Is it our development of players? How would our top draft picks be fairing at a powerhouse such as Collingwood, West Coast, or even Hawthorn? I'm getting fed up with our alleged next generation rotting in the reserves every year. Morton, Cook, McDonald, Tapscott etc. I realise a couple of these boys are recovering from injury but gee its time to get games into these guys rather than guys like Joel Macdonald who has peaked as an average AFL player. Jackson Paine a raw 18 year old kid played on Friday night for the pies and had an impact up forward, why is Lucas Cook yet to get a game? I just don't understand where the improvement is supposed to come from. Tynan had a crack on Saturday. The faster we get these kinda guys up to 50+ games the better. I was willing to cop some beltings during the Bailey rebuild of 2007 and 2008 and I am willing again this year, as long as the young draftees get the nod to learn Neeld's way as quickly as possible ahead of consistently underperforming average senior players.

Is it our development of players? How would our top draft picks be fairing at a powerhouse such as Collingwood, West Coast, or even Hawthorn? I'm getting fed up with our alleged next generation rotting in the reserves every year. Morton, Cook, McDonald, Tapscott etc. I realise a couple of these boys are recovering from injury but gee its time to get games into these guys rather than guys like Joel Macdonald who has peaked as an average AFL player. Jackson Paine a raw 18 year old kid played on Friday night for the pies and had an impact up forward, why is Lucas Cook yet to get a game? I just don't understand where the improvement is supposed to come from. Tynan had a crack on Saturday. The faster we get these kinda guys up to 50+ games the better. I was willing to cop some beltings during the Bailey rebuild of 2007 and 2008 and I am willing again this year, as long as the young draftees get the nod to learn Neeld's way as quickly as possible ahead of consistently underperforming average senior players.

Cook is injuredMonde and has been since early August.

On top of that he makes Tynan look fat.

Forget Cook till June at the earliest

If we have 22 players who are willing to put their body on the line and do their job you are always a chance and at least you can be admired for giving your all. West Coast have Cox, Glass & Kennedy as genuine A graders, Kerr's best days are now not as regular as they were but what they do is play to a plan. So Neeld needs to identify the 22 he can rely upon to do what he asks, so no matter who those 22 are if he does that we will not see a repeat of last years effort in Perth

Priddis is the extractor, if he does a Black and gets it out to their runners then we face the same problem as Saturday.

Priddis is the extractor, if he does a Black and gets it out to their runners then we face the same problem as Saturday.

Maybe give Bail the job on him only one I can think of off the top of my head who can run with him. From left field could we shake things up a fair bit play Howe off half back similar to Harbrow, Clarke at CHF, Martin at FF rotating with Rush, who knows need to move the magnets around the white board a fair bit do the FD during planning sessions this week

As shown throughout the pre season and early on Saturday, our attack and ability to win the ball at times is OK. Our posession count isn't down because of effort or contested work, its down because we are simply nowhere near as skilled as other teams.

Just look at Hawthorn. There is basically no player in their team that will not hit the target from 15-45 metres. There are so many players in our side who have the endeavour but lack any skills or football brain.

Here's a list of players that played on Saturday who would never get into the AFL on kicking skills alone.

Batram, Macdonald, Rivers, Grimes, Bail, McKenzie, Jamar, Martin. All these players were used through the back half at stages and coughed the ball up way to easily.

Add to this list, Green who simply shits himself and just bombs the ball forward, Davey who is to scared to get the ball in a contest, Garland who only bombs the ball away and Moloney who's a good kick but only bombs it in the air, it's easy to see how easily we fall done.

How is this going to be addressed? Does it fall back to Neald or another coach? Surely there's an expectation that if you make AFL level you at least have this skilled under control.

People lay into Morton, Watts and Sylvia but they are exactly what we need in this side. Players with composure and skills seem to grow on trees at other clubs, sadly we only have three of them.

Lets stop putting "the complete clean-out" talk and put it down to the emotional drain of losing Jim Stynes after such a long and bitter fight .

I've vented my spleen about softness from players .A lot of our play was reactionary .They will get a good kick up the arse and being away from us next week may be good for them .

Does anyone think we have a chance against the Meth Coast Eagles?

Or am I just searching in vain for hope?

Let's not do that. I'm sick and tired of the club's and supporters excuses - it's been going on for too long now. An emotional drain is absolutely NO excuse for our display on the weekend. We need to stop wrapping this playing group in cotton wool and expose them for the heartless plebs they are. A good portion of our players don't have the talent, work rate or the will to successed. Furthermore, we have the most pathetic exuse for senior players I've ever witnessed at any club since I've been follwing AFL! How many times does Brad Green come out and say we need to stand up - he sounds like a broken record player to be honest and he is one of the biggest offenders!!!! Time for these pitiful excuse for leaders such as Davey and Green to be dropped and if Moloney doesn't lose the chip on his shoulder he can go join them also.

I am thankful our coach doesn't come up with excuses - thankyou Mark!!!!!

As far as our response next week I couldn't care less. Too many times we respond the week after a bad performance - this is not good enough. We need to respond during games, respond at the next contest. Make it right during the game, not the following week!

Edited April 2, 201213 yr by simma02

Let's not do that. I'm sick and tired of the club's and supporters excuses - it's been going on for too long now. An emotional drain is absolutely NO excuse for our display on the weekend. We need to stop wrapping this playing group in cotton wool and expose them for the heartless plebs they are. A good portion of our players don't have the talent, work rate or the will to successed. Furthermore, we have the most pathetic exuse for senior players I've ever witnessed at any club since I've been follwing AFL! How many times does Brad Green come out and say we need to stand up - he sounds like a broken record player to be honest and he is one of the biggest offenders!!!! Time for these pitiful excuse for leaders such as Davey and Green to be dropped and if Moloney doesn't lose the chip on his shoulder he can go join them also.

