List improvements

[jayceebee31 759]

In watching the games so far this year- we have seen the game plan take significant change as per the pre training drills - that from all parts of the ground we move the ball in waves. In most games, we seem to have no one on the forward line and this to me is worrying. If we had a very good tall,such as a Jack Watts there,he would mostly out run other defenders of their feet-re Franklin like..Ditto Aussie etc..

However, we have, what we have currently and we are doing a grand job under our current circumstances. However, I feel 3 major factors, the football department need to look at heavily, We seem to need as a priority a tall experienced forward(a 193 +), a tall backman(193+) and if we feel,PJ,Spencer & Meeson will not cut it, then another ruckman to back up, Jamar and Gawn.It ws very interesting to hear Luke Darcy on ONE ,Monday night discuss ruckman- and he thought Miller maybe worth considering. I agree after watching 192 cm- Lynden Dunn.

Dunn has also showed me - how important he has become as a utility...Back, forward, run with player and now part time ruckman,very universal... I'd like your thoughts, as we move forward and plan for the next few years..Surely we do not need more centreline players ..taking into account we get Jack Viney in 2012.

Edited April 21, 2010 by jayceebee31

[e25 5]

It shows how any tall can look fairly decent when you have a good midfield.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Firstly, the game plan has not changed. The players are now more adept at doing what Bailey has been seeking them to do for the past 2 and a bit years. We have recruited skilled players that can use the ball competently by hand and foot even under pressure.

Secondly, I am not sure why we need another tall backman when we have Warnock, Garland, Frawley. I just cant see a settled back six to handle match ups week in week out with another tall.

Thirdly, our recruting of Watts, Jurrah, GAWN and Spenser reflects the Clubs understanding of the need to cover those positions but they recognise they take time to come on.

Finally, we have been lucky not to have been exposed by oppositions when playing Newton and Dunn in the ruck. Dunn has yet to convince me that he is a long term AFL player and he certainly is not a ruckman. And Darcy got one wrong if thinks Miller will take the centre bounces. He like Newton offers little up forward so its not worth sacrificing a running player for a questionable pinch hitter in the ruck.

The biggest improver in this side this year without a doubt is Mark Jamar who has profoundly impactly the last 3 games single handedly. I trust him good health and fitness. By god we need him.

[Bates Mate 4,468]

In watching the games so far this year- we have seen the game plan take significant change as per the pre training drills - that from all parts of the ground we move the ball in waves. In most games, we seem to have no one on the forward line and this to me is worrying. If we had a very good tall,such as a Jack Watts there,he would mostly out run other defenders of their feet-re Franklin like..Ditto Aussie etc..

However, we have, what we have currently and we are doing a grand job under our current circumstances. However, I feel 3 major factors, the football department need to look at heavily, We seem to need as a priority a tall experienced forward(a 193 +), a tall backman(193+) and if we feel,PJ,Spencer & Meeson will not cut it, then another ruckman to back up, Jamar and Gawn.It ws very interesting to hear Luke Darcy on ONE ,Monday night discuss ruckman- and he thought Miller maybe worth considering. I agree after watching 192 cm- Lynden Dunn.

Dunn has also showed me - how important he has become as a utility...Back, forward, run with player and now part time ruckman,very universal... I'd like your thoughts, as we move forward and plan for the next few years..Surely we do not need more centreline players ..taking into account we get Jack Viney in 2012.

Our list aint changing til the draft at the end of the year it's round 4 , relax

[jayceebee31 759]

Firstly, the game plan has not changed. The players are now more adept at doing what Bailey has been seeking them to do for the past 2 and a bit years. We have recruited skilled players that can use the ball competently by hand and foot even under pressure.

Secondly, I am not sure why we need another tall backman when we have Warnock, Garland, Frawley. I just cant see a settled back six to handle match ups week in week out with another tall.

Thirdly, our recruting of Watts, Jurrah, GAWN and Spenser reflects the Clubs understanding of the need to cover those positions but they recognise they take time to come on.

Finally, we have been lucky not to have been exposed by oppositions when playing Newton and Dunn in the ruck. Dunn has yet to convince me that he is a long term AFL player and he certainly is not a ruckman. And Darcy got one wrong if thinks Miller will take the centre bounces. He like Newton offers little up forward so its not worth sacrificing a running player for a questionable pinch hitter in the ruck.

The biggest improver in this side this year without a doubt is Mark Jamar who has profoundly impactly the last 3 games single handedly. I trust him good health and fitness. By god we need him.

