deanox

jaded, that doesn't affect what we have observed in regards to a number of our promising young players being injured and set back by significant injuries.

In exams, I know I don't have the time to do it now, but I would be interested to see number of games played (missed) since debut for rising star nominees from all clubs for the above years. It would be hard to rule out omittance due to form, but it would be interesting to see if our players have missed a disproportionate number of matches compared to other clubs rising youngsters.

Really shouldn't be hard, the other two nominations are just goals. But head to afl.com.au and vote for Liam! Link: http://www.afl.com.au/competitions/goal/goal.aspx

good to see you back around ash, it has been a while since i've noticed you.

the reason he gets it, stops then short passes is because the opposition know what he is doing and make sure they are standing in front of him when he gets the ball. he is then left with no where to go.

I would even suggest WJ, that 2 goals against fletcher in 2/3 of the game is break even stats, even for an experienced forward. And to think he was free a couple of times and ignored. What would people be saying if he had've kicked 4? Send him back he is too skinny?

no i realised it was tongue in cheek NJ! i'm not so sure about the curse, but the analysis showed something I hadn't really considered before. I think you accidentally did some great research!

i was but im not now hahaha too much homework, not enough sleep. i really shouldn't be posting here at all!

what we need is for other players to also come past looking for the handball recieve from players like jamar and stef who we'd prefer not to kick it. it is a farce when davey runs 25 meters backwards, just to loop around jamar and get a handball. the defender knows what is happening straight away and instead of following him just goes to the other side of the mark. davey is then stuck because he can't kick on his right foot. other players doing it occasionally would help (i.e. grimes or bennell from the back line (or even frawley)). also if it is simply not on, the player should just go back and kick to a contest.

i wouldnt drop anyone from the backline. personally id rather him on the wing. i don't want to drop any of the kids, so really i am talking about dropping bruce and putting wheatly on a wing and some of the younger kids in the guts. this isn't a win, so i wouldn't bother. he only gets a gig if his form demands it. if not this year he will probably struggle.

I hope we lose to WCE. I will yell for us the whole time, I will be excited and happy if we win, but I hope we lose. There is no benefit in us winning that game. end of story.

Best article on Watts so far since he played. That being said, I don't see the hurry to get him out of the side. He is performing exactly how we thought a young KPP would perform. I have seen other kids play worse and keep getting games. The question, will e get more benefit at Casey or at MFC? If they think having the chance to get lots of the ball at a slower pace will do him benefit go for it. If they think the problem is needs to adjust to the pace of the game, leave him in. I don't have any problem with his size. Not everyone has to play like Jonathon Brown, and its not like he is small. 196 cm and 87 kgs officially. Frawley is 191 and 91, but he wasn't last year. Rivers is 192 and 90. Morton is 192 and 83.

But I digress, I think your stats are fantastic, but what they show is that our youngsters have missed significant development. Add players like blease and grimes, and the list extends further.

i think you'll find their median age lower than ours (the wholes lists, not the teams for that day) us 22 yrs, theres 21 8 months. however, they have 10 players over 27, to our 6. and 12 over 26 to our 7. It is not strange that we struggle to win games when you consider our 7 over 26 compared to their 12: McDonald, Robertson, Bruce, Whelan, Green, Wheatley, Miller, Rocca, Prestigiacomo, O'Bree, Lockyer, Johnson, Davis, Medhurst, Fraser, Brown, Bryan OK not all of the collingwood players are getting games ever week, but the quality of their seniors players overall is much better than ours. Bruce, Green Mcdonald and Robbo are the only who contribute of our lot. Bruce is wasted possessions galore, Robbo is not a leader and sets a poor example for the younger players, and McDonald is past his prime, and while he has been a great servant was never an A grade player. Green, at the moment, is the only on our list that stands out.

i agree morton should be played on a wing, or in the centre. against collingwood he spent large amounts of the game at full back, and only went into the middle in the last quarter, when he got 10-15 touches. against essendon he played elsewhere. it is all part of the player development at this point in his career. disagree RE watts on the wing. i would rather see him played out of the square and lead up the guts. we dont have a full forward, and he is good on the lead - good pace, good hands, good kick. he wont win 1 out marking contests, but no one in our side will win those.

