pringle

No doubt the 1st selection in any draft has value, and the PSD is by no means useless. However it is now more about recognizing an obscure or unconventional talent (ie. Jurrah, Martin) rather than snaring an established star.

I don't know why anyone ever expected anything much in terms of 'gun' recycled players in the PSD. Clubs won't let it get to that point anymore. There has been the odd 'bargain' due to stubborn clubs like Port not wanting to lose out in a trade, but i think clubs now subscribe to the theory that even a lopsided trade is better than no compensation at all. Now that uncontracted players generally nominate fore the national draft rather than PSD to ensure they get to the club they want, I think the PSD is more about untried rookies and lesser lights looking for a 2nd chance. It will be very rare to get a Nick Stevens in the PSD from now on - unless of course the 'big' clubs have the top PSD picks (ie. if Carlton had finished last, they would be able to pursuade a Burgoyne to nominate for the PSD to get him for free and shaft PA).

Exactly. Cheezels ae much more fun to eat. I put one on every finger and then work my way across. The climax where you finally get to lick the delicious remnants of yellow crumbs off your oily digits seals the deal. You can't do that with tim tams!! Newton for cheezels will do fine. Note: Pringles also happy to be traded to Melbourne. Not in the same league as cheezels, but could still make a big full back if consumed in sufficient quantity.

I highly doubt dogs would bite there now that they have Hall. Eade's comments about Hall not necessarily being an 80 goal a year FF and needing to work hard to fit into their current gameplan (that has mobile smalls kicking multiple goals each) suggests there is no room for 2 KPPs in their setup. Eade obviously still values his small forward methodology, but has finally conceded that he needs to supplement this with a big target to help feed crumbs to Aker, Higgins et al. Fev not going to Dogs.

Nasher. Stress fractures are over-use or repetitive strain injuries. You are correct in saying that a stress fracture should not occur when one has not been weight-bearing through that leg. However another feature of over-use injuries is that the player is more susceptible to developing one after a sudden increase in training load after a period of inactivity. My guess would be that Col returned to training and (most likely despite trying to 'ease back in') then suffered this setback. It was caught early from all reports (whilst only a 'hot spot', so a few weeks in a CAM walker ('moon boot') and then graded return to training should be all that is required. I'm sure the biomechanical investigations have already been undertaken previously and any correctible contributing factors (eg. foot orthotics to correct poor foot biomechanics) appropriately addressed. The docs and physios are well versed in those sorts of things and usually onto it like a rash.

I know I made a big call, and I could easily be proven wrong depending on circumstances. I think others have done my job for me in explaining my reasoning. It's not that I don't rate him at all as a player, but rather that I don't see a lot of 'upside' (I hate that word). I have also seen him play against men in the VFL 2nds for Coburg and though he performed well, he didn't really stand out as having any particular star qualities. Having said that, he does all the basics well and has a crack. Very quiet type, but that may have been because of the foreign environment playing a one-off game at Coburg on a bye weekend for the Cannons. He already has a big strong body, and Tom Hawkins comes to mind as a decent comparison in terms of how bigger bodies at U18 level translates into AFL performance. I'm not actually comparing game styles, but Hawkins had the big strong body at U18 level and consequently dominated. Many thought Hawkins could have an immediate impact at AFL level, but even a few years down the track he is still yet to rip a game apart. He is solid at best in a fantastic team, which at the moment is all he needs to be, but I don't ever see him becoming a great forward of the competition. Would Hawkins have been any good at Melbourne over the last few years as we butchered the ball inside 50? I'd say he'd have performed about to the level Newton has, because he lacks the ability (like Buddy, Fev or Reiwoldt) to make something out of nothing. However this is just my opinion, and recruiters have their specific needs at each draft. The Bulldogs, Blues, Swans and maybe a couple of others like ourselves, West Coast and Richmond are all in the hunt for a forward, and if they all decide to pursue this type of player, then Temel may find a home earlier than 40. But the main point of my post was to question why everyone was so excited given most are basing their assertions on a few stats rather than first hand vision. I may therefore have inflated my selection number to forty to make my point. Either way, I will stand by it and not expect to be too far off the mark. And if I'm wrong, happy to be reminded about it, as that's what this forum is about. It's good as a lay person to have a go at giving your opinion and then if you have the courage to put that opinion out there, you have to be able to cop the flak if and when you're proven wrong. Plus footy and recruiting is an art, not a science, so what looks like trash to me may look like gold to a club in need of that particular player type.

