DeeSpencer

Mason Cox played 26% TOG in the forward line in the grand final. If Peter Wright was a capable and willing ruck and was happy to play just 26% time forward I’d be fine with him. He isn’t, he’s a reluctant ruck who plays best as a full forward. We need someone who compliments JVR and hopefully Jeffo.

Agree. Let Judd learn to walk before we expect him to run, he's got to master half back before this idea that he's suddenly a gun mid anywhere near the level of 2 of the best players to come through the under age system in years. Dyl Williams did a fantastic job for Port last year then lost his spot this year, he'd be one I'd watch as a potential back pocket. Plus look to the state leagues and bring a bunch of guys in over summer to see if they can earn a spot.

Grand final: Cox 67% Cameron 59% (Mihocek 92%, Frampton 82%) Prelim Cox 71% Cameron 70% (McStay injured 66%, Mihocek 94%) Qualifying final (when they had their best side available for the full game time) Cox 67% Cameron 52% subbed (McStay, Mihocek both 88%) Aside from 1% against the Giants (which was probably when McStay was down injured) they never played 4 talls on the ground at the same time. And when they did play a ruck in the forward line it was generally Cox filling in for Frampton in the grand final, covering McStay's injury in the prelim or briefly for McStay/Mihocek to have a breather. We tried sitting Gawn/Grundy on the bench for longer periods or forward line and neither of them liked it. And I doubt that will ever change for Max, especially if the rotation is with Peter Wright who will have no desire to ruck for large parts of the game. JVR should get there with time but I don't see him on the McStay level of athleticism just yet and definitely nowhere close to Mihocek who is just a freakish work horse who goes hard for 90% game time at CHF (or did for years until injury this year). Unless you're Nick Riewoldt that's a job for a 24/25+ year old not a kid who will still only be 22 next year. If they really do think JVR is ready to play CHF then maybe a Peter Wright level lump at FF/Ruck would work, but there's still a matter of the other tall forward needing some agility and ground game (much like the way Jamarra fits in between Naughton and Darcy) and I'm not convinced that will be Jeffo or anyone else on the list any time soon. I'd go hard for a genuine answer like Waterman and leave JVR as the back up ruck for the next couple of years or just keep experimenting with mobile ruck/forwards and try to find a Chol rather than a Fullarton. Wright would be a distant 3rd choice if there's nothing else available and the price is very right.

I think their plan is to move Houston's salary in to Perryman as a free agent. Get 80% of the player on the same $$ and bank some really nice draft picks. Especially because their half back depth is huge - behind Houston they have Farrell, Bergman, Logan Evans, Burton, Jones, Burgoyne, Sinn, Dyl Williams Meanwhile they need high draft picks to replace Boak, Wines and find genuine quality talls at both ends of the ground. It's a tactic I think more teams should try to pull off when they can land a quality free agent.

Poor Kossie and Nibbler trying to chase 6 blokes. Wright is slow. JVR is....not quick. Any forward or forward/ruck that we bring in should have some athleticism especially if the plan is for some combination of Melk/Jeffo/Petty/Disco as the 3rd tall option. I also don't understand the concern with JVR as back up ruck and/or the belief that he's ready to explode. He shows some flashes and he'll be a good player for a long time but I still expect him to just improve steadily and the runs in the ruck get him involved in the game.

JVR on the record about something that didn’t exist? JVR kicked 36 goals from 18 vfl games in his first year and they deliberately held him back from a late season AFL debut so he had a big summer to get physically ready. Jeffo in year 2 is now right on pace for where JVR was in year one. There’s some risk and reward to playing him when he’s still not physically ready but it shouldn’t matter much either way.

They have the cash. But I just don’t see a lot of value in having 2 of the games best 10 key forwards, a gun ruck and almost no talent in the midfield or backline (under 30) not named Harley Reid. If I was an eagles I’d sell off Waterman if the price was right. They just have so many needs and the draft is such a mess, if you can grab a second top 10 pick in a strong draft as a rebuilding side it helps so much.

Flags are nice but there’s at least a dozen eagles from that time with far bigger profiles. And that’s not close to Todd’s legacy nor the impact Jack has had as a high draft pick coming in at rock bottom and playing a key role (alongside his dad) in turning it around. I don’t think it’s in the same ballpark.

I’m not from Perth but does the Waterman name have nearly the same connection as Viney to mfc? His brother has already been delisted and played at Essendon. The eagles are in year 3 of being terrible with maybe 3 more to come, where as ‘19 was a disaster but we were always going to bounce back to some level. The biggest factors might be that the eagles low balled him last year so he isn’t that keen to do them a favour. And from the Eagles side they need picks to get this rebuild moving and Barrass alone won’t get too many early ones in. With Oscar Allen plus a couple of decent forward/ruck role players in Jack Williams and Bailey Williams maybe you sell high on Waterman and use the cash on Tim English for free.

FF: Pickett JVR Tracc HF: Chandler ????? ANB C; Langdon ????? Windsor HB: McVee ???? Lever FB: ???? May ??? Foll: Gawn Rivers ???? Int: Viney Tholstrup Bowey ???? Probables: Oliver, Fritsch, Salem, Petty Possibles: Jefferson, Disco, Sparrow, Spargo, Woewodin, Melk? T Mc? Need to sort the talls out and recruit ready to go tall depth, 1 at each end. Need a back pocket to free McVee up the field. Need a high quality on baller so Viney and Petrraca can both play forward more. Get most of that sorted and the team will be back in contention if they put in a huge amount of work and stay healthy in summer.