I disagree with many every points you have raised. Every game this year -there has been no one in our forward line on several occassions in a game. We had Robbo always there(when he played)or a taller forward.Secondly, look at the list- we need, IMO- another tall athletic backman to cover the possible injuries to our talls. Warnock at 192- Rivers at 192- Garland at 191 are versatile defenders but I would like a 193+ athletic type to take over, say CHB-Although we may have one in Morton.(I hear he is still growing , but is still only 192 cms tall.A young developing-David Astbury type would be ideal.I accept your points re Miller & Newton but pose this question to you---we have to take a minumum of 3 picks- say four. We definately need another tall forward-you have not disagreed with that point.

What type of player do you think we should take to strengthen our list-R.R??? PLEASE ADVISE.I await with interest.

Edited April 21, 2010 by jayceebee31

[Deeoldfart 8,005]

Firstly, the game plan has not changed. The players are now more adept at doing what Bailey has been seeking them to do for the past 2 and a bit years. We have recruited skilled players that can use the ball competently by hand and foot even under pressure.

Secondly, I am not sure why we need another tall backman when we have Warnock, Garland, Frawley. I just cant see a settled back six to handle match ups week in week out with another tall.

Thirdly, our recruting of Watts, Jurrah, GAWN and Spenser reflects the Clubs understanding of the need to cover those positions but they recognise they take time to come on.

Finally, we have been lucky not to have been exposed by oppositions when playing Newton and Dunn in the ruck. Dunn has yet to convince me that he is a long term AFL player and he certainly is not a ruckman. And Darcy got one wrong if thinks Miller will take the centre bounces. He like Newton offers little up forward so its not worth sacrificing a running player for a questionable pinch hitter in the ruck.

The biggest improver in this side this year without a doubt is Mark Jamar who has profoundly impactly the last 3 games single handedly. I trust him good health and fitness. By god we need him.

Agree with all that Rhino. Re your third point, we need to add Fitzpatrick to the list of talls who might potentially play forward or in the ruck.

[jayceebee31 759]

Agree with all that Rhino. Re your third point, we need to add Fitzpatrick to the list of talls who might potentially play forward or in the ruck.

Well tell me what type of players you would like to add to our list..knowing we have to pick at least 3 or four..Whom should our recruiters be lookinbg at..Surely this is part of our strategy.. We have enough midfielders/ small forwards/ small defenders...so tell me please...whom??

[Deeoldfart 8,005]

I disagree with many every points you have raised. Every game this year -there has been no one in our forward line on several occassions in a game. We had Robbo always there(when he played)or a taller forward.Secondly, look at the list- we need, IMO- another tall athletic backman to cover the possible injuries to our talls. Warnock at 192- Rivers at 192- Garland at 191 are versatile defenders but I would like a 193+ athletic type to take over, say CHB-Although we may have one in Morton.(I hear he is still growing , but is still only 192 cms tall.A young developing-David Astbury type would be ideal.I accept your points re Miller & Newton but pose this question to you---we have to take a minumum of 3 picks- say four. We definately need another tall forward-you have not disagreed with that point.

What type of player do you think we should take to strengthen our list-R.R??? PLEASE ADVISE.I await with interest.

I don't want to steal RR's thunder on this, he will undoubtedly have his own views ........ but IMO we currently have most if not all bases reasonably covered with 'known quality' players or 'good potential' players. Obviously its too early for us to be making judgements about how well a lot of the 'potential' will turn out, but we should have a much better idea in a few months. Based on what we know right now, my view would be to stick with the old adage of 'best available' ...... but if I was forced into a corner, I would say a quality utility (eg. Goodes) would be fantastic, but who's to say Cale Morton won't end up filling that type of role with distinction?

[Dinosaur Rover 197]

Firstly, the game plan has not changed. The players are now more adept at doing what Bailey has been seeking them to do for the past 2 and a bit years. We have recruited skilled players that can use the ball competently by hand and foot even under pressure.

Secondly, I am not sure why we need another tall backman when we have Warnock, Garland, Frawley. I just cant see a settled back six to handle match ups week in week out with another tall.

Thirdly, our recruting of Watts, Jurrah, GAWN and Spenser reflects the Clubs understanding of the need to cover those positions but they recognise they take time to come on.

Finally, we have been lucky not to have been exposed by oppositions when playing Newton and Dunn in the ruck. Dunn has yet to convince me that he is a long term AFL player and he certainly is not a ruckman. And Darcy got one wrong if thinks Miller will take the centre bounces. He like Newton offers little up forward so its not worth sacrificing a running player for a questionable pinch hitter in the ruck.

The biggest improver in this side this year without a doubt is Mark Jamar who has profoundly impactly the last 3 games single handedly. I trust him good health and fitness. By god we need him.

I agree with all of this. 192 cm is a running player certainly not a ruck I even have doubts that in the long term 198 cm is a ruckman - Watts is 196 for example Tippett at 198ish. Dunne has got a good pair of hands but his clanger count is a worry. Of our fowards Bruce and Petterd look like they can take set shots and score consistently.

