14 hours ago, Clint Bizkit said:

I'm bloody annoyed to be honest.

I for the life of me cannot work out what the coaches are thinking.  Here is a great opportunity for us to get a win against Port Adelaide and potentially get into the top eight but this is unlikely to happen with Jimmy Toumpas not in their team.

In all seriousness, our backline scares me to no end. Let us pray that Dixon, Westhoff and Trengove don't get many opportunities from their midfield because the two McDonald brothers and Garland will be in all sorts of trouble.

I think it'll be won or lost in the midfield as most games these days. If you think our backline looks shoddy take a look at theirs! At least with Jetta back this week we'll have our cool-headed general down there to stabilise things.

2 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

BS, what about Charlie Dixon? And we only have Max Gawn above that. Regardless, I think the point is that it's quality height vs quantity.

Dixon 200cm, hang me for 1cm!

13 hours ago, Deespicable said:

Then there's the decision to play Newton again ahead of Grimes. If ever there is a player who has been hard done by, it's Grimes.

 

Grimes has been deplorable for some time now, his decision making in particular he is just painfully slow at moving the ball on. His disposal is a bit iffy when he does get boot to ball maybe because of the pressure he feels either real or perceived.

I wouldn't say his careers over at MFC but he has a tonne of ground to make up before getting another gig. One thing he doesn't have which others like Newton and Michie do is the desire to compete and crack in. That's what Roos seems to value above all else and if he's not doing that in the VFL he won't get a game regardless how many possession he may rack up.

3 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Grimes has been deplorable for some time now, his decision making in particular he is just painfully slow at moving the ball on. His disposal is a bit iffy when he does get boot to ball maybe because of the pressure he feels either real or perceived.

I wouldn't say his careers over at MFC but he has a tonne of ground to make up before getting another gig. One thing he doesn't have which others like Newton and Michie do is the desire to compete and crack in. That's what Roos seems to value above all else and if he's not doing that in the VFL he won't get a game regardless how many possession he may rack up.

Strange post. He's a limited player but surely one thing nobody could question about Grimes is his desire to compete.

4 minutes ago, Members' Wing said:

Strange post. He's a limited player but surely one thing nobody could question about Grimes is his desire to compete.

Maybe it's just me, not saying he shirks a contest but I don't see the manic get ball at all costs approach that guys like Bugg and Kennedy have brought to the team.

Grimes is an average AFL player who got the most out of his ability

Vastly over rated around here

Giving him the 31 Jumper was just not fair. The Captaincy...I was and still am lost for words. 

Becoming a vegetarian i don't think would have helped either. 

1 hour ago, Members' Wing said:

Dixon 200cm, hang me for 1cm!

Actually 202cm, but whatever...

1 hour ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Grimes has been deplorable for some time now, his decision making in particular he is just painfully slow at moving the ball on. His disposal is a bit iffy when he does get boot to ball maybe because of the pressure he feels either real or perceived.

I wouldn't say his careers over at MFC but he has a tonne of ground to make up before getting another gig. One thing he doesn't have which others like Newton and Michie do is the desire to compete and crack in. That's what Roos seems to value above all else and if he's not doing that in the VFL he won't get a game regardless how many possession he may rack up.

Usually like your posts Gonzo but that is a shocker!

Grimes has had deficiencies but it's quite possible that he's worked on these under Macca and J.Plapp and has improved - other similar players have e.g. M.Jones.  We don't know until we see him at AFL level - which I hope and expect we do.

He most definitely has a crack.

He's out of favour with Roos because he's "part of the old problem" but IMO Bugg for example who is in favour, is not a better player.  It's almost certain he'll exercise his FA status at the end of the year and someone will get a best 22 player - a fresh start will do him good.  I'm fine with that because he's been a victim of MFC incompetence.

16 hours ago, leave it to deever said:

If we were to win 3 games in a row for once, this one and next week would be perfect timing and so sweet against the hawks.

 

I cant remember beating the latter in the last five years. Have to check the records.