Is there a different Peter Wright?

We won a flag after trading Watts and Hogan. You got evolve the list and give talent to get talent.

If we put Chandler, JVR, Pickett, Tracc, Melksham and hopefully from next year Jefferson in the Fritsch role they’d kick 80% of the goals he kicks. And we’d more than make up the other 20% because we’d have someone who competes on the deck, can lead up and crash a pack and we can mix and match based on match ups. He’s a one dimensional player in a side that’s crying out for different options. The time is right to cash in now before he has no value left.

Tracc’s lack of pace and tank around the ground have been issues the last 2 years. Not to mention some of his horrendous turnovers. I don’t think the move forward this year was purely for forward line bite. A good part of it was to remove his weaknesses from the midfield (especially when Oliver and even Gawn were having the same weaknesses). So it kind of depends what kind of physique he has coming back from injury. If he’s lost muscle and can build his fitness base quickly he might play more mid. The injury could have a silver lining. But if he struggles to build that base then he was heading towards a forward role anyway. It’s a scary thought but I think we are looking at almost a complete on ball rebuild over the next few years.

I’m not going to speculate on Oliver but the footy he’s currently serving up is horrendous. Petracca, Pickett and ANB are better overall forwards than Fritsch. JVR should be soon. Heck I wouldn’t be surprised if Chandler finishes higher in the B+F. We are playing with 17 on the field when one guy constantly tries to get out the back, never chases, tackles with no intent or technique so consistently gives away free kicks and can’t play in any other role.

Of course he’s not Cameron but the point is the 3 first rounds Geelong gave up turned out to be next to nothing when they got 2 early 2nds back. If we gave up 2 late firsts and got at least 1 early second back it would be a similar kind of result where the price isn’t really the price. We aren’t getting value for Oliver but if we pay a bit of the contract I still think a team takes the risk for an early 2nd. Geelong, Adelaide they aren’t going to get an A grade midfielder in his prime age any other way. Net result, Oliver out, Houston in and we’ve shuffled back in the draft from late firsts to early seconds. Doesn’t read well on paper but could be really good for the team. But we’ll see if Port are willing to accept that deal and it relies upon us bouncing back next year and the year after. So it’s still less likely than likely.

There’s 2 firsts and then there’s ‘2 firsts’. If it’s picks in the mid to late teens and in return we get one or more 2nd or 3rd rounders then that could be a heist. The cats gave 3 for Jezza Cameron and got pretty much the same picks back with 2nd rounders as valuable some of the firsts would’ve been. There’s also a question of what else we do with the list. I’d have Oliver and Fritsch sold to the highest bidder assuming the reserve prices are met. And if that happens then it would almost be imperative that we bring in some experience and quality in the Houston age range. Our first rounder this year should be off the table (aside from splitting it back a few picks). Anything else should be available.

I’d say more like 70% of games and even in others there’s rotations, I just think he drifts a little at half back. Defensive positioning and attacking work rate both still developing. I’d train him for both but if Rivers builds his tank he’s the defender who moves permanently on ball first. Maybe there’s some benefit to a look at him now but I still think he’s learning by the week how to do more at half back.

To the list, we’ve relied on super raw kids to come in down back and forward (and man a wing all year with no break).

Their list has some big age concerns and Carlton could’ve ended their season last night but I appreciate the way they’ve done their absolute best to support an ageing midfield group in season. We’ve done nothing to add fresh legs to a team that looked dangerously short of running depth all year.

I agree, and maybe because they are in their window and we haven’t been this year but the Pies reacted to midfield injuries by signing Sullivan and Bytel over summer and Long (from their vfl team) in the mid season draft. Even if there wasn’t more to be done with JJ and Bedford to get them to stay we’ve been down on personnel all year and only added a kid tall forward fresh out of the WAFL reserves.

Have you watched us this year? We’ve re-invented the game plan, so much more run and risk taking from the backline, especially the young players who aren’t set in their ways. We’ve added speed and skill to the midfield from very limited choices (Rivers, ANB, Kossie).

JJ’s just a role player but he’s exactly what we are missing now, and we took him out of the side for 1 year of Hunter being no better. Short term - no gain, for long term negative. Tomlinson took it for a while but Petty was always coming to take that job. He was the same player after the injury, he just had a run of games that he was never going to live up to. He pretends to try. Runs hard, but protects himself in contests, rarely leaves his man to cover, doesn’t crash packs, doesn’t break tackles or even hold up under pressure with his ball use.

He’s in the De Goey, Dusty, Tracc, Rayner mold, hasn’t put a full season together this year so the midfield stuff is more potential, kind of much like Rayner now I guess. Not sure you can pick him over a sure fire gun midfielder, but then again I’m not 100% convinced by any of the mids in this draft just yet. Lots of really good ones, not sure how many are high level difference makers.

Hunter taking up a spot in the team alienated JJ, took Gus away from his wing role, lowered our team speed, lowered our overall hardness level. The league was only getting faster and we decided to get a guy who sat way outside and chipped it 30m. And that’s without even the impact he might’ve had on our off field culture. Tomlinson played a bunch of decent games when we had the best team defence you’ll ever see and dominated field position. In a role that he was never recruited to play because he failed miserably as a winger. It was a panic move after 2019 to try to find a second winger. 5 years when he was dropped from the giants first finals team because he was too slow even then.