Jaded No More

If that minor issue is mid-year exams, I would just like to say that: 1- I will happily tutor and/or sit his exams for him, especially if the exam is in psychology, which is a [censored] easy subject which I myself spent about 2 hours studying for 2- Suck it up Wattsy, we all have exams and you don't see us skipping the match

tsk tsk tsk... I guess being a Melbourne supporter rewards you with a lame sense of humour

Oh god that was so original, I mean I have never heard such witty and amusing snow references Opposition supporters are welcomed at Demonland, so long as they actually contribute to the discussion. Idiotic comments like the one above only makes you look like a fool, and is a sure fire way to get banned. Either post insightful thoughts, or go away. Thank you. Edit: Demonlanders, please don't take the bait!

Well now I think I'm going to die <_< We have such a rich history of duds wearing the number 4, no wonder they finally decided to give it to Jack. He is the best chance we've had in years of restoring that number to its former glory. No pressure Jack, you can add that to your list of things to do alongside completing VCE, winning the Coleman, a Brownlow, 4 B&F's, captaining 3 premierships, helping to save us from financial ruin, stopping the Swine Flu epidemic, solving the water crisis, and bringing peace to the Middle East

This is the one and only game I desperately want to win this year, and one which I would be very disappointed to lose for the following reasons; Firstly because a big crowd and free to air exposure means we need to pull ourselves together and show something decent. Secondly because we need to justify to the AFL that we deserve to keep this fixture going. Getting smashed is not going to help our cause. Thirdly, who doesn't love smashing Collingwood on the big day? And finally, I would really like for Jack and Jack to experience a win (poor Grimesy is yet to play in a win!), and indeed for every young kid in the side to feel what it's like to win on a big occasion in front of a big crowd

You're right, I feel a certain void since Dutchy retired

Do we need to start a "Jack Watts" board for this week, ala the Judd board (only with a better outcome! :angry: )? I hope people are excited for the right reasons, and not because they think Watts will kick 10 on debut and we'll win. I for one fully expect him to do little. Get a nice feel for the game, maybe kick a goal courtesy of the boys giving off a cheap kick/handball to ensure he marks and gets one early. The excitement will come from his physical presence on the field, and the possibility of the greatness he might provide us in years to come. Lets hope nobody comes on here on Monday night and starts a "Jack Watts is a dud, as if he didn't kick 10, delist him now!!!!!11" thread

I was contemplating deleting that link, but it's so funny and appropriate that I attached a warning instead That was pretty much my first reaction, which is actually quite disturbing

Hmmmm.... every single student who has exams starting the following day (like me), have just found yet another reason to justify going to the game over studying. I can feel the board going into meltdown mode regardless of whether this is true or not. Stand by mods :D

So do I, especially because he is a crap coach that was doing his absolute best to ensure Richmond steal pick 2 off us. Bastard! :angry: I tell you what I dislike even more though, is being genuinely poor for two years but missing out on picks 1 and TWO because some team that has been supposedly rebuilding for 15 years can't get it together. No way!

In: Cheney, Robbo/Newton (please be Robbo. Don't think I can handle Newton again) Out: PJ, Whelan I will probably get crucified for suggesting we drop Wheels, but to be honest he is just not accountable enough these days and I think Cheney desperately deserves a game. Miller could be under the pump as well, but in reality if you take him out we have nobody to replace him in that CHF position... unless we choose to play an undersized Sylvia. Jamar to be given the chance to ruck the entire game, with Martin helping out in the forwardline. If we could manage with PJ as lone ruckman, we can manage with Jamar too.

Why would you say that?! I hope Richmond win, it would hurt them a lot more if they win, than if they lose (and would benefit us greatly!). Lets hope that the caretaker coach wants to impress and can manufacture some wins for them as well (ala Riley :angry: :angry: ).