WB have shown that you can (with a strong midfield) build a credible forward line without a power forward but for a premiership they figured they needed big bad barry. A lot of teams have a power forward combination. I agree on the tall defenders but throw in Jack Fitzpatrick in the mix 199 who plays back or forward apparently.

As a forward you live or die by the delivery you get whatever size you are - particularly in a world of double teaming defenders, compressed zones (what is that anyway!) - our delivery to the forward line has not been good but shows promise.

[Stigga 25]

We seem to need as a priority a tall experienced backman(193+)

Why?

Geelong:

Drum: 191cm

Enright: 187cm

Hunt: 185cm

Mackie: 192cm

Milburn: 189cm

Scarlett: 192cm

Taylor: 193cm

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

I disagree with many every points you have raised. Every game this year -there has been no one in our forward line on several occassions in a game. We had Robbo always there(when he played)or a taller forward.Secondly, look at the list- we need, IMO- another tall athletic backman to cover the possible injuries to our talls. Warnock at 192- Rivers at 192- Garland at 191 are versatile defenders but I would like a 193+ athletic type to take over, say CHB-Although we may have one in Morton.(I hear he is still growing , but is still only 192 cms tall.A young developing-David Astbury type would be ideal.I accept your points re Miller & Newton but pose this question to you---we have to take a minumum of 3 picks- say four. We definately need another tall forward-you have not disagreed with that point.

What type of player do you think we should take to strengthen our list-R.R??? PLEASE ADVISE.I await with interest.

No doubt you would. The only reason we had Robbo up forward all the time is that he did not chase and was not mobile.

Re backs: We have Warnock, Frawley, Garland, McDonald. We have Rivers, Martin and McNamara in the wings. How much depth in defenders can you carry in a list of 40. You need to get over your fixation with height and really look at what we do have. And I worry when posters recommend we recruit for depth. Shudder.

Up forward, we will have Watts and Jurrah returning from injury. We have marking forwards in Sylvia and Bate with possibility of Green and Morton pushing forward. We have recruited Spencer, Fitzpatrick and GAWN to develop and if they do you have a contested mark big called Jamar who can go down there.

As always in the draft with our first 2 to 3 picks I suggest we take the best available. Our midfield is developing but is not established. We need to focus on quality We will probably have Junior retire, Bell to be delisted and Maric (if out of contract) is looking problematic for the future. So there is 3 potential players in the midfield.

[H_T 3,043]

Firstly, the game plan has not changed. The players are now more adept at doing what Bailey has been seeking them to do for the past 2 and a bit years. We have recruited skilled players that can use the ball competently by hand and foot even under pressure.

There hasn't been much focus on the game plan of late. It's amazing what can happen when there is intent on winning the ball and intent on working hard and in numbers - defensively (hence: tackling (ranked=No.1)).

Oh wait - what game plan ??!!

Secondly, I am not sure why we need another tall backman when we have Warnock, Garland, Frawley. I just cant see a settled back six to handle match ups week in week out with another tall.

Thirdly, our recruting of Watts, Jurrah, GAWN and Spenser reflects the Clubs understanding of the need to cover those positions but they recognise they take time to come on.

Finally, we have been lucky not to have been exposed by oppositions when playing Newton and Dunn in the ruck. Dunn has yet to convince me that he is a long term AFL player and he certainly is not a ruckman. And Darcy got one wrong if thinks Miller will take the centre bounces. He like Newton offers little up forward so its not worth sacrificing a running player for a questionable pinch hitter in the ruck.

The biggest improver in this side this year without a doubt is Mark Jamar who has profoundly impactly the last 3 games single handedly. I trust him good health and fitness. By god we need him.

Agreed.

I don't want to steal RR's thunder on this, he will undoubtedly have his own views ........ but IMO we currently have most if not all bases reasonably covered with 'known quality' players or 'good potential' players. Obviously its too early for us to be making judgements about how well a lot of the 'potential' will turn out, but we should have a much better idea in a few months. Based on what we know right now, my view would be to stick with the old adage of 'best available' ...... but if I was forced into a corner, I would say a quality utility (eg. Goodes) would be fantastic, but who's to say Cale Morton won't end up filling that type of role with distinction?

Not sure what the FD intends to do with PJ, or what PJ intends to do with his footy for that matter, however there is an understudy at West Coast under the Cox/Naitanui combo in Will Sullivan who is off the rookie list onto the main list now and in his second year. Not sure of his contract status, but has impressed in WA at WAFL level from what I gather. Might be worth looking at considering it might be hard to get a gig in the West Coast team unless there is an injury to either Naitanui/Cox.

[e25 5]

Rhino, I agree with you on Robbo.