 

But I get ahead of myself.

 

Go Dees.

 

 

I've been with my fiancée for 9 years. She's Hawthorn. We haven't beaten them in that time. Trust me.

I'm gonna stick my neck out and go on record re this week's team

I think we should have switched Gawn for Spencer.  Sure Gawn may get a record number of hitouts this week against no-one and no doubt someone will be throwing that back at me.  But I predict sure as night follows day that we'll hear over the following 3 weeks up against Hawthorn, Collingwood and Sydney that "Gawny is fatigued and really needs the bye" when he (continues) to perform below par.  I'd far prefer him refreshed for these 3 games.  I think Jake can really take it up to Port's "rucks".

I'd also have Dawes in the 22 forward.  I think we were too short there last week and that contributed to our too many handballs in the chain problems as we went forward.  With Hogan correctly working up and down the ground and Watts rucking, too often we looked up and targets were Garlett, Kennedy and Kent.  We needed a leading marking target and Dawes is the man.  I'm not suggesting we drop those 3, I think Newton (who came in as emergency) should come out and those 3 need to run more midfield minutes.  I admit this could backfire if we run out of midfield legs on the 6 day break but I think the benefit outweighs the risk.  We're unbalanced as is.  The possible solution is Petracca plays as a lead up forward much more than he has so far.

We're making an investment in the future with Oscar Mac and I can understand the angst.  We definitely need the extra tall back there and whether it should be him or Dunn or Frost is a reasonable question.  This week is a big test for him.

8 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

I'm gonna stick my neck out and go on record re this week's team

I think we should have switched Gawn for Spencer.  Sure Gawn may get a record number of hitouts this week against no-one and no doubt someone will be throwing that back at me.  But I predict sure as night follows day that we'll hear over the following 3 weeks up against Hawthorn, Collingwood and Sydney that "Gawny is fatigued and really needs the bye" when he (continues) to perform below par.  I'd far prefer him refreshed for these 3 games.  I think Jake can really take it up to Port's "rucks".

I'd also have Dawes in the 22 forward.  I think we were too short there last week and that contributed to our too many handballs in the chain problems as we went forward.  With Hogan correctly working up and down the ground and Watts rucking, too often we looked up and targets were Garlett, Kennedy and Kent.  We needed a leading marking target and Dawes is the man.  I'm not suggesting we drop those 3, I think Newton (who came in as emergency) should come out and those 3 need to run more midfield minutes.  I admit this could backfire if we run out of midfield legs on the 6 day break but I think the benefit outweighs the risk.  We're unbalanced as is.  The possible solution is Petracca plays as a lead up forward much more than he has so far.

We're making an investment in the future with Oscar Mac and I can understand the angst.  We definitely need the extra tall back there and whether it should be him or Dunn or Frost is a reasonable question.  This week is a big test for him.

Re Gawn I agree.  If we could ever afford to rest him,  this was the week. Really lost an important opportunity to have him reload and be fresh for the crucial following 3 weeks.  We need him at his best to have a chance against the better clubs. 

30 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Usually like your posts Gonzo but that is a shocker!

Grimes has had deficiencies but it's quite possible that he's worked on these under Macca and J.Plapp and has improved - other similar players have e.g. M.Jones.  We don't know until we see him at AFL level - which I hope and expect we do.

He most definitely has a crack.

He's out of favour with Roos because he's "part of the old problem" but IMO Bugg for example who is in favour, is not a better player.  It's almost certain he'll exercise his FA status at the end of the year and someone will get a best 22 player - a fresh start will do him good.  I'm fine with that because he's been a victim of MFC incompetence.

Fair enough - maybe I shouldn't write him off but I remember last year just tearing my hair out with him particularly against the Pies. 

Maybe my "having a crack" comment was unfair. Really it is his decision making that is the frustration and when we already have TMac back there freaking us out I don't know whether we can afford to have Grimes as well. He'llprobably get a chance at some point this year so when he does I will keep an open mind. 

