Manchester Bombing

[Biffen 12,949]

Another day ,another 29 poor colonialist pigs gone.

Great article by Waleed Aly that concludes with the powerful message,"those terrorists will not stop us going out to pop concerts".

This somewhat misses the point which is that Islamists cannot cope with the freedom of living in a Western society .

The burden of distinguishing between Fundamentalist terror cells and your average happy mosque going public falls to the host country.

In my humble opinion,the fewer mosques and Muslims in non Muslim countries the better.

Our hyper-sexual,drunken lascivious behaviour is too offensive for Mohammedian youth.

There are 57 Muslim countries where a Mullah makes the rules for government to follow.

Why would a pious Muslim seek to live amongst beer swilling dancing ,godless pigs ?

Why would godless ,beer swilling colonialist pigs actively encourage more Muslims to come over and kill them if not for a suicidal idealisation?

Discuss.

[daisycutter 29,988]

7 hours ago, Biffen said:

Another day ,another 29 poor colonialist pigs gone.

Great article by Waleed Aly that concludes with the powerful message,"those terrorists will not stop us going out to pop concerts".

This somewhat misses the point which is that Islamists cannot cope with the freedom of living in a Western society .

The burden of distinguishing between Fundamentalist terror cells and your average happy mosque going public falls to the host country.

In my humble opinion,the fewer mosques and Muslims in non Muslim countries the better.

Our hyper-sexual,drunken lascivious behaviour is too offensive for Mohammedian youth.

There are 57 Muslim countries where a Mullah makes the rules for government to follow.

Why would a pious Muslim seek to live amongst beer swilling dancing ,godless pigs ?

Why would godless ,beer swilling colonialist pigs actively encourage more Muslims to come over and kill them if not for a suicidal idealisation?

Discuss.

someone needs to invent a good-muslim scanner or biopsy test, biffo

[Wrecker45 3,381]

Biffen - You obviously don't watch Q & A on the unbiased ABC where we learnt during the week more people are killed by falling fridges than terrorism.

[Jara 1,153]

I hate it how Waleed tosses out another article every time there's an Islamist atrocity. What I don't like is how he defends the indefensible. Or I think he does - usually he writes these massive essays and I read it and think - er- what did he actually say there? Guy's won Walkelys and all sorts of awards, but I reckon he's a pretty poor writer. Good television host.

 

I imagine Muslims come here for the same reasons everybody else does: it's peaceful and wealthy. 

 

Dunno how many people get killed by falling fridges, but there's been three people killed by Islamic terrorists in this country, as far as I can recall. Lots in Bali, of course. 

 

Given that there's - what? about 400,000 Muslims living here, surely the only thing we can do is try to get along. I've worked in international education for years, have had hundreds of Muslim friends, colleagues and students - never met one I wouldn't welcome into my home. Funny, the ones I admire most are the niqab-wearing women from Saudi Arabia - coming here is a revelation for them - most of them are very brave pioneers, happy to relate to lots of different cultures, and when they return to their own country, from what I've gathered, they are a very positive force for change (i.e. women's rights, votes, right to drive, etc. ) Long way to go, of course - starting from a low base, but you have to start somewhere. 

[Biffen 12,949]

29 Coptic school  girls slaughtered in Waleeds'old country last week too. On a bus, shot.Nothing from him on this.

Pass the salt.

 

[hardtack 11,061]

1 hour ago, Biffen said:

29 Coptic school  girls slaughtered in Waleeds'old country last week too. On a bus, shot.Nothing from him on this.

Pass the salt.

 

I don't recall him commenting on the 68 Muslim children slaughtered (along with 58 adults) in Syria just days before the Manchester bombing either... in fact, I don't recall seeing much at all in the media about that particular event. 

[Biffen 12,949]

3 hours ago, hardtack said:

I don't recall him commenting on the 68 Muslim children slaughtered (along with 58 adults) in Syria just days before the Manchester bombing either... in fact, I don't recall seeing much at all in the media about that particular event. 

By whom?

[hardtack 11,061]

1 hour ago, Biffen said:

By whom?

That's irrelevant.

[Jara 1,153]

9 hours ago, Biffen said:

29 Coptic school  girls slaughtered in Waleeds'old country last week too. On a bus, shot.Nothing from him on this.

Pass the salt.

