On 09/10/2024 at 11:04, Bowserpower said:

Think she was just being polite

You haven't met Kate, have you?  Conversation I had with her two years ago at the 2022 season launch:

Me:  "Thanks so much for sticking up for Goody in the media."

Kate: (with cheeky glint in her eye) "No one f*&^s with my people." followed by raucous laughter from both of us.

  On 09/10/2024 at 22:04, Macca said:

@KozzyCan

The only trade that can work for us is for Oliver to become someone else's problem (unless he can knuckle down with us)

I'm putting aside his football ability here because we have to

The club is always bigger than any individual especially one who has decided to take all the money and give back SFA

You're barking up the wrong tree mate, I'm not saying we can't trade Oliver I'm saying the club could have handled all this far better than they have.

If he has to go then so be it. But you can't tell a potential buyer that there's no way you'll sell only to turn around five minutes later and ask what they're offering. It just makes it obvious that the club is all talk and we'll fold easily.

  On 09/10/2024 at 22:13, KozzyCan said:

You're barking up the wrong tree mate, I'm not saying we can't trade Oliver I'm saying the club could have handled all this far better than they have.

If he has to go then so be it. But you can't tell a potential buyer that there's no way you'll sell only to turn around five minutes later and ask what they're offering. It just makes it obvious that the club is all talk and we'll fold easily.

What’s said in public is often completely different to what’s said between 2 clubs. My guess is we’ve told Geelong, if you want him show us a respectable offer but leave the media out of it. I’d hazard a guess that Melbourne think they can get most/all the salary of the books, get Geelongs F1 and trade that back into this years draft. If we get 3 top 20 picks and pick 28 it goes a long way to changing the look and skill set of the team. 

Edited October 9, 2024Oct 9 by Roost it far

This is relentless. Exhausting. Disheartening.

MFC: Just tell us what we're going to do and be done with it. 

If we're going to give one of our greatest ever players the old heave ho, for nothing, for reasons unknown because the comms team is a mess/messages are mixed/bins are on fire everywhere - then whatever. Just do it. 

Clarry is my favourite player and I'll be gutted if it goes, but I am tired of all this that I almost don't care anymore. And the opinion of us long-term members doesn't seem to matter. They don't listen. It's their job to run the footy club. But in my humble opinion, things are not being run well, and there is plenty of proof. Trac and Clarry debacles are recent examples.

It's like the plane has been going down for a while now, we've had the oxygen, but now we know nothing's going to change so I'm just going to stare out the window until it's done. 

What a sh*t show. 

Trading a player like Oliver with his issues and huge contract is always going to be a media [censored]

  On 09/10/2024 at 11:12, Bowserpower said:

No disrespect but your mate sounds like a bit of a drop kick.

Why go to these events just to harass players? It's like meeting your favourite soap opera stars and asking them for spoilers.

 

I take it you haven't been to a B&F, the players mingle with guests, pose with photos, have a chat, have a laugh, it's not a matter of guests harassing players, it's encouraged at the event.

  On 09/10/2024 at 22:38, Roost it far said:

What’s said in public is often completely different to what’s said between 2 clubs. My guess is we’ve told Geelong, if you want him show us a respectable offer but leave the media out of it. I’d hazard a guess that Melbourne think they can get most/all the salary of the books, get Geelongs F1 and trade that back into this years draft. If we get 3 top 20 picks and pick 28 it goes a long way to changing the look and skill set of the team. 

So were publicly declaring Oliver won't be traded under any circumstances for the benefit of who exactly? Geelong know we're happy to trade him, the media are saying we're happy to trade him. We've only served to make ourselves look dishonest.

  On 09/10/2024 at 22:13, KozzyCan said:

You're barking up the wrong tree mate, I'm not saying we can't trade Oliver I'm saying the club could have handled all this far better than they have.

If he has to go then so be it. But you can't tell a potential buyer that there's no way you'll sell only to turn around five minutes later and ask what they're offering. It just makes it obvious that the club is all talk and we'll fold easily.

They are playing the game 

Don't you know how trading works?  