Re Temel: Big call. Wrong call. Terrible call. Won't be picked up in top 40. Have seen him play. H's ok. Not a star. Never will be. Have absolutely no idea why people here are close to ejaculating over the prospect of picking him up. Has not warranted this attention.

Would be very upset if we had that result from trade period. Trading Garland???? My word people get paranoid. He ha a stress fracture FCS. He's not a cripple. He'll be fine. Trust me. FINE!!!! A required player. Not up for trade. End of story.

I'd take him for pick 11. Some people are very quick to forget how damaging Wells was when North were playing well a couple of years back. He is a very classy player who would complement our inside mids (Jones, Moloney) and provide sufficient pace to break the lines. Can kick goals on the run and has a bit of 'x-factor'. Could also be used to play a Davey-type role as has excellent foot skills and might even allow us to release Davey back into the forward line for stints throughout the year. Or he could eve play on a half back flank as a damaging rebounding defender. Or what even a forward goal sneak teaming up with Jetta, Jurrah, Davey, (Watts - odd man out), and Aussie. Now that is an exciting bunch of indigenous fellas all capable of the freakish. Understandaby there are question marks over his fitness, but which of his injuries will affect him long-term? (I don't recall exactly why he has been missing games, so maybe someone can fill me in, but I don't think they have been serious injuries). Colin Sylvia had some frustrating years with injuries and most of us had given up on him, but most would now rate him in our top few at the club. Wells is one year older, has plenty of time and has already shown he is up to it at this level. And on top of this, he is only 25, about to reach his prime over the next few years and would be a senior indigenous figure to act as a role model for the likes of Jetta, Bennell, Jurrah and Aussie. Pick 11 may end up being Bren Grgic or Nick Smith for all we know. There are no guarantees in a draft pick, and considering we already have picks 1 and 2, plus 18 , I don't see why we can't take a punt on an established player in the 24-28y.o. age-bracket that is not only threadbare at our club, but also not too old that he won't be around during our next tilt at a flag.

And if you want to get more technical, you could say 'shana tova u-metuka', meaning that you a wishing the person to 'have a good and sweet year ahead'.

Saw him play a game for Coburg 2nds this year (in a deal that allows U18 players to play selected games with their VFL affiliates). He absolutely dominated and kicked 5 goals on the day. From what I gathered when asking about him, he is older than most U18's (I think each U18 TAC Cup side can have 1 or 2 over-age -over 18 - players on their team). That may be why he is dominating in his 'extra' TAC Cup year. Looked a likely type though. Was quite mobile and very impressive in the air. And of course that great name... Probably showed enough for a club to take as a rookie at least, but didn't scream out 'select me I'm a certainty to make it.'

Need to think about this, but a quickie off the top of my head; To Hell and back again. Or: "We're back again in 2010"

Those who would have preferred Hawthorn to win were obviously not at Waverley park on prelim final day 1987. I don't like Essendon either, but I can tell you I had a smirk on my face in the last quarter each time they kicked a goal and sunk the dagger deeper into Hawthorns wretched, miserable heart. Goodbye Hawthorn!!!

Would also love to hear about Garland. We were told at the time that he had about a 12 week injury (or ?12 weeks until return to training). Maybe he is already up and about and getting back in condition for next year, but thought it wasn't worth trying to come back considering our inability to make finals.

A good idea to do the multi-poster match preview this week. Well done all involved and Oracle for putting it together. Might be a nice idea to start the season with a similar match preview in round 1 2010. Sentiments of hope for a new year from a few fellow Demonlanders would be a good read.