I agree that he should play soon, because a taste of AFL will do him a world of good. Here is what I think the issue is. If Watts was to play up forward, he will get little supply and essentially get wasted when he could have got a full running match under his belt with Casey. If you play him on the wing, he will probably tire out very quickly, which I assume is why they are playing him on the wing at Casey, they want to fast track his fitness. He probably needs a couple more weeks of hard midfield type running with Casey, and then he'll be ready to run out a full AFL game. Whether or not he is ready to dominate doesn't bother me, because I know he won't. What we need to be absolutely sure of is that he is right to play out an entire game on the wing/forward flank. We need to remember that he does not do full training during the week, and has only done 10 weeks of pre-season type program. Compare that to the countless hours our senior players spent on the track since Christmas, and you realise just how far behind he is in fitness. It's important that we don't overexert him physically and cause unnecessary injury, but it's equally as important that we reward him with game time for all the hard work he has put in. The other issue of course is that in Round 13 we play Brisbane at the Gabba, and I doubt they'll debut him interstate (or even take him on interstate trips, given he has school commitments). So assuming he doesn't play this Monday, his next opportunity is Round 12 against Essendon at Etihad, or Round 14 against West Coast at the G, which is my bet.

Jamar's work in close, and his contested marking (not to mention his ability to actually win a ruck contest), makes him 10 times more valuable than PJ. We have plenty of others capable of winning the ball in the middle and actually hitting targets more than once a game, we don't need another. What we need is contested marking around the ground, and getting first use of the ball through the middle. Jamar gives us both of these. Neither are good enough though.

Spot on. Only Brad Green has adapted well to the new plan, and his field kicking is an absolute asset to us. He is one of the few who can penetrate the 50m zone with a bullet pass. Bruce, Junior, even Whelan who I thought would adapt easily, are struggling with the run and carry style and make ordinary decisions time and time again. I know we can't just get rid of the only experience we have, which is valuable to our young boys, but we need to recognise that these guys are not part of the future. As such, both Junior and Whelan should call it quits at season's end, and Bruce needs to be a year by year proposition (as anyone over 30 should be). Doggo, I appreciate your fondness for PJ, and recognised that he battled manfully in the absence of our number one ruck. However, to blame his teammates for his terrible decision making and disposal is just silly. He finds a lot of space because essentially he plays on no-one, which is a worry to begin with. Then he gets the ball and takes a bit of a run, which is generally impressive for a big guy, but then he runs 20 and turns it over 9 out of 10 times and the opposition rebounds easily and most often score a goal. He was woeful last night in both his decision making and execution, and topped off an ordinary performance by giving away plenty of completely unnecessary free kicks. I am not a Jamar fan by any stretch of the imagination, but Jamar came in yesterday after having missed most of the pre-season and playing just two games this year, and absolutely dominated in the ruck. He also made an impact around the ground doing what a big man should do, taking contested marks and moving the ball quickly by hand to the nearest target. His game last night reminded me why PJ will never make it as anything more than a third-option ruckman, because if your size lends itself to rucking but you are not good enough to be first ruck, your only saving grace is finding another position on the ground. Trouble is, PJ is not a forward option due to lack of marking ability, and is disasterous in the midfield. Essentially, PJ is a midget trapped in a giant's body.

What was the deal with having him on the bench for nearly half a game?

There is no chance I'm wasting my time reading the same things I have read from you for 4 years. I know the gist. But you still don't get my issue here. I don't mind that we play 5 forwards, and I hate the bombing long tactic (especially given our current forward woes), and I understand the need for our forwards to push up the ground and switch back (and after two and a half years you still don't). My issue is that we are playing the wrong people deep in attack. Neither Jamar nor PJ are any sort of targets, and if Jamar is ever going to kick a goal, it's going to be from the goal-square (and even that is doubtful). What we are also desperately missing is CRUMBERS, and I like that Bailey played Bennell in attack in the last quarter. All in all, we have little to work with, and when you drop the one and only forward that can consistently take contested grabs and kick goals, you cannot expect the likes of Jamar and PJ to replace him. Are we ever going to see Green play an entire game as a leading forward?

Ummm, if you play in the midfield, you are under pressure. Period. Bruce is actually very good as a run-with player, and has been playing that role for many years with a lot of success. The skill errors and poor decision making have nothing to do with his role on the ground. Even under little pressure he makes mistakes.

