9 hours ago, Vogon Poetry said:

You're not suggesting that Roos lied to us when he said he didn't know Frawley was leaving are you?

But your point is well made.  We've been methodical and successful with our list management since Todd Viney took over.  That, and the fact that Jason Taylor hasn't put a foot wrong.

Roos lied/fibbed. He and many others inside and outside the club knew...

It was obvious to all Frawley was gone, not acknowledging it allowed the club to avoid awkward and potentially embarrising discussions and decisions. All clubs in a similar situation do it, and will continue to. The alternative is simple too messy and ugly. 

6 hours ago, PaulRB said:

It was obvious to all Frawley was gone, not acknowledging it allowed the club to avoid awkward and potentially embarrising discussions and decisions. All clubs in a similar situation do it, and will continue to. The alternative is simple too messy and ugly. 

as big Jimmy said,  the system makes people lie.

Some say Scully lied and he is evil but Roos lied and it's okay?

Of course I don't blame either but I won't use double standards.

24 minutes ago, Vogon Poetry said:

Some say Scully lied and he is evil but Roos lied and it's okay?

Of course I don't blame either but I won't use double standards.

Big difference lying to the media then a dying legend of the Melbourne Football Club  Vogon..

51 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Big difference lying to the media then a dying legend of the Melbourne Football Club  Vogon..

Glad you believe that Dazzle, we can rationalize a lot of lying if we differentiate the recipient.  I would have thought lying to thousands of loyal MFC fans was quite important but I'll remember it's ok for the MFC to lie to us.

And again for the record, I don't blame Scully and I don't blame Roos, but both lied. 

15 minutes ago, Vogon Poetry said:

Glad you believe that Dazzle, we can rationalize a lot of lying if we differentiate the recipient.  I would have thought lying to thousands of loyal MFC fans was quite important but I'll remember it's ok for the MFC to lie to us.

And again for the record, I don't blame Scully and I don't blame Roos, but both lied. 

 I dont blame Scully for taking the money, i would have too. But i don't like the way he carried on about it.. especially to Jimmy Stynes.

"I haven't signed, just going up to have a look"

7 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

 I dont blame Scully for taking the money, i would have too. But i don't like the way he carried on about it.. especially to Jimmy Stynes.

"I haven't signed, just going up to have a look"

Do you really believe our wise Irish President was in any doubt as to Scull Dogs real intention? 

Give me a break...

1 hour ago, Vogon Poetry said:

Some say Scully lied and he is evil but Roos lied and it's okay?

Of course I don't blame either but I won't use double standards.

Interesting philosophy.

I better not use any office stationery for personal reasons, apparently is as bad as robbing a bank.

 

19 minutes ago, PaulRB said:

Do you really believe our wise Irish President was in any doubt as to Scull Dogs real intention? 

What if he wasn't? What if he was?

Are you saying it's okay to lie provided the person you're lying to doesn't believe you?

 

Anyway, it's all part of football realpolitik. If the bad guy lies, he's evil incarnate. If the good guy lies, he's cleverly manipulating fools and ne'er-do-wells.

 

(For the record, Scully is evil incarnate.)

40 minutes ago, PaulRB said:

Do you really believe our wise Irish President was in any doubt as to Scull Dogs real intention? 

Give me a break...

And you do?

wow...

1 minute ago, dazzledavey36 said:

And you do?

wow...

No.

wow... ?

3 hours ago, Bay Riffin said:

as big Jimmy said,  the system makes people lie.

My biggest disappointment in the $cummy situation was that I allowed myself to believe him.  Learnt that lesson, hence why I never believed Frawley would stay.

These sort of things are pretty clear when you let yourself see them.

 

55 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

 I dont blame Scully for taking the money, i would have too. But i don't like the way he carried on about it.. especially to Jimmy Stynes.

"I haven't signed, just going up to have a look"

I've no doubt Scull Dog lied to Jim (and everyone else at the club).  I think Danger lied.  Franklin lied - everyone thought he was going to GWS.  Frawley, Howe and a host of others lied.

