home and away plus finals. I don't see one as more critical than the other. I think they're both important to the team's structure and general success. Classic example of needing a decent target is the move of Darren Jarman forward in the last quarter of the 97 GF against the Saints. Elite mid fielder, Andrew McLeod, was voted best afield that day winning the Norm Smith medal, but the Crows still needed a quality forward target to pull off the big one, coming from behind at half time. There was also a cameo up forward from Shane Ellen earlier in the game, who covered for Modra, having been injured in the Prelim the week before. Another forward target assisting the cause, no doubt with the help of a very good mid field.

One of the things the Pies and Cats do on a regular basis and take pride in! Used by these clubs to create another stoppage, where they believe they will win the next clearance (on most occasions), rather than giving it up to an opponent or a 50/50 for the easy turnover/clearance/goal. Something we finally started to see more of last night. Even if you're pinged, provided you aren't within 45 or so of goal, it almost works as a quasi professional free kick. And, as you mentioned Dappa, in most cases is a better alternative than a free 'cough up' clearance to the opposition. But one game doesn't make a season. Lets hope we can keep this method/habit going and see it spread amongst the younger crew too as they learn and improve. Needs to become a non-negotiable for anyone wishing to hold their place in the medium term and part of the way the Demons play from here if we're going to try and match it with the big boys and take a serious shot at the big one in seasons to come. Nice post Dappa

Nice 36 Also believe Morton's better performances have been at or around this posi. Needs to build some physicality body wise and also look longer as a first instinct. Showed something (again) last nite though. Alot more work from him required in order to go from classy/good (aka much of last night) on occasions, to consistantly performing at an elite level week to week. Super effort last night though. Credit where credit's due.

You're welcome mate. Unlikely that there's another team running around this weekend with less total games/average experience than us looking at those stats. Although i haven't done the work on the other teams so i could be wrong. If true, it makes last night's win that much sweeter.

Rapt to witness the birth of The Hurricane. (Yeah i know, it's similar to Jurrahcane but i wasn't thinking of that at the time lol). And his first goal! Niceeee!! You little beauty. Long way to go but looking forward to the journey HOWEEEE DO THAT!!!?? < my future catch cry B)

Is that really you Mike lol?

Nice one Choco. Enjoy your spoils mate! B)

Melbourne Demons / Gold Coast Suns - Experience Stats (Comparative for selected teams Round 11, 2011) Total games played by Team Demons - 1,138 Suns – 1,287 Average games played by Team Demons - 52 Suns - 59 Stats source: footywire.com

Good point too Roost. Maybe it should be titled "Is 2nd half of season our make or break time?" lol. Just muckin around! Ezy fellas....eeezy!

+1 on that. I hate the bombers with a passion though. Amongst others lol. Go out and stick em over a barrel Demons! It's Trident Time!!!

Melbourne vs Essendon Round 11, 2011 - Experience Stats Total games played by Team Demons - 1,138 Bombers – 1,642 Average games played by Team Demons - 52 Bombers - 75 Average games played by category 0-49 Demons - 14 / 14 (average games/number of players) Bombers - 21 / 13 50-99 Demons - 62 / 2 Bombers - 76 / 2 100+ Demons - 129 / 6 Bombers - 173 / 7 If you'd like me to include something else for comparison purposes feel free to give me a holler and I'll try. Time and ease of access/inclusion allowing. Cheers gang Stats source: footywire.com

Keep on punching Jimma. Hopefully that's the last of the little bastards outta there mate.

