Anyone for cricket?

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Marsh not had a shot? He's 30, played 7 tests. Has a shield average of only 35 and only 31 this year. Plenty of off field troubles as well. Marsh is selected because they want him to succeed not because he's earned it or shown any signs that he will. I really hope they play Doolan or Faulkner ahead of Marsh.

The one positive of this squad at least is that by including 2 back up number 3's and a buck up all rounder the writing is well and truly on the wall for Watson.

The Chris Rogers dream wont last for ever either I guess so within 12 months we could need an opener (?Marsh), number 3 (Doolan/Hughes) and have Faulkner in at 6.

The other surprise is that they aren't taking Wade on this tour. They seem keen to avoid the question of who the next keeper is even though I think Wade has done enough to still have that spot.

Marsh has definitely had plenty of chances and should count himself fortunate to get the tour. He is there for the No 3 spot.

Faulkner is definitely an ODI star but I don't think his bowling is strong enough for a Test level to be a genuine Test all rounder. And Faulkner is not necessarily competing with Marsh for No3 spot

I am not sure why you are so dismissive of Chris Rogers. All batsman regardless of age survive by making runs. There is no reason why if he continues to do so that he defends the Ashes in England in 2015. His gritty experience will be invaluable.

And I don't think there is any surprise that Wade has missed out. After a poor India tour, his domestic season was lacklustre with some controversy. I don't think he is the heir apparent to outstanding wicketkeeper in the country Brad Haddin.

[titan_uranus 25,018]

Clearly the selectors haven't gone with Shield form. The three leading run scorers in the Shield so far are Marcus North, Cameron White and Phil Hughes. In terms of averages, there are 15 batsmen averaging 50 or more, none of which are Marsh or Doolan.

I would have thought Chris Rogers is a great example of why age should not be a determinative factor in selecting batsmen, in a sport where you can still bat at Test level well into your 30s. North is 34, but Rogers was 35 when he was brought back. White is only 30. Age shouldn't be keeping our form batsmen out of the side. Nor should previously being dropped (clearly didn't stop them picking Marsh, so shouldn't have stopped them picking North/White/Hughes/Khawaja).

I suspect Marsh has been picked because they feel he'll run into form in the ODI series (he played a great innings on Sunday, to be fair to him), but as I said, Bailey is a great example of how ODI form can mean nothing in Test cricket. Doolan is in because he's been thereabouts for a while, not necessarily because he's in super form right now. I don't agree with either selection, I'd have taken Hughes and one of North and White (both of whom can bowl useful spin to lessen the load on our bowlers and prevent us having to stuff our batting line-up up by using Faulkner at 7 and Haddin at 6).

how things turned out? we won the ashes 5 Nil... thats how they turned out.

Bailey was obviously in the team from the start of our Ashes campaign, for More then just his batting. competitiveness, maturity, & leadership??? I'd say that job is done now, as the team is well on the way to resurrection.

so now is the right time to slowly bring in the next generation group.

What are you on about? Bailey was clearly substandard, I'm not sure how you want to go about denying that. My point was that we picked a player based primarily off ODI form and he ended up struggling at Test level, which isn't that surprising given he's not a dominant First Class player.

[Rogue 585]

told to earn his place back in shield cricket and pay his penance

so ,4 day form has been ok and proven,unlike bailey who was all odi form

His FC form hasn't been good.

[45HG 1,539]

After four days of pretty poor cricket, the Sri Lanka v Pakistan match had a cracking finale.

On Marsh - his last series for Australia yielded 17 runs at 2.83. I recall jibes directed his way saying he should have been fined $24,000 after the MCG test for being on the ground 4 times when he shouldn't have been.

Having said that, his away average is 56.80 (due to one good knock) ...

[titan_uranus 25,018]

After four days of pretty poor cricket, the Sri Lanka v Pakistan match had a cracking finale.

On Marsh - his last series for Australia yielded 17 runs at 2.83. I recall jibes directed his way saying he should have been fined $24,000 after the MCG test for being on the ground 4 times when he shouldn't have been.

Having said that, his away average is 56.80 (due to one good knock) ...

Two good knocks - I rate his 44 against South Africa in the 47-all-out Test. But your point stands - his form in that Indian series was incredibly awful.

That Pakistan match was incredible! Pakistan chased 302 in two sessions! Great win for them (and another victory for positive, aggressive cricket, in the face of Sri Lanka's negative defensive batting (scoring at something like 1.5 runs per over in the morning) and bowling (Herath bowling over the wicket outside leg stump).