Make no mistake, if the club could trade Oliver, we would.  But the huge contract is like an albatross around our neck

By the way, when the contract was drawn up and signed, none of this poor behaviour from Oliver was evident (at all)

Here's his last 2 years (whilst getting paid upwards of $1.3Million per season)

2023 ... half way through the season there is this phantom hamstring injury that occurs in a game but oddly enough, he stays on the ground

Then there's 3 months off (still getting paid) ... at the end of the season all is revealed that he's gone off the rails etc etc and has lost the trust of nearly everyone.  Might be traded but again ... the contract

He doesn't train properly in the off season (still getting paid) and comes back overweight and unfit.  Barely plays a decent game all season

That's Clayton Oliver

And don't get me started on Petracca

  On 09/10/2024 at 22:40, Red But Mostly Blue said:

 

What a sh*t show. 

the sh*t show is the media's.  They've been told that he's not going, by both Melbourne and Geelong.  The media are literal sh*tstains on society.

  On 09/10/2024 at 22:40, Red But Mostly Blue said:

This is relentless. Exhausting. Disheartening.

MFC: Just tell us what we're going to do and be done with it. 

If we're going to give one of our greatest ever players the old heave ho, for nothing, for reasons unknown because the comms team is a mess/messages are mixed/bins are on fire everywhere - then whatever. Just do it. 

Clarry is my favourite player and I'll be gutted if it goes, but I am tired of all this that I almost don't care anymore. And the opinion of us long-term members doesn't seem to matter. They don't listen. It's their job to run the footy club. But in my humble opinion, things are not being run well, and there is plenty of proof. Trac and Clarry debacles are recent examples.

It's like the plane has been going down for a while now, we've had the oxygen, but now we know nothing's going to change so I'm just going to stare out the window until it's done. 

What a sh*t show. 

It pays not to have favourite players as they can let you down 

My favourite players are those who get the best out of themselves.  Even the average ones impress me if they give their all

At some stage Clarrie won't be playing for us but the club will go on regardless

I support the club but have critiqued the club when applicable

But I'm not going to blame the club for the poor behaviour of 2 players.  That's the media's angle and the power of the pen is mighty

So don't get sucked in by the media.  They're trying to sell stories and with the media, the truth often gets thrown in the waste paper baskets

3 years ago we were the media darlings and they loved everything that we did.  That sold newspapers or got clicks. Now the opposite has the same effect

Poor old Kate Roffey became the sacrificial lamb and what did she do wrong?  Avoided questions like Tim Lamb did ... what's the difference? 

  On 09/10/2024 at 22:57, Macca said:

They are playing the game 

Don't you know how trading works?  

Make no mistake, if the club could trade Oliver, we would.  But the huge contract is like an albatross around our neck

By the way, when the contract was drawn up and signed, none of this poor behaviour from Oliver was evident (at all)

Here's his last 2 years (whilst getting paid upwards of $1.3Million per season)

2023 ... half way through the season there is this phantom hamstring injury that occurs in a game but oddly enough, he stays on the ground

Then there's 3 months off (still getting paid) ... at the end of the season all is revealed that he's gone off the rails etc etc and has lost the trust of nearly everyone.  Might be traded but again ... the contract

He doesn't train properly in the off season (still getting paid) and comes back overweight and unfit.  Barely plays a decent game all season

That's Clayton Oliver

And don't get me started on Petracca

Yes, the game we're playing is [censored]. We have made so many grand declarative statements that have been complete bs that it's obvious to everyone and their dog that we're bluffing.

A little subtlety goes a long way.

I don't know why you keep bringing up Oliver's issues. They are irrelevant to my point. We can choose to trade anyone for any reason but the way we are handling this has not helped us.

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:14, KozzyCan said:

I don't know why you keep bringing up Oliver's issues

The thread is about Oliver and a big part of the discussion is whether he's going to be traded or not

And his issues are totally related

You lack experience and come across as a bit of a novice

 

Edited October 9, 2024Oct 9 by Macca

Nobody is going to trade Oliver for unders

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:17, Macca said:

The thread is about Oliver and a big part of the discussion is whether he's going to be traded or not

And his issues are totally related

You lack experience and come across as a complete novice

You're easily led

Petty namecalling. Truly the domain of a winner.