JCB did it ever occur to you that there is no one in the forward line by design..?

We've kicked quite a few goals in the past few weeks by virtue of having such an open forward-line and we've managed to draw away opposition help defenders to make it easier for our short guys in one-on-ones.

And Maric is contracted until the end of 2011 - found this yesterday on the MFC website when trawling for details on the length of Morton's contract which expires at the same time.

[2014-Flag 0]

Firstly, the game plan has not changed. The players are now more adept at doing what Bailey has been seeking them to do for the past 2 and a bit years. We have recruited skilled players that can use the ball competently by hand and foot even under pressure.

Secondly, I am not sure why we need another tall backman when we have Warnock, Garland, Frawley. I just cant see a settled back six to handle match ups week in week out with another tall.

Thirdly, our recruting of Watts, Jurrah, GAWN and Spenser reflects the Clubs understanding of the need to cover those positions but they recognise they take time to come on.

Finally, we have been lucky not to have been exposed by oppositions when playing Newton and Dunn in the ruck. Dunn has yet to convince me that he is a long term AFL player and he certainly is not a ruckman. And Darcy got one wrong if thinks Miller will take the centre bounces. He like Newton offers little up forward so its not worth sacrificing a running player for a questionable pinch hitter in the ruck.

The biggest improver in this side this year without a doubt is Mark Jamar who has profoundly impactly the last 3 games single handedly. I trust him good health and fitness. By god we need him.

And another tall back in Rivers.For me, i'd put Garland up forward to provide a target, and put Rivers down back

[Inner Demon 1]

So 192cm is too short but 193cm is fine???????

Do you realise how big a centimetre is??? Grab a ruler, if you think being 1cm taller is actually giving a player a realistic advantage of some kind throughout the course of a game like Aussie Rules, you're delusional.

Darren Glass 192cm

Dale Morris 190cm

Sam Fisher 192cm

Craig Bolton 190cm

I could go on.

But for what it's worth. James Frawley hits your magical threshold of 193cm which qualifies him to be the 'tall defender' we desperately need to support all these 192cm midgets we have running around.

Michael Newton is also 193cm. What a star that's made him...

[Deeoldfart 8,005]

Well tell me what type of players you would like to add to our list..knowing we have to pick at least 3 or four..Whom should our recruiters be lookinbg at..Surely this is part of our strategy.. We have enough midfielders/ small forwards/ small defenders...so tell me please...whom??

I feel certain that we would not be picking three or four players to cover perceived weaknesses in our list (which is what you are asking me to do). IMO the first couple of picks (at least) should go to the 'best available' players. If two potential draftees are rated equally, and one of them happens to be a rangey midfield / KPP type in the mould of Adam Goodes or Cale Morton, then that's the way I would go. You cant have too many quality players of this ilk IMO ...... but I acknowledge that they are hard to come by.

[jayceebee31 759]

I feel certain that we would not be picking three or four players to cover perceived weaknesses in our list (which is what you are asking me to do). IMO the first couple of picks (at least) should go to the 'best available' players. If two potential draftees are rated equally, and one of them happens to be a rangey midfield / KPP type in the mould of Adam Goodes or Cale Morton, then that's the way I would go. You cant have too many quality players of this ilk IMO ...... but I acknowledge that they are hard to come by.

It is AFL law that every club has to change their list by at least 3 players...like DEEOLDFART, therefore,what types would you say we should go for.I think we will be going for players to overcome our perceived weaknesses,NOT LIKE HIM..

Edited April 21, 2010 by jayceebee31

[e25 5]

See sig

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

I feel certain that we would not be picking three or four players to cover perceived weaknesses in our list (which is what you are asking me to do). IMO the first couple of picks (at least) should go to the 'best available' players.

I thought your answer was clear, simple and straightforward ....apparently not for some.

[Keyser Söze 0]

It is AFL law that every club has to change their list by at least 3 players...like DEEOLDFART, therefore,what types would you say we should go for.I think we will be going for players to overcome our perceived weaknesses,NOT LIKE HIM..

What are you on about this time?

[Inner Demon 1]

Two of our changes will be likely be promoting McKenzie & Spencer. Just as a start.

[Keyser Söze 0]

See sig

I was thinking it was about time you changed that, but it seems it's still relevant...

[Deeoldfart 8,005]

Two of our changes will be likely be promoting McKenzie & Spencer. Just as a start.

Of course! Can't see that not happening.

[jayceebee31 759]

I thought your answer was clear, simple and straightforward ....apparently not for some.

Maybe for rhino's but not me

[Guest hangon007]

Maybe for rhino's but not me

Our strategy should be fairly obvious - in 2010/2011 expect we will some what "exit the draft" and concentrate 80-90% of our energies on the trade table.

Edited April 22, 2010 by hangon007