[dee-luded 2,959]

Clearly the selectors haven't gone with Shield form. The three leading run scorers in the Shield so far are Marcus North, Cameron White and Phil Hughes. In terms of averages, there are 15 batsmen averaging 50 or more, none of which are Marsh or Doolan.

I would have thought Chris Rogers is a great example of why age should not be a determinative factor in selecting batsmen, in a sport where you can still bat at Test level well into your 30s. North is 34, but Rogers was 35 when he was brought back. White is only 30. Age shouldn't be keeping our form batsmen out of the side. Nor should previously being dropped (clearly didn't stop them picking Marsh, so shouldn't have stopped them picking North/White/Hughes/Khawaja).

I suspect Marsh has been picked because they feel he'll run into form in the ODI series (he played a great innings on Sunday, to be fair to him), but as I said, Bailey is a great example of how ODI form can mean nothing in Test cricket. Doolan is in because he's been thereabouts for a while, not necessarily because he's in super form right now. I don't agree with either selection, I'd have taken Hughes and one of North and White (both of whom can bowl useful spin to lessen the load on our bowlers and prevent us having to stuff our batting line-up up by using Faulkner at 7 and Haddin at 6).

What are you on about? Bailey was clearly substandard, I'm not sure how you want to go about denying that. My point was that we picked a player based primarily off ODI form and he ended up struggling at Test level, which isn't that surprising given he's not a dominant First Class player.

I suspect Bailey did his job, as the selectors didn't drop him thru the ashes campaign... so he must have been bringing something to the team.

Now we embark on another different campaign against a harder opponent, now with the combative elements back alive and well in the team, they've decided to drop him from the squad for others, but they said he is very much in their minds.

different opponent, & different circumstances since our squad arrived home from England; & we are Now, a different team in belief, confidence & form.

the time is right to slowly make adjustments to the squad as we go along.

[titan_uranus 25,018]

I suspect Bailey did his job, as the selectors didn't drop him thru the ashes campaign... so he must have been bringing something to the team.

Now we embark on another different campaign against a harder opponent, now with the combative elements back alive and well in the team, they've decided to drop him from the squad for others, but they said he is very much in their minds.

different opponent, & different circumstances since our squad arrived home from England; & we are Now, a different team in belief, confidence & form.

the time is right to slowly make adjustments to the squad as we go along.

No, the selectors didn't drop him because they didn't need to. We were winning without him making runs. Compare him with Rob Quiney last year. Quiney was outstanding in the field, even provided a bowling option (which Bailey doesn't), but after we'd failed to win in both Brisbane and Adelaide, he was dropped for Perth as we tried to get a win. If we'd been losing in the Ashes, Bailey most likely wouldn't have played five Tests. Conversely, maybe if we'd won those two Tests against South Africa Quiney might have gotten a third short at it.

By 'different opponent', what we are really saying is 'actual Test-quality bowling'. Bailey wasn't making runs against England's second-rate bowlers. He clearly stands less chance of making runs against South Africa's.

[dee-luded 2,959]

No, the selectors didn't drop him because they didn't need to. We were winning without him making runs. Compare him with Rob Quiney last year. Quiney was outstanding in the field, even provided a bowling option (which Bailey doesn't), but after we'd failed to win in both Brisbane and Adelaide, he was dropped for Perth as we tried to get a win. If we'd been losing in the Ashes, Bailey most likely wouldn't have played five Tests. Conversely, maybe if we'd won those two Tests against South Africa Quiney might have gotten a third short at it.

A: Of course. thats the point that Bailey was bringing other stuff to the table which added up to the team playing well & settled, with a strong mental attitude, that didn't wane.

By 'different opponent', what we are really saying is 'actual Test-quality bowling'. Bailey wasn't making runs against England's second-rate bowlers. He clearly stands less chance of making runs against South Africa's.

A: No, a tougher opponent who won't buckle at the knees with a bit of name calling, & a relentless attack on them.

we now have our MOJO back, & that momentum is now entrenched into the remaining squad. it should be carried over by the other leaders, even with newbies coming into the team.

[dee-luded 2,959]

Hi Macca.

good hands absolutely. two of my favourites, DK & Alderman. I used to sit & watch them all day.

Johnston is full of talent but is taking his time maturing into a steady force. but the talent is always there.

I sense & big shift in the psyche of this squad since Boof arrived on the scene in england. even Lyon looked stronger in England under Boof. he looked more confident & seems to have carried that forward, thus far.\

Our weakness is the youth of our bowlers who are injured so often, so I think Johnson is important to allow the young gun bowlers to not be overbowled. I think the kids should have to force him from the team.