 

The people who did this were obviously monsters - great if they could be killed - but it's best not to exaggerate - unless I misread the reports, or there's been an update I missed,  I thought it said 29 "people" - two children among them. I know anybody dying like this is a tragedy, but saying they were all schoolgirls somehow makes it seem worse.

[Biffen 12,949]

1 minute ago, Jara said:

The people who did this were obviously monsters - great if they could be killed - but it's best not to exaggerate - unless I misread the reports, or there's been an update I missed,  I thought it said 29 "people" - two children among them. I know anybody dying like this is a tragedy, but saying they were all schoolgirls somehow makes it seem worse.

I think it was a bus with Christian Coptic females visiting an old Christian site.Dont know the numbers or ages .Sorry to dramatise it.

 

2 hours ago, hardtack said:

That's irrelevant.

Highly relevant .both suicide bombers killing innocents.

Theres another link you might observe or chose to ignore.

[hardtack 11,061]

10 minutes ago, Biffen said:

I think it was a bus with Christian Coptic females visiting an old Christian site.Dont know the numbers or ages .Sorry to dramatise it.

 

Highly relevant .both suicide bombers killing innocents.

Theres another link you might observe or chose to ignore.

I don't choose to ignore that at all... my point was that the western media couldn't give a rats when its muslim children killed, because a) it's a case of muslims killing muslims and b) it doesn't sell newspapers.

If they had been christian children, it would have been headline news.

We tend to overlook the fact that the numbers of westerners killed by muslim terrorists pales into insignificance when compared to the numbers of muslims killed by muslim terrorists.  If 126 muslims are slaughtered (as was the case just days before the Manchester attack) there is barely a ripple, yet if 22 christians (assumption) are slaughtered, then it's the muslims against the rest... against the infidels... and we are told that they (muslims in general) will stop at nothing until the world is purged of us heathen scum.  Absolute nonsense!

[Biffen 12,949]

26 minutes ago, hardtack said:

I don't choose to ignore that at all... my point was that the western media couldn't give a rats when its muslim children killed, because a) it's a case of muslims killing muslims and b) it doesn't sell newspapers.

If they had been christian children, it would have been headline news.

We tend to overlook the fact that the numbers of westerners killed by muslim terrorists pales into insignificance when compared to the numbers of muslims killed by muslim terrorists.  If 126 muslims are slaughtered (as was the case just days before the Manchester attack) there is barely a ripple, yet if 22 christians (assumption) are slaughtered, then it's the muslims against the rest... against the infidels... and we are told that they (muslims in general) will stop at nothing until the world is purged of us heathen scum.  Absolute nonsense!

The Manchester bomber hung an Isis flag from his house in England and still managed to get his martyrdom work done later.Should have been jailed.

The Syrian bomber was targeting people on buses.Sectarian.

Should we be jailing the hardline clerics who encourage Jihad?

I do realise MOST Muslims want nothing to do with violent extremism.

The British feel let down by their government not for the first time.

This is not far from Rotherham.

Porous borders are also to blame but police refusing to stereotype or profile suspects is ridiculous.

There is no doubt we are talking about a problem within Islam that is inflicted upon the rest of the world.

Its fair and sensible to acknowledge that I reckon.

 

[hardtack 11,061]

9 minutes ago, Biffen said:

The Manchester bomber hung an Isis flag from his house in England and still managed to get his martyrdom work done later.Should have been jailed.

The Syrian bomber was targeting people on buses.Sectarian.

Should we be jailing the hardline clerics who encourage Jihad?

I do realise MOST Muslims want nothing to do with violent extremism.

The British feel let down by their government not for the first time.

This is not far from Rotherham.

Porous borders are also to blame but police refusing to stereotype or profile suspects is ridiculous.

There is no doubt we are talking about a problem within Islam that is inflicted upon the rest of the world.

Its fair and sensible to acknowledge that I reckon.

 

I have no problem with all of that... particularly the fact that these people keep slipping through the net despite having form.

[Bluey's Dad 3,419]

15 hours ago, Biffen said:

Should we be jailing the hardline clerics who encourage Jihad?

 

 

This is an interesting one for me. Don't we have hate speech laws here (and I assume Britain has them too)?