The debate about how many and which injuries might be able to be attributed to the fitness staff is an interesting one. It is really hard to say, but I can try to add a medical perspective. Of the injury list quoted above, the following I can (almost certainly) confirm have NOTHING to do with fitness/medical staff: Matthew Bate (ribs) 1 week Daniel Bell (shoulder) season Sam Blease (leg) season Cameron Bruce (wrist) season Brad Green (wrist) season Addam Maric (shoulder) season James Strauss (shoulder) season Matthew Warnock (ankle) season The following have injuries that may be preventable, but without knowing the exact nature of the injury, I can only guess at preventable factors that may have contributed: (I use one example here to show how medical/fitness staff could help prevent any given injury) Simon Buckley (hip) 1 week Colin Garland (foot) season - stress fracture potentially preventable by determining the player's specific foot and lower-limb structural and biomechanical deficiencies. Subsequently could: a) fit more appropriate training shoe or fit appropriate shoe orthotic (podiatrist/orthotist), b ) correct running technique by specific running instruction (running coach) c) strengthen specific muscle groups to improve biomechanics and reduce stress/impact through the specific part of the foot that is involved (strength training coach) d) loosening muscle groups that are tight and contributing to poor biomechanics (physiotherapists/trainers/strength and conditioning). Jack Grimes (hip) season John Meesen (foot) season Austin Wonaeamirri (knee) season The final group have injuries that, whilst potentially preventable, also have an element of 'unavoidability' in participants of a high intensity sport like AFL football: Michael Newton (Achilles) test Ricky Petterd (groin) test Matthew Whelan (hamstring) test Rohan Bail (quad) 2 - 3 weeks Rhys Healey (hamstring) 3 weeks The example I gave in group 2 (Garland) may help explain why I think we suffer more injuries than (for argument's sake) Collingwood, who have squillions of $$$ and the state of the art Lexus Center at their disposal. This richer AFL club can afford to buy the latest equipment (training and testing) amd employ many more, and probably attract (with $$) better fitness and medical science staff than us. Therefore, they can afford to regularly monitor player loads and deficiencies with methods such as filming videos, recording measurements, taking blood and aerobic tests, determining player factors that contribute to injury (fatigue levels, muscle tighness etc.) compared with a poor club like us. The list goes on and I can't even begin to explain how much a football club could spend on this type of thing if they wanted to. They can also afford additional luxuries such as chefs to cook nutritional meals, dieticians, psychologists, massage staff, better weights machines, hyperbaric chambers, altitude training rooms, swimming pools and spas, ice baths, saunas, whirlpools, yoga instructors, pilates, data entry and analysis computers/machines, pathology testing systems, ultrasound, physio treatment modalities, etc. etc. etc. In all likelihood, we're probably not much more advanced than a VFL club (where I work and which has a decent team of medical and fitness staff), whilst Collingwood has specific sports science labs and offices in their shiny facility. Down at the Junction oval, I know for a fact that you won't find anything like that, and nothing like this exist at Casey Fields as yet. There is no way we can compete on this front and as long as this is the case, I think we will continue to see the same results. When people talk about the gap in football department spending, this is what they mean. It is not just money spent on coaches, but money spent on obtaining the best equipment and most experienced people in EVERY field to gain the edge. I'm sure our main guys are not too shabby and highly qualified, but their hands are likely tied by a lack of resources and equipment and a lack of support staff. And to make matters worse, Collingwood will continue to get richer and we will continue to get poorer, because the fixture is rigged to make this happen. An even playing field? A 'socialist' AFL? I think not!!! We're not quite the EPL, but I predict we'll get there one day. Melbourne, North and Footscray will be Leeds, Aston Villa and Stoke, whilst Collingwood, West Coast and Adelaide will be Man United, Chelsea and Liverpool...

Scully may well be a ball magnet, but from that footage his foot skills were very poor. He hit one target, and that was a shot for goal. I haven't seen any other footage, so I'm not saying he's a bad kick of the footy, just that in this particular footage he does not demonstrate great foot skills. His hands were top notch though. I would like an opinion from someone who has seen a bit more of him as to how good or bad his kicking is. If he has just average foots kills, I can't get that excited, as we already have too many players on our list with this deficiency.

