rpfc

I know, and I then did the same, and then allowed someone to make a joke on my joke thinking it was a non-joke.

Roos has played him in every game. He has established himself. In Dunn's 7th year he played 11 games. And Watts will be Watts, not Goddard, not Dunn. He can be a high HFF that pushes into the forward line with excellent kicking skills and vision. As a Demon - I want that. I want that player.

No, he didn't. That's the joke...

I saw with my eyes. And Dunn failed as a tagger and failed as a forward. He had terrible judgment and thought that toughness was one jumper punch away. In 2013, his 9th year on the list - he established himself as a defender and a member of the best 22. According to Roos, HFF is the role that Watts can excel in make his own - and is in the process of doing that. Well ahead of Lynden. And my point wasn't that all players get 9 years to come through - my point was that the time, patience, and faith shown in certain players should be reciprocated to other players if the coach can see something. Evidently, Roos can see something.

Maybe if you read past my first line you might be less antsy?

Well said. I have no problem with people being wrong on players - we all are - I just really hate the term 'clogger' and terms like it and the nonsense it implies about the people that are described in such a way. My inference is that Jetta was never a 'clogger' and that his emergence should make people pause about how they regard players.

I am so glad they are not rushing him back to play this piddly little game against GWS. WCE in Perth will be a big event for one of the boys and that sometimes can be enough to get the rest of the boys up and about. And performing over in Perth will be a big step for this group.

Yes, Dunn and Pedersen are more comfortable with the physical side of the game (although we all remember the aftermath of Pedersen's first game do we not?). But that isn't everything in footy is it? Watts is ahead of Dunn at the same stage in their career - some should stop right now and drink that in a little bit - and Watts has shown more with regard to skill execution and decision making and hard running than many, and all of those have improved markedly over the previous years.

A few on here get frustrated when I talk about 'role players' but Roos is proving me right this year with the specific roles he has given Pedersen and Jetta. If you can stick to your task and be that little cog in the machine you can be very useful once all the other little cogs are doing theirs. But you need a motor to get everything going and moving quick and our 'engine room' just doesn't have the capacity or quality that other teams have (just to bring that back to a common footy metaphor).

Not as interesting as the posters who were convinced that Jetta was a 'list clogger' being proven utterly and completely wrong to the point where their own introspection should put into question their knowledge of football. Because no-one goes from 'list clogger' to one of the best small defenders in the game...

Here is the current status of the list after Jetta being upgraded. I am inclined to believe Riley has another year on his contract but who knows with Clisby? That is not rhetorical. Who knows?

Johnstone got us Grimes and Sylvia got us Vince. I am really glad someone else sees what I am saying - if we go to footy clubs in October and ask what can we get for Watts - we will be given a smirk and a bad deal. Roos and co. have to make a decision based on the chances a draft pick can be better than Watts and the chances Roos can make a consistent player out of Watts. If Roos has a 30% chance to get something out of Watts and the draft pick would have a 16% (1 in 6) of being a success - Roos should back himself. This is incredibly unscientific and judgement based, but Roos has got to say to himself whether he can see something - and if he can - back himself and the club he is rebuilding.

One mans list clogger is another mans excellent small defender. I am so happy for him and the club and the fans. Well done to him and well done to all the (many) various admins that kept him around for him to make such a difference in 2014.

Rewritten to make sense.

Like Dunn and Jetta... The club and its list manager should make the best decision available to it at the time for the players they will bring and those that are out of contract - draft well, recruit well. Rise and repeat. That is how you build a list, not by making decisions based on emotion which, I am sorry to say, I think you are advocating and that I know Neeld made. Martin for Pick 54, Moloney for nothing, Morton for nothing a year before his contract was up - these were never sound decisions whatever one feels about the player - the list sighed and creaked at the lack of desire to get value from the player (either in output on the list or through their trade/future deletion). Those that want us to remove Tapscott, Blease, Strauss, Bail, Byrnes, Terlich, and Nicholson with Clark and Frawley gone or likely to go AND pay out the contracts of (or trade away for nothing) Evans, McKenzie, Fitzpatrick, and M.Jones AND trade out Watts and Trengove for the sake of parlaying a message to the group - those that see this as right and proper are never going to see the list being properly built; 15 players out for the possible return of Pick 4 and 30 for Frawley and Watts. And the requirement to use the last 5 or 6 picks in the ND just to fill out the list. I shudder to think how the list would look like if Neeld had another off-season in charge - don't we all? Well, those that advocate the massive cleanout at the end of this season - that's what you leering toward even if you don't see it.

And now you are unfairly attributing to posters that challenge the criticism of Watts to being 'bashers.' I criticise him, how can you not, but there is reasoned critiques and then there is senseless berating and constant tirades. Don't fool me that there isn't, or that the reason is not drowned out by the berating and the tirades.

Almost forgot about Trengove. What a godsend he would be if we could get him fit and role in the midfield (even better if we could find him a yard of pace). But there is no value to remove the bloke and 'jackaub' posted he was 'part of the problem' whatever that means. Everyone seems to be 'part of the problem' until they are 'part of the solution' if they have been kept around and we start to see more success.

Hypnotise the sh!t out of him, or into him as it were... One thing about the floating - I am certain he has been told that he has just got to be present as a release out the back of contests to kick the ball (as he is almost alone with his skills at the club) but that he is having trouble with the balance of that and hitting the contest when he needs to. That married with the fact he is not naturally inclined to hit contests has led to these poor efforts that we see so blatantly. I still maintain he is far from alone with the number and gall of those poor efforts - it's just his seem to catch the eye more for various reasons.

We need more talented midfielders. The fact that we go about 4 deep in there is what is killing us. Tyson, Vince, and Cross were godsends, and need a few more gifts from Heaven. Salem, Kent and JKH will join those Jones, Viney, Vince, and Tyson at some point but we need established mids to help right now. Otherwise, I fear we will be running on the spot next season. Hogan, Dawes, and Pedersen/Gawn can be moulded into a functioning forward line and our backline has the foundations of solidity if not finesse. It's the middle we need to get more talent and ready made talent.

If he wants to come back into the Demon family, he is more than welcome. This club has seen it fair share of nonsense in the past 50 years and we are a shell of our former self because of it. We hold grudges against our own too easily and for too long. We are not big enough or strong enough to be so damning and insolent. This club will take back Moloney, and Ridley-ites, and Schwab, and Gardner, and McLardy, and Connolly, and anyone else spurned rightly or wrongly. We will take them back because we can't afford not to.

He's in the first year of a three year contract after being convinced by the coach to return to the club. I just don't see Roos giving up on himself more than anything. And Watts has shown more in his first 6 years than Dunn did; so there is always hope that he can show what he has shown - in many quarters and halves and the odd game - over a more consistent period.

Nah, he plays in our team...

I hope that those that want to trade Watts and think Watts would be good in a good team are not the same that want to trade Watts as they think he is a VFL level player - because the two views do not compute.

He is, of course, welcome back to the club if he wishes. That isn't to say he acted with great regard to the club in the lead up to him leaving, nor that the club did the best by him in that period. But he played quite a few games for this club and played well. Well done.

Could just have been a match up thing. Gawn is better as a second ruck, Pedersen better as a forward but if you don't think Pedersen will trouble the Hawks defenders - sending out the bearded lamp post can be a good alternative. I think Pedersen has shown he can be a very good utility with good skills and a great grab. Roos should be able to find him a role for the next couple of years.