Yep. Pretty much what i was saying in terms of having some A graders and a mix of very good players across the lines. Otherwise you become too KPF centric. Not sure what point you're trying to make against my argument here RR. Maybe this is your way of reinforcing it? I never said i put the Hawks winning in 2008 down to the twin towers. What i was saying was, i personally think it helps having them there rather than not having them. Ditto the above for your one player centric comment below lol. I can't see a player the ilk of Jakovich sucking the life out of 'everyone else' at all. Not on match days anyway. Maybe off the field if he was behaving like a donk sure. Now who does that remind me of lol. But, provided he had half a brain off the field, i personally think it's a huge lift to those around on match days. Others can feed off his bullocking/contested work (if you have some decent crumbing mosquito types) and the accuracy that a KPF would bring on many occasions, could be the difference during close home & away games. I witnessed him play on many occasions (as i'm sure you did), and IMO he lifted those around him, they seemed to grow a leg when he was up and about. IMO others around him walked a foot taller lol. He was the big bull in the park, sticking it to the opposition no matter how much they were giving it to our boys. I always felt we could beat pretty much anyone when he was in the team, fully fit and in form. I'm sure the King/Plugger/Dermie and other KPFs would have had similar effects on their team mates much of the time too over the years. I very much doubt whether the Hawks could have had such an amazing run during their 80's (and 91) era of dominance without their two KPFs in the team, just being reliant on a power mid field and some balanced B graders up forward. Not saying a 'Lone' KPF is the panacea on GF day either without having other solid options across forward. In agreement with you there. I also prefer a solid/more balanced team across all lines, as i mentioned in my earlier thread, rather than being too reliant on one KPF. However, i think they could help during regular season games (including block busters) towards the team making a GF (or at least helping to push the team closer to making it). For example, if it came down to percentage in order to scrape into a top 4 placing or securing a home final etc, a few extra goals during the season from that one KPF, versus a competing opposition team who doesn't have any KPFs, could be the difference in tipping you over the line. Overall, i think we're pretty much in agreement as far as i can tell RR, the exception being you would reject a KPF (or at least one like Jakovich) in your team preferring to having a balanced/solid mid field that can kick the teams goals, whereas i would happily take both (and no i'm not saying i would only consider a reincarnation of Jakovich as such, just that i would take him or someone similar if i was lucky enough to have someone gift us that fairytale and offer us the option). Cheers mate B)

Wow. I would have thought if you stuck a power forward, who could actually kick straight, in the Cats team of last 4 years.... they would be unbelievably scary. May have picked up 2008. Mooney's a good leader but close your eyes when he takes a shot and was never a true power forward as such. Hawks won 2008 with the help of their twin towers, which we can never get close to. Smack us every time. Saints probably would have won the drawn game last year and may have even beaten the cats had they had a true power FF (or CHF) kicking straight on the day. Doubt he would have made the mistake Reiwoldt made when his kick running into goal was smothered. Maybe. I wouldn't say you don't need one. It's just when teams don't have a balance of A graders and a mix of very good players across the rest of the lines, then they tend to rely too much on that one player up forward and look for him too often. Like the Carlton/Fev situation is what i'm alluding to i guess. Give my eye teeth to have a Jakovich (without the loose screw lol) in our team atm. Hopefully Howe starts to shine....fingers crossed. Patience needed lol.

Going against your counsel a little on this one O.D. We're gonna need at least 1 or 2 of that ilk on the big expanses of the G tomorrow night. His ball use/delivery (once he's given it lol) is sublime in comparison to some in our team. His problem is, once he gets it, he generally has very little available (on the lead) when he's looked up forward of late. Not alone i realise. Hopefully with these "ins" he can also play up forward a bit more and kick a few bonus goals for us (crumbing) which we so desperately need. Hard to expect too much in this regard though on Friday night matches where ball tends to be pretty greasy. But all players have to deal with that aspect so no excuses i guess. If he ever builds an AFL body, starts laying tackles/putting pressure on his opponent/ball carrrier the other way and we develop the mid field the way the FD is aiming to, watch out. Gonna be one hell of a player IMO, subject to some other developments taking place for him in next season or 2 (see below). Until then i agree. Has much room for improvement on the defensive side and in many ways is limited to the larger more open grounds in this comp where his outside run and carry should be more valuable/effective (in theory). I'm happy to see other, more attacking/hard ball players in for him on the smaller grounds and where we have better alternative outside crew (or we're trialing them) as deemed appropriate by the FD. 42 games so far. One more pre-season for me is enough to start expecting much improved efforts/outcomes defensively (and offensively), before i'd be writing him off, as many on here do. Cheers O.D. B)

BIRTH OF THE HURRICANE! Thanks Greeny. Would have given Maric one more shot to fire off some salvos against all the criticism this week rather than Strauss. Apart from that i'm applauding!

To me the support we're showing is the carrot, and not just for present players. Potential players looking to come across see this sort of thing and it MIGHT ( i repeat might) mean something in their final decision making and go someway towards us securing their services if we're seeking them (eg., Juddy). What we also need is the stick. Where players who aren't meeting the agreed to and set down non-negotiables (over whatever period/KPIs the FD sets), are banished to the Magoos to try to work on and hopefully develop their game in order to earn their place back in the senior team. Regardless of seniority/experience!

Nice.... I also think any PR for our club, particularly given that it's us making a stand against our detractors, is good for the Club. Better than no news and the weeks just roll on without a whimper. Let em know we're here and not gonna take this crap anymore, both on the field, and off!

^^^ Exactly why it's needed. Thanks WA Anyway, we need every bogan we can get right now!