6- Jamar 5- Rivers 4- Grimes 3- McLean 2- Warnock 1- Maric

Hooray, joeboy has seen the light! Agreed. Great performance from the big man. Good in the hitouts, great in the contested situations and did some clever things with the handballs. I actually think McLean is much cleaner both in close and in space. Moloney made a lot of really poor decisions by foot, and handballed to the opposition at least 2-3 times. Not his best game. McLean was much better tonight, and he had 8 clearances again (the next best was Moloney, with 4).

I agreed with the Robbo decision, as I just said. I also realise why Robbo was dropped, and it had nothing to do with his skills (again, I wrote that). But if one senior player is made accountable for their poor effort, why shouldn't others? Yes Bruce's issues are different, because he works hard and is accountable, but that does not eliminate the fact that he is making far far too many poor decisions by hand and foot and costing us dearly. Why is it OK to drop young players who are out of touch, or making poor skill errors, but the senior players can cruise by with barely passable decision making? If Bailey is serious about dropping players who are struggling (regardless of reason!), he should drop Bruce because like it or not, he is struggling with the game plan and has done so since the start. I think that a couple of weeks at a lower, slower level, will actually help him. He just needs to make that mental adjustment to the speed of the game plan and the way in which we should be moving the ball. I'm not suggesting we drop him, delist him, and never speak of him again. Junior is another who is really struggling, but that's another issue. tez, it does not matter what position you play, if you can't use the ball, you're in trouble.

Not even close. I love the contest that Whelan provides, but he is not accountable enough and he hasn't adjusted well to the run and carry style. He consistently makes poor decisions by hand. Cheney deserves an opportunity and Whelan is the only one that should make way for him. I hope like hell Watts kicks 11 tomorrow and gives Bailey no choice but to play him against the Pies.

Your issue was always about us needing to bomb it long, which is never a tactic that works consistently, particularly when you don't have any forwards capable of taking big contested marks. You also had an issue with us not playing enough forwards, which we actually do. Our forwards all push up the ground and are getting a lot better at running the other way when we win possession. My issue is that the forward targets we are choosing to play (note: we ARE playing enough forwards) are completely and utterly useless. Now obviously that is an issue to do with personnel, and not something that we can fix short term. At the moment we load up the backline with all the talent we have, because we know that we can't break even in the middle, so our best chance of attack is through the half backline. However, I would still prefer to have one of Green or Morton up forward, instead of having both of them down back. And if you are going to play Martin as a forward, just leave him in the square. Constantly switching up from deep forward to half forward to wing to half back is doing nothing for us. On a side note, can somebody please forcibly remove Paul Johnson? He has battled manfully when all our rucks died, but he is a completely terrible user of the ball and other teams know it. They let him get a million uncontested possessions which inevitably end up in their hands. Edit: I should clarify that when I said "How many times did we go inside 50 to nothing?" I didn't mean that we had no players in the forwardline. Nothing is another term for "terrible makeshift forwards that can't mark or kick"

Umpires = Disgusting SENIOR players turning the ball over time and time again (we're the ones in the red, ladies!) = Terrible Dwayne Russell = Press Mute

I didn't comment on the Robbo issue and dropping him, because in essence I agree with the decision, however I would just like to make two comments: 1- You can't drop one senior player for not performing, but let someone like Bruce continue to turn the ball over and make really terrible decisions every single week. I realise that Robbo was dropped for accountability reasons, but at least Robbo contributes 2-3 goals a game, while Bruce is costing us goals at the moment 2- You can't drop the only, and I repeat, only deep forward we have capable to taking marks and kicking goals consistently, and not even attempt to find a replacement How many times did we go inside 50 to nothing? Either play Green out of the square, and have our midfielders kick to him on the lead, or play Martin at FF and bomb it long. Jamar and PJ are not forward targets. And finally, we will continue to lose, competitiveness or no competitiveness, until we can eliminate the completely unnecessary amount of ill-directed handballs and start winning some contested footy on the back of long kicks (taking a mark one on one seems a completely foreign concept to us, and it goes back to my second point in regards to Robbo). On the plus side, I thought our backline was brilliant under constant siege and Grimes (and Maric and Bennell) will be a star!