My god you are painfully slow on this one.

You DID imply that Bailey doesn't give 110%, as the one positive noted about Matthews was that he did.

If Bailey already did, then what would be point of mentioning it, or even bringing in Matthews?

If you read a bit more carefully, I referred to your "lazy and thoughtless use of a cliche".

Which in this case, made implications towards Bailey that weren't correct.

If you took the time to understand what you were saying, you might have formed in your own words something more appropriate and meaningful.

No i never said anything about Matthews working harder than Bailey at all, i can't stop YOU from reading it that way though can i..

Leigh Matthews has the Runs on the board though doesn't he...The Cups are in the cupboard both as a player & as a coach.

So i am wondering why you have a an adverse opinion towards Dean having a few chats & picking up ideas..To me it is good business.

have you bothered to look at freo's injury list? it's no wonder. just because they lose to the eagles in wa, doesn't mean they are on the way down. look at west coasts form through hawthorn in tassie. the hawks rate them and the general footy industry know it. except you.

here is another fact, west coast won two of their 3 flags before freo started. freo's performances and circumstances including shite drafting and trading early on made it a joke, but wht harvey has put in place in his time through hard work is culture changing and that of demanding good performance. consitently.

just at a glance - in a nut shell - you have no idea.

Yes i do know Freo's injury list at present...15. Not good i know, but every club has injuries so i don't think it should always be trotted out as the excuse.

Example-Hawthorn just last Sunday. They Should not have won, but they did, because they all knuckled down (Young & Old) and all worked their butts off and refused to lie down.

They have a winning culture.

Freo also lost to Richmond the week before...i doubt they will make the top 4. Wet Coke are a much better bet at this stage.

Freo's shite drafting is not an excuse. That all helps to build or erode a winning culture.

No i never said anything about Matthews working harder than Bailey at all, i can't stop YOU from reading it that way though can i..

Leigh Matthews has the Runs on the board though doesn't he...The Cups are in the cupboard both as a player & as a coach.

So i am wondering why you have a an adverse opinion towards Dean having a few chats & picking up ideas..To me it is good business.

My god.

Maybe you need to re-read your post?

What on earth is the relevance of Matthews having "given 110%" if it is not in comparison to Bailey?

It's completely superfluous and a meaningless cliche.

Yes, Matthews has a good track record.

That has never been in dispute.

I don't. I've stated multiple times, in replies to you within this thread that I support the use of a mentor.

Please, in future, attention to detail.

Sorry about that slagging mistaken you for another poster. apologies given elswhere.

I agree with you that WCE had it in spades and they blew it (or something else with it).

I'd love a flag but with the hard work being done I dont want to compromise that success in the way WCE did.

With where they were coming into 2005, they should have been looking at a number of flags from that group. They got one. But they paid a penalty which is still costing them for their excesses. They are an extremely rich club with great resources. Its early days whether they are back on track.

There are a number of models of success that we have seen in the past...Brisbane, Geelong and most recently Collingwood. I would gladly consider their experiences as a model to emulate. But WCE reminds of the fortune of one of their favoured sons. Had it all at their feet, but blew the opportunity. And at their recent zenith in 2005/6, WCE had it all. But they had harboured and fostered a malignant underbelly which dulled their success.

Everything so have said above is true RR.

But I would trade almost anything for a premiership

Hopefully in the next 10 years because after that I will probably be too old to give a stuff.

My god.

Maybe you need to re-read your post?

What on earth is the relevance of Matthews having "given 110%" if it is not in comparison to Bailey?

It's completely superfluous and a meaningless cliche.

Yes, Matthews has a good track record.

That has never been in dispute.

I don't. I've stated multiple times, in replies to you within this thread that I support the use of a mentor.

Please, in future, attention to detail.

Artie, fair dinkum mate, you have been going on and on and on about the Matthews giving 110% comment.

Why are you being so darned pedantic about it. Its just an effing expression that a lot of people use to describe someone whose extra intensive. We all know its an effing impossibility....so just get over it and drop it ffs.

My god.

Maybe you need to re-read your post?

What on earth is the relevance of Matthews having "given 110%" if it is not in comparison to Bailey?

It's completely superfluous and a meaningless cliche.

Yes, Matthews has a good track record.

That has never been in dispute.

I don't. I've stated multiple times, in replies to you within this thread that I support the use of a mentor.

Please, in future, attention to detail.

I use the figure 110% to stress that Matthews has always strived and demanded that level out of himself and the teams he has been involved in.

Bailey may also strive for this but at this stage we cannot make a judgement.

Artie, fair dinkum mate, you have been going on and on and on about the Matthews giving 110% comment.

Why are you being so darned pedantic about it. Its just an effing expression that a lot of people use to describe someone whose extra intensive. We all know its an effing impossibility....so just get over it and drop it ffs.

Thanks DC i agree, it was just a figure of speech.

Some people just enjoy being extremely literal around here.

With only words and no eye contact it can go on way too long!!!!

it's an interesting topic and i'd be happy to discuss. culture seems like a load of crap.....it should be a load of crap.....but it's not. there are too many consistent theme's for almost every football club over the years when players and coaches have come and gone. lets take a club like Essendon; yes they were no good last year with an average list, but with that same average list they have put together 7 pretty impressive performances in a row. when is the last time, even with a mature list, that you have seen us put together a start to a year like this? For Melbourne it plays out like this.....great first up performance, very good second, very good third, get happy with ourselves and lose to a team near the bottom of the ladder. then start the usual talk about rebounding and bouncing back. why is it so?......

This is the kind of answer I was looking for this whole thread. How do we fix something if we don't understand it?

they won a flag and got within a kick of another, and they are already on the way back. They have one of the best records of any club pound for pound and are richer than God

i'll take their culture thanks

lol...

what is our culture again?

not being able to turn good players into great ones?

soft?

not winnin a flag in ages?

inconsistency?

not being able to attract the best? Matthews, Judd, Roos etc?

someone please tell me?

I think the point is that a new culture needs to be created with this playing group, one that draws on the positives of our history and corrects many of the mistakes of the past.

The club itself recognises it as well as anyone, it has been acknowledged from the top. Whilst Brereton and Dunstall are right in much of what they say the wheels have already been turning for some time.

Whilst I really believe that the club is in a new dawn, it is still just that....dawn. Still I welcome the spotlight and the criticism, the club needs to constantly check itself in the mirror to ensure that it isn't being insular and reamains accountable.

The new culture needs to be lead by the new playing group, those leaders are just not quite ready yet. We need to be confident that some of the names of Jones (yes Jones), Trengove, Scully, Tapscott etc will be held in the same reverence that the names of Voss, Black, Brown, Hird, Judd, Ablett, Bartel, Dunstall Ayres, Brereton, Kirk etc are held.

This is my expectation, when those players are leaders of the club, I expect success.

Interesting that many suppose the culture will germinate from the players. At the most successful clubs the culture has been shaped and determined by those that define the direction the club wil ltake and the nature of it getting there.

Players are moulded..they arent the moulds !!

Interesting that many suppose the culture will germinate from the players. At the most successful clubs the culture has been shaped and determined by those that define the direction the club wil ltake and the nature of it getting there.

Players are moulded..they arent the moulds !!

To win flags I reckon you need a number of factors to be going well, good tactitians, development, skills, depth etc.

The bolded bit is the bit we are relying on isn't it? IE that the current crop of players will be the new mould and bring about the new era.