I was hoping that he would retire, as I don't think he will get a regular game next year. It would be better for Macca to retire woth dignity. However it doesn't make any difference to our playing list. This is for the following reasons: 1) Only Robbo or Macca could be our 2nd (with Bruce) veteran. Veterans do not take the place of a listed player (nor rookie I think). So we don't actually lose the opportunity to draft another youngster. 2) I think most here agree that whilst it was heartbreaking to let Robbo go, it was never going to be beneficial to keep him on the list. He may have got some games next year and may have performed well, but I think we all agree that we should get as many games as possible into forwards like Jurrah, Watts and other youngsters (who will be there during our next finals campaign) rather than continuing to play oldies like Robbo. 3) If Macca plays on next year and remains captain, we have another year to decide who should be his successor. So far no-one really stands out as a monty for the job. We all have an inkling about McLean, Grimes etc, but none of these guys are ready as yet. Lets give them some more time (and potentially a dress rehearsal if Macca gets injured or dropped) before potentially making a 5 or more year decision on a player to lead us on a premiership tilt. 4) Yes he may take a youngster's spot in the selected side, but we could do far worse than having a player on the field who gives his heart and soul to the club and sets a great example for his team-mates week in and week out. And if he eventually loses his spot in the team due to poor form or his body giving way, we lose very little. Don't forget that whilst it is great to give young midfielders a chance to get experience, they do need to earn their spot in the team as well. If they can edge out a club legend like Macca, then they have certainly earned their spot in the side, and that's the kind of competitive culture we want at the club. (and yes, I know you could say the same about forwards needing to compete for spots and Robbo being the equivalent of Macca as an example in the forward line, but it was one or the other, and nothing to lose with regards to spots on the list by keeping one of them). So in essence, we had to choose 1 of Robbo and Macca FOR 1 YEAR ONLY (neither were ever going to be worthwhile keeping any longer) and we went with the captain. Not too many problems with that. And FWIW, I hope he starts the season in the team, but gets overtaken by hungry youngsters who follow his example and steal his spot off him by year's end on the back of spectacular AFL standard performances. If that happens, we may even push for finals next year. I probably started reading this thread with the opinion that he should have retired, but as it stands, I'm not that unhappy. What really peeves me off is what's happening in the cricket at the moment. Absolutely pathetic. I'm embarrassed to be an Australian at the moment!!!

Do clubs have to make a minimum of 4 selections in the national draft? I seen to recall something like that... Or did I make that up?

Obviously we want sustained success, but if you offered me that one premiership as a certainty, I would take it in a heartbeat and not give a crap what happened after. The fact is that we are in a different situation to the Hawks fans, most of who had previously tasted the ultimate success in their lifetime (late 80's and early 90's). We haven't won a flag since 1964, meaning most of us on this site have never experienced a win on te last Saturday in September and would do anything to do so once before we die. Personally I still doubt it will ever happen in my lifetime, and years of disappointment have left me feeling that way. But I still live in hope. Go Dees.

When will Viney be up for draft? If it is this year, that's bad for us as our high draft picks may have to be used if we wanted to pick him up as a father-son selection. But if it were next year, considering the GC draft concessions, we won't have such high selections anyhow and are likely to get a better 'bargain'.

????? Please elaborate.

I think you'll find that the club tried to put a more positive spin on Bleases ankle fracture than is actually the case. The most unstable or worst isolated fibular fracture (ie no other bone involved) that he could have sustained from the mechanism of injury described in the papers would result in about 6 weeks (maximum 8) of immobilization after fixation with a metal plate (if all went to plan). That would have had Blease back into training by the end of June and with a couple of months of footy remaining. For the club to come straight out and say that his seaon is over most likely means the fracture involved the tibia as well. This by no means implies worse consequences for the future, but rather that a longer period of recovery is required.

My most admired and therefore favourte 5 to watch, not necessarily top 5 skilled: 1. Stephen Tingay 2. Robbie Flower 3. Rod Grinter 4. Jimmy Stynes 5. David Schwarz Special mentions to Graeme Yeats, Danny Hughes, Sean Wight, Garry Lyon, Ricky Jackson, Adem Yze, Jeff White, and Todd Viney.

If we had a gun key forward we would beat that Hawthorn side...