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:14, Macca said:

It pays not to have favourite players as they can let you down 

My favourite players are those who get the best out of themselves.  Even the average ones impress me if they give their all

At some stage Clarrie won't be playing for us but the club will go on regardless

I support the club but have critiqued the club when applicable

But I'm not going to blame the club for the poor behaviour of 2 players.  That's the media's angle and the power of the pen is mighty

So don't get sucked in by the media.  They're trying to sell stories and with the media, the truth often gets thrown in the waste paper baskets

3 years ago we were the media darlings and they loved everything that we did.  That sold newspapers or got clicks. Now the opposite has the same effect

Poor old Kate Roffey became the sacrificial lamb and what did she do wrong?  Avoided questions like Tim Lamb did ... what's the difference? 

For sure.

Don't get me wrong though, I am more lamenting the situation of (potentially) losing Clarry. Despite Brad's assurances. 

And 100% - while I think we have handled both cases very poorly (with Clarry, some of our acts have contributed to us having zero bargaining power), I do not absolve Trac or Clarry of blame. Both have contributed to the situation, and ultimately our inability to bring in important trades. 

Not everything is true, but some of it certainly is. and ultimately, I just want this all to settle down and have a normal, maybe even 'boring', uneventful offseason where everyone just puts their heads down, to focus on a flag in 2025. Or at the very least building back some trust, consistency and momentum towards success, on and off the field. 

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:23, KozzyCan said:

Petty namecalling. Truly the domain of a winner.

Well you are wasting my time so what do you expect

You and numerous others here need to stop blaming the club because of the poor behaviour of 2 players

If they were lesser lights, nearly everyone would want both players out of the club

A rule for some and a different rule for others?  That's toxic and you never win with that scenario

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:30, Red But Mostly Blue said:

For sure.

Don't get me wrong though, I am more lamenting the situation of (potentially) losing Clarry. Despite Brad's assurances. 

And 100% - while I think we have handled both cases very poorly (with Clarry, some of our acts have contributed to us having zero bargaining power), I do not absolve Trac or Clarry of blame. Both have contributed to the situation, and ultimately our inability to bring in important trades. 

Not everything is true, but some of it certainly is. and ultimately, I just want this all to settle down and have a normal, maybe even 'boring', uneventful offseason where everyone just puts their heads down, to focus on a flag in 2025. Or at the very least building back some trust, consistency and momentum towards success, on and off the field. 

Both Oliver & Petracca are 100% to blame

Have we seen Gawn, Viney, Rivers et al behave in the same way.  No

It's just those 2 but they just happen to be our best 2 players.  But I can put that aside because the club comes first 

I'd like to know how the club made Oliver go off the rails?  Please explain

As for Petracca and his petty attitude dragging the club through the mud for close on 3 weeks, that was disgraceful

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:35, Macca said:

Both Oliver & Petracca are 100% to blame

Have we seen Gawn, Viney, Rivers et al behave in the same way.  No

It's just those 2 but they just happen to be our best 2 players.  But I can put that aside because the club comes first 

I'd like to know how the club made Oliver go off the rails?  Please explain

As for Petracca and his petty attitude dragging the club through the mud for close on 3 weeks, that was disgraceful

Give it a rest Macca, you’ve made your point more than once.

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:30, Macca said:

Well you are wasting my time so what do you expect

You and numerous others here need to stop blaming the club because of the poor behaviour of 2 players

If they were lesser lights, nearly everyone would want both players out of the club

A rule for some and a different rule for others?  That's toxic and you never win with that scenario

I never blamed the club for the behaviour of our players. I don't know how you got that impression at all? Oliver's issues have been discussed to death, if the club believes it's best to move him on I am completely fine with that.

What I'm not happy with is how the club has handled the potential trade. They have made our position weaker on numerous occasions, by flip-flopping rather than maintaining any semblance of a poker face. You can call that playing the game if you like but I think it makes us look stupid.

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:38, Slartibartfast said:

Give it a rest Macca, you’ve made your point more than once.

Ok, so you don't agree with what I'm saying, that's fair enough, Baghdad

But if I keep getting quoted my only reply can be what I've already said

And that is that you cannot have 2 renegade players rule the roost

Given your experience, I'm surprised that you're not agreeing with me

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:41, KozzyCan said:

I never blamed the club for the behaviour of our players. I don't know how you got that impression at all? Oliver's issues have been discussed to death, if the club believes it's best to move him on I am completely fine with that.