I am thankful our coach doesn't come up with excuses - thankyou Mark!!!!!

As far as our response next week I couldn't care less. Too many times we respond the week after a bad performance - this is not good enough. We need to respond during games, respond at the next contest. Make it right during the game, not the following week!

Some times I think we are world Champions at excuses simma02.

when the truth is we are simply not good enough.

As many know from my posts I live in the west and hate the f%&kin Eagles more than anything in the world. In 2002 Worsfold took over a list with Jakovich, Gardiner and Cousins as their A graders. They had some promising youngsters in Kerr & Glass and honest workers in Embley, Banfield and Braun. Cox was a lanky rookie who had no tank and couldn't kick but he had heart and desire. I watched that team develop from 02-04 with Judd coming into the side to make Himself, Cousins & Kerr the up & coming midfield to take over from Brissy's fab four.

We all know what that list did and how they made average players like Hansen, Lynch & Hunter look good. Whilst it's doom & gloom for many here things can change very quickly whilst it hasn't for us for a long time those we write off as being unsure of or going nowhere may surprise us

Great Post.

They are again getting the best out of Average players - Scott Selwood, Masten, McKenzie, Schofield etc

ive watched games where Dunn has been the only bloke even trying.

Same Norm.

One of the few forward players that bobs up when the chips are down...or when the goings good. Sticks it to the opponents and doesn't take a backward step either. Does do some silly things at times for sure which lets himself and the team down and needs to eliminate such acts. But knows how to position himself and reads the play better than most in our forward line (other than Jurrah when he's on....and if he ever returns). Can kick a goal from anywhere within 55 meters as well. Few other players in our team can take a serious roost from 50 or just beyond (from a set shot) and have a decent chance of making it. Also knows where the goals are within 30 or so and on the move.

Not a superstar or A grader but better value than most of the other forwards in the list at this point. This wouldn't be the case in many other teams lists i realise but this is where our list is at.

Maybe give Bail the job on him only one I can think of off the top of my head who can run with him. From left field could we shake things up a fair bit play Howe off half back similar to Harbrow, Clarke at CHF, Martin at FF rotating with Rush, who knows need to move the magnets around the white board a fair bit do the FD during planning sessions this week

A must if we're to have any success up forward in the medium term IMO.

Martin into the ruck roaming across HF / HB as WYL (or RPFC) suggested.

Jamar off the bench to rest Martin...or run with the 2nd tall such as Cox when required. Or even rest him at CHB as a protective wall or let him run around at KC when the 2 talls aren't required. Wasted in the middle and has no spring anymore, making most of his taps neutral at best. Too cumbersome when the ball hits the deck after the center bounce as well, Martin has better hands and reflexes IMO.

In summary.....

1. Fix the spine (Clarke to CHF & Martin into the middle to start). 2. Get two outside class mids and find a better inside one than what we already have (maybe Magner) . 3. Get a small crumbing forward.

We then have ourselves the bare bones of a potentially competitive football team that we can then build the rest of our list around.

Until we do this we are just gonna be on the receiving end of more and more pain and woe...for many years to come.

That's just my take

Edited April 2, 201213 yr by Rusty Nails

What names could we have attracted with our cap space that we didn't already try to entice?

WHo would you have traded, and for what?

Clubs aren't looking to trade gun 3rd year players for guys like Green and Davey, once great, but with only a few years left.

Once they have that bird in the hand, they want to hang onto it.

WE might've got a few handy draft picks, but then we'd have been even more of a kindergarten.

It'd be like starting up GWS in melbourne, but with existing prejudices.

Cap room or no cap room - no one wants to come here anyway. And that's been proven on more than 1 occasion.

This post sort of has a bit relevance to a lot of what is going on on the wider Demonland site.

With regards to the type / quality of players we have drafted, I think that there is a strong argument to be made that our systemic poor performance (and percieved - if not factual) culture issues can impact players development incredibly. Put any one of our draftees that have been less than inspiring to date relative to their draft number in a team such as Sydney Swans or Collingwood where there exists an incredibly strong team ethos, only a winning culture attitude (no tanking - if that happened.....), fantastic coaching set up AND the existence of senior players who are highly respected by the wider group of AFL players and their development may have taken a different rate of growth.

Having blind and absolute confidence in teh systems and proceedsures and a strict adherance to those by senior players and the rest of the playing group makes a difference. Add to this that many of the kids we drafted got games earlier than they would have at other clubs.

Its going to be hugely interesting if you can build team spirit, an ethos of excellence and a non negotiable will to win out of guys who have collectively been exposed to an environment that is less than optimal. Momentum and a winning culture is such a powerful ingredient to developing players and developing a winning team that play together and for eachother.

I really hope we can get there, but we might be one of the first teams to do it if we do. Hawthorn probably did it, but they seemed to have some older players and a history of success through the 80's and early 90's which probably flowed through.

Geelnog did not bottom out, nor did Sydney.

I am so glad we have activated our two picks next year - there is no more time to wait around to try and get a winning culture in place. It must start now.

Cap room or no cap room - no one wants to come here anyway. And that's been proven on more than 1 occasion.

That's not correct.

We lured Mitch Clark.

But it was then.