2 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Fair enough - maybe I shouldn't write him off but I remember last year just tearing my hair out with him particularly against the Pies. 

Maybe my "having a crack" comment was unfair. Really it is his decision making that is the frustration and when we already have TMac back there freaking us out I don't know whether we can afford to have Grimes as well. He'llprobably get a chance at some point this year so when he does I will keep an open mind. 

He's been playing midfield at Casey.  Things change and can improve - look at M.Jones early season form - he was surprisingly very good up to his injury.

2 minutes ago, Jesse Christ said:

Re Gawn I agree.  If we could ever afford to rest him,  this was the week. Really lost an important opportunity to have him reload and be fresh for the crucial following 3 weeks.  We need him at his best to have a chance against the better clubs. 

Maybe the coaches think we need to win the games we should and this is a game we should win all things considered. You have to take each game as it comes (while also balancing the long term view - not easy) and I think Gawn needs to play with what he brings. Maybe bringing in Spencer to ruck more minutes couldve been an option with Gawn resting more often but to leave him out altogether I think would be tempting fate.

14 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

I'm gonna stick my neck out and go on record re this week's team

I think we should have switched Gawn for Spencer. 

 

3 minutes ago, Jesse Christ said:

Re Gawn I agree.  If we could ever afford to rest him,  this was the week. Really lost an important opportunity to have him reload and be fresh for the crucial following 3 weeks.  We need him at his best to have a chance against the better clubs. 

Why give up our one clear advantage this week? 

"Better clubs"?! This week's game isn't a lock you know?

Who do you guys think we are that we can bring an underdone VFL ruckman into a team with a game plan based around clearances and still beat a team that is considered better than us?

This game is worth the same amount of points as any of the next three, let's focus on trying to win this one first before planning for the "better clubs" hey?

 

 

2 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

He's been playing midfield at Casey.  Things change and can improve - look at M.Jones early season form - he was surprisingly very good up to his injury.

Yep again fair enough - I probably didn't articulate it well but I was trying to explain why Roos wouldn't have him in the team. Considering Roos' focus on competitiveness and competitive players its the only reason I can fathom other than he doesn't think he's cut out for senior footy (not strong enough, not quick enough, too slow to make a decision etc). That's a weakness I thought he had compared to others who are getting games ahead of him which is why I assume he is not in the team.

2 hours ago, Deespicable said:

No he's a victim of the Paul Roos era - Neeld made him captain and never dropped him - and DL's derision of almost anyone who plays in defence.

He'll go to the Tigers next year and sadly I expect he'll prove to be a very handy role player - he's never going to be a star, but you don't want 22 stars, you want a mix of stars and role players.

Disagree. His formative years were ruined by injury, but also by club led incompetence.

Contrary to the suggestion in your post, him being made captain is a prime example of how we have basically killed him off.

We agree that he's been damaged, just disagree on the cause!

 

16 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

I'm gonna stick my neck out and go on record re this week's team

I think we should have switched Gawn for Spencer.  Sure Gawn may get a record number of hitouts this week against no-one and no doubt someone will be throwing that back at me.  But I predict sure as night follows day that we'll hear over the following 3 weeks up against Hawthorn, Collingwood and Sydney that "Gawny is fatigued and really needs the bye" when he (continues) to perform below par.  I'd far prefer him refreshed for these 3 games.  I think Jake can really take it up to Port's "rucks".

I'd also have Dawes in the 22 forward.  I think we were too short there last week and that contributed to our too many handballs in the chain problems as we went forward.  With Hogan correctly working up and down the ground and Watts rucking, too often we looked up and targets were Garlett, Kennedy and Kent.  We needed a leading marking target and Dawes is the man.  I'm not suggesting we drop those 3, I think Newton (who came in as emergency) should come out and those 3 need to run more midfield minutes.  I admit this could backfire if we run out of midfield legs on the 6 day break but I think the benefit outweighs the risk.  We're unbalanced as is.  The possible solution is Petracca plays as a lead up forward much more than he has so far.