Are they just not being enforced or is publicly advocating for the death of people of another religion somehow NOT hate speech and not a crime? I figure the framework to deal with these individuals may already be in place but not enforced for some reason.

I'm sure the state doesn't want to be the thought police, but I'm pretty sure we punish [censored] who paint swastikas on graves, so we should also be punishing other forms of hate-mongering.

[Wrecker45 3,381]

10 minutes ago, Choke said:

 

This is an interesting one for me. Don't we have hate speech laws here (and I assume Britain has them too)?

Are they just not being enforced or is publicly advocating for the death of people of another religion somehow NOT hate speech and not a crime? I figure the framework to deal with these individuals may already be in place but not enforced for some reason.

I'm sure the state doesn't want to be the thought police, but I'm pretty sure we punish [censored] who paint swastikas on graves, so we should also be punishing other forms of hate-mongering.

You say something politically incorrect like Margaret Court and you get crucified but actual hate speach by Muslim Clerics seems to fly under the radar and you are racist or islamphobic if you call it out.

[Bluey's Dad 3,419]

Just now, Wrecker45 said:

You say something politically incorrect like Margaret Court and you get crucified but actual hate speach by Muslim Clerics seems to fly under the radar and you are racist or islamphobic if you call it out.

Have been slammed with work the last few days so I'm behind on the news, what did she say?

But yeah, actual hate speech regardless of source or victim, should be punished. I was sure that was a thing in Aus.

One thing I will say with regards to clerics is that religion gets a massive free ride in this country with regard to what they can do (and how they are taxed, but that's another issue). I'm of the opinion that one's religion shouldn't allow you to circumvent the law, but apparently wearing a silly robe and holding an old book gets you privileges others can't obtain.

[Wrecker45 3,381]

16 hours ago, hardtack said:

I have no problem with all of that... particularly the fact that these people keep slipping through the net despite having form.

This is the crux of the problem for mine.

Most reasonable people would agree that there is a link between Islam and terrorism. It is only a very small minority of Muslims who use their religion as justification to kill. But there remains a link nonetheless.

When Australia accepts Muslim refugees we are increasing our chance of terrorism in this country. It is unfair, however, to paint every Muslim as a potential terrorist for the actions of a very small few.

I don't know that there is any fair or perfect way to deal with this problem.

[Bluey's Dad 3,419]

Just had a real quick look at the Margaret Court thing - seems people are upset because the tennis venue is named after her, so I assume that's why there's so much media coverage.

Pretty crappy things to say though IMO.

 

 

[Bluey's Dad 3,419]

1 minute ago, Wrecker45 said:

This is the crux of the problem for mine.

Most reasonable people would agree that there is a link between Islam and terrorism. It is only a very small minority of Muslims who use their religion as justification to kill. But there remains a link nonetheless.

When Australia accepts Muslim refugees we are increasing our chance of terrorism in this country. It is unfair, however, to paint every Muslim as a potential terrorist for the actions of a very small few.

I don't know that there is any fair or perfect way to deal with this problem.

Yup.

I guess I'm in the 'I'll take the extra risk for humanitarian reasons camp" when it comes to refugees. I acknowledge you're in the opposite camp though.

There seems to be very little space in between.

Or maybe that's the way the issue has been presented to us. I dunno.

I'm tired.

[Wrecker45 3,381]

22 minutes ago, Choke said:

Yup.

I guess I'm in the 'I'll take the extra risk for humanitarian reasons camp" when it comes to refugees. I acknowledge you're in the opposite camp though.

There seems to be very little space in between.

Or maybe that's the way the issue has been presented to us. I dunno.

I'm tired.

I don't know I am in the other camp.

I don't really know where I sit other than we should call out things for what they are ie. in this case Islamic Terrorism.

 

 

 

 

[Wrecker45 3,381]

35 minutes ago, Choke said:

Just had a real quick look at the Margaret Court thing - seems people are upset because the tennis venue is named after her, so I assume that's why there's so much media coverage.

Pretty crappy things to say though IMO.

 

 

 

I was actually talking about Margaret Courts original comments on boycotting Quantas which I think was well within her rights and the PC police were hysterical.

I didn't realise in the following days she had gone on to say something about lesbains being the work of the devil when I posted the above. I don't condone those comments and think she should rightly be criticised for them. 