It really looks good to me now with this pace lineup of Harris, Siddle & Johnston with Faulkner waiting in the wings & Watson for cameos. if Johnston becomes our pace alrounder, it may take some pressure off Watson who I think has a point to prove. If Smith can hold a mid order batting spot, as well as Johnston all of a sudden we have depth again.

This could take some strain off the whole team, & just maybe the top order can relax & play.

what about the fielding I saw in the News clips, (out all day driving). those catches looked sharp like our old days. this team is ready & hungry. lets hope they're good enough.

There's still more than a few doubts about our batting but the teams overall fighting qualities have been on show in the last day and a half. We've played well in the big moments which is when games are decided.

I know you place a fair bit of emphasis on Lehmann's role and although it's still early doors, if we go one up, the team can gain a lot of confidence moving forward. As well as that, we looked to have some good plans for their batsmen and that's where a good coach comes to the fore. Some terrific signs but there's still a long way to go.

Anyway ... here's Geoffrey Boycott and Jonathan Agnew with a 22 minute podcast from today's play. I'm just about to listen to it myself but I'm betting Geoffrey won't be holding back! ... Test Match Special - England blown away by Johnson

I think our off field coaches have done a Great job working over the Poms... & re-instilling the confidence & fight into the squad.

the Aussie fundamentals should never again be surgically removed, paired back to boring old gentlemen.

I don't think england is all that good, they have a number of stars but there is something missing with them when the real pressure is applied, I feel. maybe they are the team of champions,,, But.

we tended to make hard work of the game in recent years, & we wade them look good over there thru our own ineptitude, as a team.

but we have some real hard competitors, who just need supporting, from all at Aus cricket. the softer ones seem to have fallen in England, & are not in this team.

& the Poms were shown their own mirror, they keep failing to Look deep into.

we have our culture; its one built on an Irish heritage of irreverence, & never say die aggression, that has built this nation into an egalitarian state, & a real comradeship & team ethic, of giving a chop out.

'greedy self', has no place in this.

Edited January 21, 2014 by dee-luded

[Whispering_Jack 30,103]

I think our test aspirations are falling away as a result of the commercial realities of cricket scheduling. The $ dictates when tests, OD games and T20s are played and the rest is left for Sheffield Shield (or whatever it's called these days).

In the halcyon days there was an even spread of shield matches and the visiting test sides would play every state during the course of their tours. Not these days. I can't remember the last state four day game and with our test players often resting in these game, how do we expect our younger generation to develop into international test players? And what sort of form are players being selected on?

[dee-luded 2,959]

I think our test aspirations are falling away as a result of the commercial realities of cricket scheduling. The $ dictates when tests, OD games and T20s are played and the rest is left for Sheffield Shield (or whatever it's called these days).

In the halcyon days there was an even spread of shield matches and the visiting test sides would play every state during the course of their tours. Not these days. I can't remember the last state four day game and with our test players often resting in these game, how do we expect our younger generation to develop into international test players? And what sort of form are players being selected on?

thats a good point jack, as the up 'n' coming youngsters would get to see first hand; the levels required to compete. that experience can't be imitated.

so its not good for the tourists immediate form, to play less leadup games prior to Tests. But also we lose out in the future, as the shield players are less prepared, until they're older.

[jazza 1,323]

dont know who cameron whites dietician is,but its the skinniest ive ever seen him

also on the big bash 22/1/2014 flem and rick talking about glovemen

flem "ludes has to be the best gloveman in the country"

no arguments from ricky

Edited January 23, 2014 by jazza

[Whispering_Jack 30,103]

National day of mourning declared after the Poms beat us in yesterday's ODI in Perth. I was always worried this would happen, especially after Mitch Johnson shaved off the mo. No mo, no mojo.

[dee-luded 2,959]

National day of mourning declared after the Poms beat us in yesterday's ODI in Perth. I was always worried this would happen, especially after Mitch Johnson shaved off the mo. No mo, no mo-jo.

isn't Jo the wife?

Edited January 25, 2014 by dee-luded

[45HG 1,539]

National day of mourning declared after the Poms beat us in yesterday's ODI in Perth. I was always worried this would happen, especially after Mitch Johnson shaved off the mo. No mo, no mojo.

It's a team game, though. I'm disappointed none of his mates picked up the tab and filled the void.

[John Crow Batty 8,863]

Dead meaningless game in a dying version of cricket.

Woeful bowling including 16 wides.

Complete form reversal allows former feckless poms to breeze to over 300.

Aussies overwhelming favourites with the bookies.

Somehow expected this before the start of the game.

Why an I so cynical?