I want a MFC "Mighty Demons Creed" (referred to by the players and club as The Creed) placed above the race for all to see just before the players head out. The Captain gathers the boys below The Creed. Placed on either side of The Creed are pictures of 4 - 5 of our most recognisable greats in full flight, and above them is a picture of The Red Fox, the Great Norm Smith. Then, reading from the Creed (see below), while looking every team mate in the eye, The Captain says/asks of the players.... Will you leave everything you've got on the park this day for the Mighty Red & Blue, win lose or draw? Never say die and give it 110% during every contest including 2nd and 3rd efforts in honor of each other, your coach, your supporters and red legs of old? Take on all foes and put your body over the ball no matter what? Fight, scrap, scrag, shepherd, back into traffic, smother, chase until you drop and dive into packs to get the ball? Will you honor and do justice this day to a great legend and the spirit of the MFC, the greatest Australian Football coach in history (selected as the coach of the AFL's Team of the Century in 1996, who led the Mighty Demons to a staggering six premierships from 1955 to 1964), The Great Norm Smith? * Depending on the response he may need to repeat the first and/or 2nd line again, until he feels everyone's on board and revved! He then turns and leads his team mates up the race revving em on as they go. Hopefully to the mighty roar of a huge crowd of red and blue supporters giving it their all! I'm not saying the above is THE Creed. It can be worked on by greater wordsmiths and historians of the club than i before being finalised. But i think something like this prior to every match would be a great addition and tradition within the club and hopefully impress upon the playing group the minimum we expect if they're to play for this club (and reinforced just before the game). In addition, every player receives and must read a copy of the Red Fox as part of their induction to the club! * I'm not certain about this part. If kept it would probably need to be reduced in words somewhat....but the full version should at least be on the wall alongside the picture of Norm Smith, so that every player can clearly read it while standing there.

+1 Just don't go there....ughhh. Bit like the flag being raised before the game. Rather hear us start playing "Thunder", "Highway to Hell" or "Hells Bells" before the bounce. Get the crowd into it, the boys fired up a little (maybe lol) and toughen this club up a little pre-match! I also want the original "Fable Singers" version of our song to be played. The present one sucks IMO. We've gone soft and south ever since it's release lol!

Lol. You must've been watching through rose coloured 'Warnock' glasses WA. He was embarrassing last week and also against North and that's just 2 recent ones that come to memory. There's been plenty of others over the last few years. He has size and can take an uncontested mark, but that's about it. Terrible reader of the ball coming in high, poor body work often interfering with other fellow players in better position in the marking/spoiling contest and often spoiling their efforts when out of position, drops simple chest marks under no pressure resulting in turnover goals. And once the ball hits the ground it's 'chook without a head' time. Why would we want to continue giving senior game time to a player with these traits? This is the type of player that the MFC continues to have faith in year after year, whilst seemingly being unwilling to make the tough call and try potentially better alternatives, leaving other prospects to rot in the Magoos (unless we have a deft of injuries like we do now and we're forced to select alternatives outside of the regular favorites). While the somewhat more experienced but in the main, under-performing player, continues to rack up game after game, without actually being deserving, earning it or improving on past performance. Just maintaining his 'status quo'. No better, no worse, so lets just keep playing him and eventually, with enough experience, he should somehow improve and provide value!?? Not saying Warnock can't improve. I hope he can for his and our sake. But let him do a little time in the Magoos and work on it, before taking another look sometime down the track when he appears as if he's improved on aspects of his game. Same applies to anyone else IMO. If a player is showing something, gradually improving week to week or month to month (whatever the timeline is for assessment) and deserving of his place then fine. Let them continue and develop their game & gather experience. IMHO this 'easy going/she'll be right' attitude is one of the key reasons as to why the MFC often under performs, never quite taking the next step in our overall improvement/development into an "A" level AFL team. Always end up being 'B' grade team wise (at best) or when we bottom out we really bottom out....going from 'B' at best down to a 'C' or even worse. Then we tank and try to find alternative prospects with some early draft picks. Then the same approach/attitude/cycle continues. And then we supporters are left year after year saying...."why can't we find/develop enough players into an elite team...why are we always languishing as a mid rung team or worse year after year, decade after decade?" Warnock has 7 extra kilos and in his favour at this stage and 54 games advantage. Both the same height so no disadvantage there. Need to test other options at this point. Even if McDonald has 3 - 5 clangers, that's about par for Warnock as well. However, we at least get to see where McDonald is at and what he may have to offer as a a medium to long term prospect at this level. And yes, i realise it will take a lot more than 1 game to assess that.