[dieter 3,325]

17 hours ago, hardtack said:

I don't choose to ignore that at all... my point was that the western media couldn't give a rats when its muslim children killed, because a) it's a case of muslims killing muslims and b) it doesn't sell newspapers.

If they had been christian children, it would have been headline news.

We tend to overlook the fact that the numbers of westerners killed by muslim terrorists pales into insignificance when compared to the numbers of muslims killed by muslim terrorists.  If 126 muslims are slaughtered (as was the case just days before the Manchester attack) there is barely a ripple, yet if 22 christians (assumption) are slaughtered, then it's the muslims against the rest... against the infidels... and we are told that they (muslims in general) will stop at nothing until the world is purged of us heathen scum.  Absolute nonsense!

We also simply DO NOT want to accept the fact that the invasion of Iraq, an invasion based on thousands of lies, illegal according to all sorts of so-called civilised conventions, was in itself an act of gross TERROR.

We still don't know how many Iraqis were murdered by the Coalition of the Willing.

We also do not want to accept responsibility for the subsequent chaos and internal terror unleashed by this act of wanton brutality and madness.

Even further, I have yet to see any evidence that the orchestrators of the Sykes/Picqot agreement have or do or will accept responsibility for totally destabilizing all of the Middle East. The world is still reeling from the folly and greed of France and especially Britain.

[Jara 1,153]

23 hours ago, Biffen said:

The Manchester bomber hung an Isis flag from his house in England and still managed to get his martyrdom work done later.Should have been jailed.

The Syrian bomber was targeting people on buses.Sectarian.

Should we be jailing the hardline clerics who encourage Jihad?

I do realise MOST Muslims want nothing to do with violent extremism.

The British feel let down by their government not for the first time.

This is not far from Rotherham.

Porous borders are also to blame but police refusing to stereotype or profile suspects is ridiculous.

There is no doubt we are talking about a problem within Islam that is inflicted upon the rest of the world.

Its fair and sensible to acknowledge that I reckon.

 

You and I often disagree on such matters, Biff, but on most of your comments here, I'm in complete agreement. Can't believe how soft we are on potential terrorists. That fruitcake responsible for the Lindt café should have been in jail, as should have the Manchester madman. I'm as liberal and progressive as they come on most matters, and I'm very supportive of the 99.9% of local Muslims who want peace as much as I do, but it should be against the law to make favourable comments about a group of homicidal maniacs like Isis, or to wave their flags about. It should also be against the law to even look at their material on line - sounds difficult to police, I suppose, but we do it for paedophile material, we should do the same for them. Many of my Muslim friends feel just as strongly as I do. I also think Mark Zuckerberg should be charged as an accessory - incredible how Facebook will sell your most intimate details to the highest bidder, and yet they refuse to co-operate with security forces or stop killers spreading their vile propaganda.  

[Biffen 12,949]

I'm not surprised ,but quite glad that some people can see that Islam has huge problems in it.

Im glad some people who previously thought this was an irrational proposition can now agree.

Also .unthinkable a year or so ago- but some can now acknowledge that the white man is not infinitely responsible for all the worlds problems.

Furthermore,not all people who oppose Islam are racist-I'm hoping that is a given now- whereas last year it was not.

If some people are listening still I will tell you that Islam despises women and girls at a very primal level .This is yet another crack in the medieval doctrine.

[dieter 3,325]

2 hours ago, Biffen said:

I'm not surprised ,but quite glad that some people can see that Islam has huge problems in it.

Im glad some people who previously thought this was an irrational proposition can now agree.

Also .unthinkable a year or so ago- but some can now acknowledge that the white man is not infinitely responsible for all the worlds problems.

Furthermore,not all people who oppose Islam are racist-I'm hoping that is a given now- whereas last year it was not.

If some people are listening still I will tell you that Islam despises women and girls at a very primal level .This is yet another crack in the medieval doctrine.

As though the Catholics don't despise women and children. Ah yes, I hear you say, We are not medieval anymore, we had THE REFORMATION.

Big deal Reformation, Schmeformation, Christianity still lead inexorably to Hiroshima, places like Aushwitz, not to mention the carnage associated with Colonialism in South America, the Sub Continent, Africa, Australia, China and the Middle East.

Why just focus on Muslims? You sound as mad as Pauline Hanson, Biff. I thought you were smarter than her.