We're making an investment in the future with Oscar Mac and I can understand the angst.  We definitely need the extra tall back there and whether it should be him or Dunn or Frost is a reasonable question.  This week is a big test for him.

I mentioned in the selections thread that I thought Gawn needed to be rested this week and Pederson come in to take on Jackson Trengove in the ruck. I might be wrong of whether Gawn is a little cooked or not, or a little sore. He may well be fine and need to refine his strategy at the ruck. What I have noticed with Trengove is that he's prepared to concede the ruck contest but be ready to compete at ground to be more active and work on clearances. The Dees will need to be on. Dawes is listed first emergency, I wonder if there might be a late change in the midst. Perhaps not for Gawn ... perhaps for Newton as you mention. Leaving Watts or Hogan up front at home as a target. Or Dawes..

Look, it is a big test for Omac, undoubtedly. I'll back him and the FD to back him in for a second week and a better output rather than straight back to Casey. It will give him 2 games and as I pointed out in selections thread with Hawks, Pies and Swans to come we can put in more experience if necessary against the more fancied opponents. I'm sure we will see a better game from OMac this week who looked a little lost first outing for a while.

 

 

9 minutes ago, stuie said:

 

Why give up our one clear advantage this week? 

"Better clubs"?! This week's game isn't a lock you know?

Who do you guys think we are that we can bring an underdone VFL ruckman into a team with a game plan based around clearances and still beat a team that is considered better than us?

This game is worth the same amount of points as any of the next three, let's focus on trying to win this one first before planning for the "better clubs" hey?

 

 

Gawn isn't playing well that's why - due to fatigue and injury.  He's going for marks with just one hand and just trying to equalise the contest.   Spencer has had 3 weeks back at VFL level and looks ready to go IMO.  This is the week of the next 4 to rest Gawn - in no way am I saying this game is a "gimme" - I tipped us to lose.  IMO In the big picture we'd be better off with Spencer than Gawn this week.

19 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Gawn isn't playing well that's why - due to fatigue and injury.  He's going for marks with just one hand and just trying to equalise the contest.   Spencer has had 3 weeks back at VFL level and looks ready to go IMO.  This is the week of the next 4 to rest Gawn - in no way am I saying this game is a "gimme" - I tipped us to lose.  IMO In the big picture we'd be better off with Spencer than Gawn this week.

I just reckon Misson and Roos would have a pretty good handle of Gawn's fatigue and injury and they've decided it's not a factor.

How do you know he's fatigued and not just had a poor couple of weeks given the extra attention opposition teams have been giving him?

 

3 minutes ago, stuie said:

I just reckon Misson and Roos would have a pretty good handle of Gawn's fatigue and injury and they've decided it's not a factor.

How do you know he's fatigued and not just had a poor couple of weeks given the extra attention opposition teams have been giving him?

 

agreed. Teams are coming into games with strategies around nullifying him. And it's working.

13 minutes ago, The Song Formerly Known As said:

agreed. Teams are coming into games with strategies around nullifying him. And it's working.

Brissie may have "nullified" him, but still losing by 10 goals doesn't imply to me that it's "working".

All of our young players will have up and down periods and games, we're maturing as a team because we can keep performing as a group, despite this.

1 hour ago, stuie said:

I just reckon Misson and Roos would have a pretty good handle of Gawn's fatigue and injury and they've decided it's not a factor.

How do you know he's fatigued and not just had a poor couple of weeks given the extra attention opposition teams have been giving him?

 

"But I predict sure as night follows day that we'll hear over the following 3 weeks up against Hawthorn, Collingwood and Sydney that "Gawny is fatigued and really needs the bye" when he (continues) to perform below par."

Let's see if I'm correct. 

3 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

"But I predict sure as night follows day that we'll hear over the following 3 weeks up against Hawthorn, Collingwood and Sydney that "Gawny is fatigued and really needs the bye" when he (continues) to perform below par."

Let's see if I'm correct. 

6 minutes ago, stuie said:

You look wiser than I expected.