PaulRB

Its an interesting puzzle to see how it might work. Just as an aside Footy is a sport, and ideally the opportunity to win should be even over time... I suspect that for it to work the following "limits" could be used to make the competition "even" and dynamic: A cap on total club expenditure of say 100 million p.a. Allocation of funds to rich clubs reduced, poor clubs supported to 100 million level. Creation of geographic draft zones (to allow clubs to benefit from developing local talent) with additional funds available to develop non-Footy Zones. Shift 50% talent from current draft system to Zoned system (i.e. Zone picks can be taken by their parent club later in draft like current FS) I'm sure I'm missing many factors and several will pronounce the idea lame because the EPL did this or I forgot that... My point is the current system is inequitable, restrictive and at times unwatchable (given the predictability of a game between a top four team and a bottom four team). A two tier system and a restructuring to make the flow of all teams between the two comps INEVITABLE makes for a real competition.

To answer you first question: in a world where there are other interests supporting the success of a club playing in B Div to move up and succeed in the A Div. For example, the Tas Gov't currently pour x million into Hawks and North to play on the island, they would be a stakeholder in a Tas team and support its rise. Alternatively, the AFL would do likewise for their preferred expansion team. Or a third Perth team might get there on the back of some Mining magnates ego trip... Diversity, opportunity. To your point about the interest in Canberra of watching their team in a B Div, the interest would come when their team won the B Div and moved up to the A Div... Highlighting where the concept has failed (Euro football leagues) is akin the the Wright brothers saying "no one else has flown, why should we even try". Others failure to do something is only persuasive if you are also intent on failing. To be honest I don't know how the payments and draft would work in a 24 team two tier competition. But if the AFL were to spend its spare 100 million on creating a B Div and restructuring the comp I'm sure the thought and money available for that coin would create a better solution than GWS.

We'd be looking at winning our first flag in fifty years... in the B League.

Imagine the joy at watching Carlton getting relegated, as they would have several years ago..

I hear what you are saying (despite living in a fantasy world ) and agree that the inequity in the various club's financial position is an issue, both now and in any future model. However, would the MFC got their [censored] together quicker as a club if we'd suffered the humiliation of relegation? My view is the AFL is too controlling and unwilling to create a structure that allows for the evolution of clubs to and from the top level of the comp. Perhaps, when contemplating adding GWS and GC, the AFL could have looked at two 12 team divisions (first division and second division), hived off the two four weakest AFL teams and added 10 licenses (including GWS, GC, Hobart, ACT, etc...) with two teams going up and down each season. This would have had some benefits 1. made the fixture in both divisions able to be even (i.e. play each other team twice) 2. able the market and strength of the teams decise the mix in the top comp 3. allowed the AFL to still pump cash into their expansion projects 4. Allowed footy to access Government support (Tas Gov, ACT gov, NY Gov) to support their fanchises. 5. punished failure in the top division, maintaining interest in the bottom four games 6. rewarded success in the second division...

At the moment the Victorian based clubs (Hawks, North, us etc...) prop up their revenue and membership number by token associations with Football loving areas (Tas, ACT, NT, etc..). Kind of reminds me of the British empire drawing resources from its colonies to prop itself up. Its a construct that the AFL (derived from and serving the interests of the Clubs involved) maintains as a lip service to the aspirations of those areas to have their OWN team. In addition, to providing traditional footy areas to have their own team and identities, a second division with promotion and relegation would be a far better place to for the AFL "birth" an expansion team as it pursues new markets. Both GWS and GC were not at an AFL acceptable level when they entered the AFL competition, and should have started in the second division and had to earn the right to play in the AFL. Likewise, several AFL teams (MFC included) have under performed in part because there was a. a reward for doing so (draft picks) and b. because there was no penalty for being hopeless... A meritocracy determining which Teams play in the AFL as opposed to the "empire expanded" approach to date... For example, Hobart enter a team in the AFL second division and win through to the AFL, after several year they play finals and one day snag a flag! As Bill Murray said "Cinderella story. Outta nowhere. A former greenskeeper, now, about to become the Masters champion. It looks like a mirac... It's in the hole! It's in the hole! It's in the hole!" and its that kind of story that will expand the competition...

Good luck and best wishes to him. He did his best.

A second division AFL with promotion and relegation allows the game to evolve beyond it's historical base as the markets and opportunities across Australia, New Zealand , etc... emerge. Certainly the issue of only four or five teams ever having a chance of winning the premier league identifies a flaw that would have to be addressed. similarly any AFL second division would have to be aligned with the state leagues. But the state leagues are already "ruined" by the insertion of AFL reserve teams, etc... so it would simply need to be worked through. My issue with GWS is that the AFL is spending millions trying to graft a team on an ambivalent audience in Western Sydney while neglecting to provide a path forward for those passionate supporters of footy in Tas, ACT, NT etc... Look back 50 years to 1964 and the AFL (then VFL) was a state comp. Look forward 50 years to 2064 and if managed and expanded well the AFL will be a different beast to what we see today... I'm sure in 1964 they didn't see us discussing the merits of spending a 100 million dollars establishing a team in Western Sydney.