What I'm not happy with is how the club has handled the potential trade. They have made our position weaker on numerous occasions, by flip-flopping rather than maintaining any semblance of a poker face. You can call that playing the game if you like but I think it makes us look stupid.

We were never coming from a strong position anyway so it would not matter what we said (or are saying)

Maybe 'No comment' but even that creates a storm and garners scorn

We've got 2 problem players on huge contracts who are virtually untradeable.  We can't tear up the contracts but are the problems going away?  

We'll have to wait and see but I'm not holding my breath

If they were lesser lights they'd both be gone already

Edited October 9, 2024Oct 9 by Macca

  On 09/10/2024 at 22:58, Katrina Dee Fan said:

the sh*t show is the media's.  They've been told that he's not going, by both Melbourne and Geelong.  The media are literal sh*tstains on society.

There's a reason legacy MSM is a dying species. And good riddance!

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:35, Macca said:

Both Oliver & Petracca are 100% to blame

Have we seen Gawn, Viney, Rivers et al behave in the same way.  No

It's just those 2 but they just happen to be our best 2 players.  But I can put that aside because the club comes first 

I'd like to know how the club made Oliver go off the rails?  Please explain

As for Petracca and his petty attitude dragging the club through the mud for close on 3 weeks, that was disgraceful

100% ??? How do you know that??

And we don't know whether Clarry has gone "off the rails"? That's a rumour I wouldn't be pushing... It could be he has had some missteps (as originally reported, at the Brownlow/doc appointments), who knows? We don't know the magnitude and we still don't know who is actually pushing it. What I do know is that the trade talk has seemed at odds with Clarry's very recent comments in this space. So the leaks, and the way we have "shopped" him has been very poor. Whether he deserves to be traded or not (and I agree, club comes first), you look after the club and ensure we get the best return possible - which WILL NOT happen in this case.

With Trac, it would appear some was driven by branding/diva attitude, but again, how to tell? We had so many mixed messages from the club. Seems he had some issues with the club - which given how things have gone/are going, maybe deserved to be heard? Probably should have been aired out better, but it doesn't mean he was wrong. 

Edited October 9, 2024Oct 9 by Red But Mostly Blue

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:51, Red But Mostly Blue said:

100% ??? How do you know that??

And we don't know whether Clarry has gone "off the rails"? That's a rumour I'd wouldn't be pushing... It could be he has had some missteps (as originally reported, at the Brownlow/doc appointments), who knows? We don't know the magnitude and we still don't know who is actually pushing it. What I do know is that the trade talk has seemed at odds with Clarry's very recent comments in this space. So the leaks, and the way we have "shopped" him has been very poor. Whether he deserves to be traded or not (and I agree, club comes first), you look after the club and ensure we get the best return possible - which WILL NOT happen in this case.

With Trac, it would appear some was driven by branding/diva attitude, but again, how to tell? We had so many mixed messages from the club. Seems he had some issues with the club - which given how things have gone/are going, maybe deserved to be heard? Probably should have been aired out better, but it doesn't mean he was wrong. 

So Oliver was squeaky clean in 2023?  Really?  I seem to remember him missing 3 months with some sort of mystery ailment

And then he lost the trust of the players and the FD.  That's ok?

Oh, and we put him up for trade in 2023 as well.  Is that the clubs fault?  Seriously? 

And then this season after picking up his monthly cheque of $100,000k he decides to present himself unfit and overweight

That's ok as well? 

As for Petracca, where do we start?

  On 09/10/2024 at 23:46, Macca said:

We were never coming from a strong position anyway so it would not matter what we said (or are saying)

Maybe 'No comment' but even that creates a storm and garners scorn

We've got 2 problem players on huge contracts who are virtually untradeable.  We can't tear up the contracts but are the problems going away?  

We'll have to wait and see but I'm not holding my breath

Even they were lesser lights they'd both be gone already

I said it in another post. You take the Paul Roos position: "every player is tradable for the right price."

If Oliver's manager was coming to us midyear to discuss a possible trade we should not have shut it down but said "make us an offer". Keep the ball in Geelong's court and see what they were willing to pony up. Furthermore if Oliver wanted to explore his options, let him. If we're in the position where we have a contracted player who wants to leave and a club that wants to get him we have the most leverage.

As soon as we became the ones shopping him that leverage was gone and Geelong knew it. No big statement at the BnF was going to change that.