I guess the one thing in Pedo's favour as far as the trade goes is that Gys hasn't played a game for NMFC. That puts us marginally ahead in that our guy has played a few poor games at least. I still think we paid too much, especially since we downgraded in a pick swap as well. Given the relative merits of the players and their careers to date I would have said Gys had more currency and that they should be giving us a low pick as a sweetener.

I think we were done over with every trade we did. A course in Negotiations Skills 101 should be at the top of the list. FWIW Martin was/is a better player than Pederson - IMHO the coaches are the ones who needed some self examination there

We gave away a high pick from years earlier that had depreciated to almost zero.. not even close to the same thing.

Some people need to realise we have a whole group of professional coaches that are privy to a hell of a lot more than you or I know. You would think it reasonable just to have a tiny bit of faith and trust in them to pick the side they want to pick each week, wouldn't you? No that it matters, because no matter what they do there will be a bloom of spineless jellyfish on this board to pot them for it.

We have clearly gotten far better then we were 4 weeks ago. At the moment we are capable of playing a couple of good quarters per week but fading out in other parts badly. We are potentially not far away at all from the wheel turning. They are still a very, very young group and are just getting used to each other and the coach. Nathan Jones is still just 25 but has the stature of a 30 year old veteran at our club. There is a heap of talent that is miles from reaching its ceiling on this list. Instead of shirting all over everything they are trying to do can we PLEASE show a little SUPPORT for once

I for one expect a massive victory this weekend which will give them a nice little boost

Wasn't the head of that Professional Group of Coaches, the one who remarked after we copped a hiding in the first game, we didn't see that coming?

Why not, didn't the do any homework on the opposition, did they overestimate the 4 mature age players we drafted, did they think we were better than we are? Why didn't they know this, they are professionals so it's their job too. How could they get it so wrong?

If the blue sky structure-wise is to have two tall forwards in Clark and Dawes there as our best players, then why not foster that system with our younger players like Fitz when C & D are unavailable?

I appreciate it's a lot more complex than what I put forward but seriously when is Fitz going to get another chance to show his wares?

I totally agree. to bring Fitzy in to play FF... but this week. Not against the Blues last week.

I want him in Now for these coming 2 games. Suns & Tiges,,, & see after that.

Wasn't the head of that Professional Group of Coaches, the one who remarked after we copped a hiding in the first game, we didn't see that coming?

Why not, didn't the do any homework on the opposition, did they overestimate the 4 mature age players we drafted, did they think we were better than we are? Why didn't they know this, they are professionals so it's their job too. How could they get it so wrong?

because s--t happens RF. Obviously we came out and played weak, lazy football, it is fair tio say Neeld did not see that coming, yes.

theyve gotten considerably better since then

the constant potting from their own 'supporters' over whatever they do is certainly not a helpful thing wouldn't you imagine?

But this IS the point. My opening comments wre at least partly based upon comments by Blues' supporters, including a couple of ex players. If defenders or mids know they can't kick forward to a target, poor decisions follow. They were watching, for example, Howes who had a dreadful day against much bigger opponents. Unless it is wet a forward line without talls is manner from heaven for defenders. One other point. Why not play Pederson and see if as a lone forward, he has anything to offer. Structure maintained, the other forwards having someone to crumb under.

Didn't we give Gysberts for Pederson?

In a perfect world like with Clark fit & firing last year,,, I totally agree.

But we need Fitzy & Dawes in this week, & full of confidence, for the next 2 matches to help set him up... you need to start to look at the bigger picture whilst we are developing, rather than one week at a time.

Dawes wasn't fit enough last week, & Fitzy is green... so it would have been lambs to the slaughter,,, with less run. this would most likely have damaged their confidence, both of them & then, the teams belief in the structures.

this is the better way forward. bring both in this week together, both physically fit & with confidence...

Edited May 7, 201312 yr by dee-luded

because s--t happens RF. Obviously we came out and played weak, lazy football, it is fair tio say Neeld did not see that coming, yes.

theyve gotten considerably better since then

the constant potting from their own 'supporters' over whatever they do is certainly not a helpful thing wouldn't you imagine?

There is an enormous amount of frustration CB and the supporters have just about had it. We seem no closer to the finals than we were 6 years ago, in fact we are further away.

The continual excuses are getting less and less acceptable.

There is an enormous amount of frustration CB and the supporters have just about had it. We seem no closer to the finals than we were 6 years ago, in fact we are further away.

The continual excuses are getting less and less acceptable.