Given the money in the game I'd suggest the opportunity the AFL are missing is to create a vibrant second division of teams and create an opportunity for the ACT, Hobart, Launceston, Darwin, Auckland, North Shore, etc... and the pick of the independent teams from the state comps (i.e. Williamstown, Glenelg, etc... ?) to play in a AFL National second division. This would explore and allow these teams to develop their markets, develop and sell players to the first division... And allow the AFL to explore promotion and relegation between the two divisions at some future date.

Fit and firing we've added about 5 players to our 22 who'd get a game in most sides (Clark, Hogan, Vince, Tyson, Dawes*, Cross*) with the loss of one (Col). It's gotta help.

Spirited away is pretty kid friendly… Parents get turned into pigs is about the worst moment, and any sane kid would enjoy that, having seen it many times. Great films. Merry X

If we have any success in the 2-3 years Roos has promised us, Neeld will have to be acknowledged for laying part of the foundations.

The fact that Roos, an experienced successful coach with little to prove, has taken on the role of coach at Melbourne says several things about Neeld's work... 1. the list turnover and fitness work has laid the foundation for the players to compete at the top level in 2014. 2. the bones of the list were within ONE DRAFT and a preseason of significant improvement 3. Dawes and Clark left only the midfield to complete which is the easiest piece... Roo's is no fool and would not sully his reputation with taking on a 5 year rebuild of an unfit, ill disciplined and mediocre list. Neeld did that, to Roos will go the spoils. Smart man.

^^^ Bingo!

I feel sick.

I'd love it if some of our players played with the aggression of a Serena or Venus Williams, Lauren Jackson,... ... I know is a "footy forum" so misogyny is expected... but in my book misogyny is far more tedious and offensive than the who said it about whoever...

Amazing definition. No fat on that...

Depressing that 29 of our list are yet to play 50 games. With 19 of that number yet to play a seasons worth of AFL footy... A way to go.

If Wonna was serious about getting to the VFL to enable him to restart his AFL Career he'd pay the $10k himself...

It appears we have the pieces and with luck on the injury front and being able to realise the potential on the list we could surprise. And we'd have to be owed some luck. On the game plan, I'd think its three simple elements that well integrated are the basis for a rapid improvement in our fortunes: 1. Win stoppages and contested ball - the addition of Cross, Vince, Michie, and Tyson along with another year into Jack Viney, Matt Jones plus N Jones continuing means we should be solid around the ball, be able to hold our positions and exert more physical pressure in contested situations. Included here is improving our ruck situation with the emergence of the next No 1 ruck needing to happen (Gawn or Spencer). A 10-20% improvement in this area to start to break more even in this area is the key to improving our fortunes. 2. Spread, create space, get ball to outside mids - Jack Watts, Toumpass, Howe, Salam, Barry, Blease form a creative collection of skilled players who can break lines and deliver the ball. Improved stoppage and contested work sets these players up in space and on the move. This area should again improve us by 10+% for better feeds from the inside mids and better targets down field. 3. Forward options and marking power - not since the days of Neita and Swartz have we had the possibility of such a powerful marking forward line, Clark, Dawes, Fitzy, Howe and Hogan will provide headaches for many teams and great targets for outside mids to hit with precision, and inside mids to bomb to when the heat is on. Also allows us to work the ball up the boundary line (as the pies do at times with cloke) when we need to grind it out... As these three areas of our game improve, confidence will rapidly follow.

True re- Watts Fatigue, and understandable. Just have the feeling that Roos will get the best from Jack, and that Jack is ready and able to really hurt teams.

Jack Watts - Surprised he's yet to feature in lists. Can play forward, can play back, great kick and now physically able to impose himself. New coach bringing him into the midfield surrounded by solid in and under mids able to get the ball to him (and Toumpas) to deliver with precision into our forward line... He will tear teams up this year. Bernie Vince - Pride will be a big factor for Cross, Tyson and Vince, all discarded (traded) and with something to prove in 2014. Vince will hit the ground running and relish some big days in the spotlight on the G. Has all the tools and experienced enough to know how to turn it up... will kick goals and lift the team often. Max Gawn - The ruck position is up for the taking, with Jamar seemingly injury prone and in decline. Max has talked it up, but lacked the strength and stamina to match it with the true ruck monsters for the four quarters to date. The addition of Stafford indicates Roos wants improvement in this area. If Max can mature physically, team (80:20) with Clark/Fitzy, and at least break even in the ruck position we'll have a better year.

What happens when you have two bulls (Clark and Hogan) in a china shop!!??

Like ^^^ Meditation works to quiet the mind allowing better focus and intuitive action to rise... Might also help Jack to cope with vomiting "more in the next 3 months than he has in his life" hee hee hee Bring it on Roosy!

I reckon Terlich could evolve into a similar midfielder to Mitch Robinson. Attacking, physical, in your face...