Scull Dog did nothing different to many others but people think worse of him here.  And for the record I don't think it makes a difference that it was to Jim, sick as he was.  In reality my question is "what was Jim doing fiddling in list management" but that's old ground and in a year where we are all so positive lets leave it.

We got fantastic compensation for Scully and he did us a favour as it's turned out. 

Frankly I think Dangerfield is the least admirable of that lot.  Adelaide had been fantastic to him, drafted him when he had a year to run at school, developed him, were a successful team and Danger ran out because he wanted to be with family.  What rot.  How many thousands of people have to move to countries for work reasons let alone interstate. Poor old Danger was an hour away! Scully had much more reason to leave - dysfunctional club and a contract offer than was a once in a lifetime opportunity.

Danger is a great footballer but I don't like him much and I don't admire what he did.

Scully is disliked by many here. And with good reason.

Roos is loved by many here. And with good reason.

I think the threshold question is not therefore 'who lied and to what extent did they lie' etc - it is more to do with what each individual did for this club and also the degree to which they were trying to benefit the club in their actions towards it.

In short, Scully and Roos are simply not on the same page in this respect. One hand a big hand in saving the club, the other appears not to have given the slightest stuff about it.

 

25 minutes ago, Vogon Poetry said:

I've no doubt Scull Dog lied to Jim (and everyone else at the club).  I think Danger lied.  Franklin lied - everyone thought he was going to GWS.  Frawley, Howe and a host of others lied.

Scull Dog did nothing different to many others but people think worse of him here.  And for the record I don't think it makes a difference that it was to Jim, sick as he was.  In reality my question is "what was Jim doing fiddling in list management" but that's old ground and in a year where we are all so positive lets leave it.

We got fantastic compensation for Scully and he did us a favour as it's turned out. 

Frankly I think Dangerfield is the least admirable of that lot.  Adelaide had been fantastic to him, drafted him when he had a year to run at school, developed him, were a successful team and Danger ran out because he wanted to be with family.  What rot.  How many thousands of people have to move to countries for work reasons let alone interstate. Poor old Danger was an hour away! Scully had much more reason to leave - dysfunctional club and a contract offer than was a once in a lifetime opportunity.

Danger is a great footballer but I don't like him much and I don't admire what he did.

I think you will find that Danger was a lot more honest to both Adelaide and Geelong than many other players that have been in his situation.  Just because he, or either club, didn't make it public, doesn't mean that he was lying.  I was at a function last year where he (Danger) was quite honest about the whole situation, and how he wanted to ensure both clubs were able to work together to get a fair outcome for both, with these discussions starting before the end of the season.

He compared his situation to that of Henderson leaving Carlton, and how they never played him for the last 3 weeks because of his honesty.

4 hours ago, billy2803 said:

My biggest disappointment in the $cummy situation was that I allowed myself to believe him.  Learnt that lesson, hence why I never believed Frawley would stay.

These sort of things are pretty clear when you let yourself see them.

 

What about Hogan?

3 hours ago, billy2803 said:

I think you will find that Danger was a lot more honest to both Adelaide and Geelong than many other players that have been in his situation.  Just because he, or either club, didn't make it public, doesn't mean that he was lying.  I was at a function last year where he (Danger) was quite honest about the whole situation, and how he wanted to ensure both clubs were able to work together to get a fair outcome for both, with these discussions starting before the end of the season.

He compared his situation to that of Henderson leaving Carlton, and how they never played him for the last 3 weeks because of his honesty.

It's always a difficult situation given the AFL rules and fans expectations. I believe Dangerfield told David Noble the footy manager. That's not a bad way to work it. You allow the list manager to do his thing whilst still giving your all for the team and coach. Henderson had been in terrible form and was probably getting traded even if he wanted to stay. I didn't blame Carlton for telling him to go on gardening leave.

As fans I think what we need to do is not to feed the media because they just love this stuff. Ignore their contract speculation and have a sense of maturity to allow clubs and players to work things out at the end of the year. There's plenty of time in September and October. 

Free Agency has filtered across from the US yet we haven't got the same maturity about it yet. Anyway, at least we are a step ahead of Rugby League and the craziness of a player signing a contract with a new club before the season even starts.