+1 every day of the week

There is an enormous amount of frustration CB and the supporters have just about had it. We seem no closer to the finals than we were 6 years ago, in fact we are further away.

The continual excuses are getting less and less acceptable.

I haven't heard too many excuses - just statements of fact and a refusal to buy into the unrealistic expectations that some on this forum seem to have. Neeld has been very clear about where we are at and doesn't make excuses. Yes we are crap at the moment. No it's not much fun to watch. Yes it's frustrating. The point is that over the last three weeks there have been signs of improvement in intensity and general commitment to the task. The guys tried their hearts out against Carlton but were beaten by a more experienced, mature and talented side. Did you honestly think we could win that game without a key forward and without experienced midfield runners? I'm convinced at this stage that we are closer to finals. This time last year we were still be waiting for our first win. We're currently in a position to win a second for the year. Every week brings us closer to finals but it just wont be to be this year. Patience RobbieF. Good things come to those who wait.

We could have picked up Hannath instead of one of the 4 &/or upgraded Magner to give Jones a hand. Who would you prefer Hannath or Pederson/Rodan/Gillies?

Hannath was drafted at No 8. Who would you have not recruited? Jack Viney?

There is an enormous amount of frustration CB and the supporters have just about had it. We seem no closer to the finals than we were 6 years ago, in fact we are further away.

The continual excuses are getting less and less acceptable.

when you talk about 6 years ago, you are talking about Daniher being succeeded by Bailey. How does that have anything to do with Neeld whose senior career is 28 games long? Bailey had his 4 years and did not get very far at all. What is worse is that he in no way left a solid bedrock for Neeld to work with. This has just meant more turning over of players, so we have stayed a young group with no experience of each other. None of this is Neeld's fault. To what extent is it Neeld's responsibility for the lacklustre results we have been getting from high draft picks in Watts, Sylvia, Morton, Trengove and even Frawley - these are the same players they were before Neeld arrived. When he has had 4 years of his own methods and there is still no product, then we can start to tire of excuses, at this stage he deserves more patience. We can't just keep replacing coaches until one of them takes a bag of lemons and immediately makes lemonade, because this will never, ever happen.

secondly, for those like yourselves who are fed up and intent on placing it all on Neeld's shoulders, you still have to ask what you are supposedly achieving with this constant bleating at whatever he does

Hannath was drafted at No 8. Who would you have not recruited? Jack Viney?

Hannath was drafted in the PSD not the National Draft. We didn't have any selections in the PSD because we had a full compliment of players; if we had a selection in the PSD it would have been before Freo and we would have drafted Hannath.

Soxy, no idea really have you, try reading what I and Fifty-5 wrote

I Have "no idea" ?? I was under the impression we picked up Rodan with the view to playing him as a senior player NOT a molly coddling Casey assistant Coach to some younger players. That's what we employ coaches for isn't it ??? Too many people trying to tell players what to do is the best recipe for disaster and confusion... Since when have we recruited players for the sole purpose of teaching players in our Reserves Comp. at the expense of somebody who could be (and SHOULD be) playing in our senior team.. What a waste !! As if we can afford to do that !! He is NOT up to AFL Senior standard... Pick 88 or pick 2088.... We wasted a pick !! We have the likes of Magner sitting on the Rookie list !!! Rodan is just another recruiting BUNGLE... Telling me I have no idea is irrelevant to me.. I will put forward my ideas just as you put forward yours but hopefully I won't have to tell you you have no idea..

when you talk about 6 years ago, you are talking about Daniher being succeeded by Bailey. How does that have anything to do with Neeld whose senior career is 28 games long? Bailey had his 4 years and did not get very far at all. What is worse is that he in no way left a solid bedrock for Neeld to work with. This has just meant more turning over of players, so we have stayed a young group with no experience of each other. None of this is Neeld's fault. To what extent is it Neeld's responsibility for the lacklustre results we have been getting from high draft picks in Watts, Sylvia, Morton, Trengove and even Frawley - these are the same players they were before Neeld arrived. When he has had 4 years of his own methods and there is still no product, then we can start to tire of excuses, at this stage he deserves more patience. We can't just keep replacing coaches until one of them takes a bag of lemons and immediately makes lemonade, because this will never, ever happen.

secondly, for those like yourselves who are fed up and intent on placing it all on Neeld's shoulders, you still have to ask what you are supposedly achieving with this constant bleating at whatever he does

Well [censored] now you've explained al that to me I guess you are right none of it's Neeld's fault, it must be someone else's fault, all we have to do is find out who. Got any clues?