Edited January 25, 2014 by america de cali

[dee-luded 2,959]

why isn't big bash played in Roctober?

could it be the ACB board & other admins', would rather attend the spring carnivaals?

[Macca 16,967]

why isn't big bash played in Roctober?

could it be the ACB board & other admins', would rather attend the spring carnivaals?

Last October they played all the domestic 50 over games in one hit. All the games were held in Sydney and I'm not sure if any of the games were televised. It seemed like an ok idea at the time but I'm not sure it worked in terms of exposure. Previously, the 50 over domestic games were played over a 6 month period. I can see CA keeping the games in October but it needs a lot more promotion. It's needed, otherwise what happens to the Australian ODI side?

The "Big Bash" probably has to be played over the holiday period and I can't see them moving it anyway. It's been very successful in terms of crowds and TV viewers.

[Macca 16,967]

Phil Hughes gets the nod for Test recall

While the recall is a win for Hughes, it is a huge blow for Marsh, whose own stalled Test career had been unexpectedly given fresh life despite not being in the top 30 runs-scorers in the Sheffield Shield this season.

Cricket Australia announced that Bird would be flying out on Friday with another late addition to the squad, Moises Henriques, who was brought in as a replacement for injured all-rounder James Faulkner (knee).

[dee-luded 2,959]

Phil Hughes gets the nod for Test recall

While the recall is a win for Hughes, it is a huge blow for Marsh, whose own stalled Test career had been unexpectedly given fresh life despite not being in the top 30 runs-scorers in the Sheffield Shield this season.

Do thew Africaans have any decent spinners, & do their tracks turn? hughes would be better against pace imo.

Cricket Australia announced that Bird would be flying out on Friday with another late addition to the squad, Moises Henriques, who was brought in as a replacement for injured all-rounder James Faulkner (knee).

thats good.

[jazza 1,323]

Phil Hughes gets the nod for Test recall

Do thew Africaans have any decent spinners, & do their tracks turn? hughes would be better against pace imo.

thats good.

no they dont have a spinner,the one they have isnt worth [peterson] 2 bobs worth of nanny goat chit

so hughes is safe from the spinner

now if he can get over the fact that the pill moves off the seam,he may be right

[Macca 16,967]

Do thew Africaans have any decent spinners, & do their tracks turn? hughes would be better against pace imo.

Their tracks are a lot like our wickets. Good bounce generally which should suit Lyon. Philander gets good seam movement on his home tracks so he could be a real handful (apart from Steyn's swing and pace and Morkel's pace and bounce)

3 tests in 22 days will test a few of our fellows out. Same for the South Africans of course. If any of their 3 fast bowlers breaks down it will open the door for our batsmen. They will miss Kallis' bowling a lot unless either of their all rounders (Wayne Parnell or Ryan McLaren) steps up to the plate. They might have to expose their spinner more than they'd like and what's the bet the Aussies will go after Robin Peterson regardless?

[dee-luded 2,959]

no they dont have a spinner,the one they have isnt worth [peterson] 2 bobs worth of nanny goat chit

so hughes is safe from the spinner

now if he can get over the fact that the pill moves off the seam,he may be right

this will be make or break for hughes I feel.

[dee-luded 2,959]

Their tracks are a lot like our wickets. Good bounce generally which should suit Lyon. Philander gets good seam movement on his home tracks so he could be a real handful (apart from Steyn's swing and pace and Morkel's pace and bounce)

3 tests in 22 days will test a few of our fellows out. Same for the South Africans of course. If any of their 3 fast bowlers breaks down it will open the door for our batsmen. They will miss Kallis' bowling a lot unless either of their all rounders (Wayne Parnell or Ryan McLaren) steps up to the plate. They might have to expose their spinner more than they'd like and what's the bet the Aussies will go after Robin Peterson regardless?

I would have liked to0 see Harris get his knee cleaned out the day after the Melbourne test. or at the latest the day after Sydney. He's proved invaluable & the experience, hardness & maturity of our pace attack was IMO a major key factor.

The discipline they showed working as a team, & even to the point of bowling, & changing when batsmen got out, to have our preferred match-ups of bowler against the batsmen we planned for, worked a treat.

Africaans will be a tougher mettle.

3 tests in 22 days; selection will be critical, maybe rotations. can we afford to play 4 quicks? I guess that was the Faulkner plan?

[Rogue 585]

why isn't big bash played in Roctober?

could it be the ACB board & other admins', would rather attend the spring carnivaals?

Nothing to do with that, but moreso that TV and crowd numbers are going to be better over the current period, where you've got the Xmas/NY break, school holidays, better weather, etc.