very interesting analysis NJ, but maybe not for the reasons you've put forward. Have you considered that part of the reason we are struggling now is because of the hampered development of a number of our standout youngsters over the past 5 years? When Malthouse commented the other week that the average collingwood player was younger than the average melbourne player in that match it got me looking through data. He was right, the collingwood players were on average 1 month younger, however on average, the collingwood players had 11 more games of experience each (is interesting that they had an average of 2.5 kg extra per player, but only .5cm per player extra height, suggesting greater physical or development).

i thought he actually said that players were currently on front ended contracts, ie the only reason we are currently paying 92.5% is because of the front ended contracts. i would imagine that a front ended contract is something like a 3 year deal where you get 250, then 150 then 150 for the 3 years, for an average of 200 per year. i can't imagine that it is a three year contract above the odds, with the knowledge that your less contract will be worth less than market value.

Yes. Well nbot true actually. We are closer to Carlton than Hawthorn, who had a group of senior players to help the youngsters on. croad, dew, guarerra, mitchell, osbourne, williams, and craw last year. a few other continued playing while the list was developing (vandenberg). We don't have any senior players playing with leadership and experience. Carlton had the same hole we have. They recruited Judd and Stevens, houlihan and waite have come on.

too often they give the ball to davey when there is a player in front of him waiting to tackle. it means he is then fored to kick sideways or cough it up. it is a great tactic. but we now need to develop tactics B and C and D for the rest of the year. shelve the davey tactic. Or use it occassionally. next year we can have 4 options and use the one that is not being targeted at the time.

IF wheatly can find form and get back in the side, it will do him no harm. At 28 he probably has another 3-4 years left on the list, especially given that pace has never been one of his major assets, rather his long kicking, which probably won't diminish. Whether he stays on or not comes down to a couple of things such as how many of the other older players are moved on/retire i.e. robbo, wheelan, mcdonald, as we do want to keep some experience around, and how many of the younger players have done their dash and the club has decided they won't make it? you may not want to get rid of all your experience, but experience doesn't really help you the side when it is playing for casey. other developing clubs may have had experienced players around to help out (read crawford, dew etc) but players like that own their positions. They are quality players who not only lead through age and behaviour, but lead with performances. We don't have senior players who do that. And I am not sure that 'experience' is important if it isn't good enough to get a game. It wouldn't surprise me if we are behind some of these sides in the rebuild due to the fact that our leaders, seniors, and experienced players, don't have the quality of some of these other clubs (lloyd, lucas, fletcher, johnson, akermanis, eagleton, brown didak, fraser, johnson, presti).

fixed. Expect him to play next year, but don't expect him to have a break out year. if he plays 15-22 games next year and kicks 20-35 goals I will be very happy. he was drafted at 196 cm and 83 kg. has supposedly put on 7 kgs since he got to the club although is quote at only 86kg in the same article (http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,2...4-11088,00.html). Either way, this summer he will probably crack the 90kgs, and I would expect that 2010/2011 summer he would be pushing 94-5, which will be when he starts to be strong enough to hold his own. Also: Watts could play out the year

anyone at the game would have seen how early the melbourne side came out before 3 quarter time. they were made to do some run throughs and warm up drills for 4-5 minutes before essendon ran out. the coaching staff were trying to get the boys back and ready to hit the quarter, to get the first 5 minutes over and done with in the warm ups. it didn't work. I am starting to suspect that the 3rd quarter is a player mentality. they expect to get smashed in the third quarter, and therefore it happens. it has come a habbit that they can't break.

he gets a game because while he is on our list bailey will reward form, and he was amongst the best (if not the best) for casey vs werribee a couple of weeks ago.

So who have you left out? Wheelan, Wheatly, Robertson, McDonald, Jamar, Johnson? You have only named 26 players, we will need more than that. Jamar and PJ both won't go. The others are all on last legs. Although it wouldn't surprise me if robbo goes on for another year.

Jaded, the point is, we trumpeted his arrival with fanfare, and brought the attention onto him. I don't think we handled it particularly poorly, however if I was Jack I might disagree. We now must handle the focus in an appropriate way, instead of sticking our heads in the sand and saying 'leave him alone he is only 18'. We need to deal with the fall out, which was always going to happen. Post Queens birthday we haven't handled it particularly well. In fact we haven't handled it at all.