I get sick of going over the same crap, I've already made my position clear and every time a new head pops up I have to go through it again. Neeld said it was his list, he said it was closer to rising up the ladder than anyone thought, he said WTF hit us when we got smashed in the first game, he waited until the second year before he got rid of the players he didn't want when, if he's had a look at the list he could have had a clean out in his first year, he doesn't seem to have any idea how to stem the flow of goals against us, he has got the worst skilled side in the comp. He has a team that can't get it's hands on the ball and continually have a 100 possessions less than the opposition, he's made some stupid mistakes in drafting, he's let players go we needed and drafted players we don't. But none of tis is his fault its all Baileys.

I'd go on but I'm getting bored. If you got a resume from a potential coach and it read like Neelds you would bin it in one second.

Tall players don't necessarily equate to good contested marks. Eddie Betts can attest to this - he consistently out marks taller opponents in contested situations through better use of his body.

It would be interesting to see who in Melbourne would stand out in a basic kick to kick contest with half the group up each end. If you remove Clarke, Jamar, Dawes and Frawly I think we would find Sylvia, Howe, Garland and even Trengove would be amongst the best.

Hannath was drafted in the PSD not the National Draft. We didn't have any selections in the PSD because we had a full compliment of players; if we had a selection in the PSD it would have been before Freo and we would have drafted Hannath.

Apologies - my error.

Gillies, Rodan, Pedersen will be gone at years end

Poor draft picks but didn't cost us anything

agreed ... all were wasted picks. Swap for 3 youngsters who would walk over glass for a game

Gillies, Rodan, Pedersen will be gone at years end

Poor draft picks but didn't cost us anything

Believe Pedersen has a 2 year contract. The others, one year.

Rodan was the only draft pick (88). Gillies was delisted FA, Pedersen was a trade with Gysberts.

Believe Pedersen has a 2 year contract. The others, one year.

Rodan was the only draft pick (88). Gillies was delisted FA, Pedersen was a trade with Gysberts.

yeah but the jellyfish have no doubt that pick 88 would have unearthed the next riccuito

Edited May 7, 201312 yr by Curry & Beer

But this IS the point. My opening comments wre at least partly based upon comments by Blues' supporters, including a couple of ex players. If defenders or mids know they can't kick forward to a target, poor decisions follow. They were watching, for example, Howes who had a dreadful day against much bigger opponents. Unless it is wet a forward line without talls is manner from heaven for defenders. One other point. Why not play Pederson and see if as a lone forward, he has anything to offer. Structure maintained, the other forwards having someone to crumb under.

Didn't we give Gysberts for Pederson?

Yes we did, and we picked Gysberts with pick #11 which we got from Carlton for Brock, which means we swapped Brock for Pedo.

Lovely

yeah but the jellyfish have no doubt that pick 88 would have unearthed the next riccuito

Well one thing we know, there are no Riccuito's in that lot.

Who would you prefer Hannath or Pederson?

Well one thing we know, there are no Riccuito's in that lot.

Who would you prefer Hannath or Pederson?

Every day of the week

We could have picked up Hannath instead of one of the 4 &/or upgraded Magner to give Jones a hand. Who would you prefer Hannath or Pederson/Rodan/Gillies?

We couldn't of picked up Hannath because he wasn't an option when we picked up the others in the trading period. Our mistake was picking up one player too many in the trading period and not allowing ourselves a pick in the pre-season draft. It was a little naive to think that the others would leeave him so that we could take him as a rookie. And as for Magner, we had to upgrade Evans and Nicholson from the rookie list otherwise we could not retain them any longer on our rookie list (Couch and Magner were not threatened). It is all hypothetical but the selection lads thought it seemed to fill gaps in our list at the time. The loss of Rivers and Moloney (i.e the 2011 Moloney not the 2012 Moloney) was where we erred.

Believe Pedersen has a 2 year contract. The others, one year.

Rodan was the only draft pick (88). Gillies was delisted FA, Pedersen was a trade with Gysberts.

Remember when Roos was drafting old hacks & castaways from other clubs??? remember the derision people threw at him, for bringing in NQR's?

... watts in a name anyway????

& to think I was pushing as hard as I could, to get people interested in Roos as a culture changer 2 Years ago, & I got ridiculed, yet again!

Well one thing we know, there are no Riccuito's in that lot.

Who would you prefer Hannath or Pederson?

what about a Rhyce Shaw???

What's with all the love for Hannath?

I think Pedo has shown as much as Jack has in there couple games which isn't a great deal.