The heart beats true

Really? Why?

Sad but very, very true.

This brings me to an idea. More commenters on here should post their thoughts on the losing margin before the game. I reckon I would have picked at least a 9 goal loss today, as I couldn't see us kicking more than 10 for the game with that midfield and forward line. It's really irritating when people come on here and kick the coach, FD and players while completely ignoring the lack of experience and skill in the team that took to the field. If your going to be Mondays expert have the balls to have a dip on Friday.

Gysberts for Jetta. Hoping Stauss starts on the ground and has a job to do so we can see where he's at. That'll be it I reckon. No way in hell Petterd comes in now. I doubt there's any point in Watts coming back in a hurry. They'll be very conservative with him.

If we have 11 spots to fill after the supposed list cull that is coming we can't expect to get more than 3 experienced, quality players. That leaves us with 8 kids coming in. Those 8 kids aren't going to hit the ground running. We'd be lucky if 2 do. That leaves us with a really junior list and what would apper to be a very inadequate senior team. I can't see 2013 being great for Neeld and I think it needs to be for his future as an AFL coach. I'm genuinely expecting us to pay bank over the off season for players that most won't rate. I think a lot of careers are riding on us spending big. Fascinating times ahead.

Yep, we should definitely be modeling ourselves on a coach and his underperforming team destined to miss the 8 for another season. FFS, maybe we should look at the top sides and model ourselves on them. You know, the ones that are hard at the ball and run all day and have great skills? Just a theory.

Excellent work as always KC. Good to see Gysberts doing well. Will be fascinating to see if Morton gets a recall too.

Not even in the worst 5 performances of the season. At the first bounce I looked out across Docklands and genuinely thought 'this is the worst MFC side i've witnessed in 25 years'. You really can't complain when you go in with that mentality. Jones tries hard. Howe will be a player as will Tom Mac. Greeny showed why he's hung around for 250. There's always next week!

And.... Cue the doomsayers threads about Neeld and 3/4's of the list.

I'd guess the following will stay: Bail Bartram Jetta Morton Spencer I think Morton has a year on his contract doesn't he? Bartam works hard and I think the cub is erring on the side of hard work over 'potential'. Spencer is playing with aggression and I'd think next year he'll need to come on but I would think they'd give him another season. Jetta's injuries will give him more time too I think. Let's be clear. I'm not advocating for any of these guys but I also think we have to be realistic about how deep we want to go in the draft and with trading. If we lose more than 7-8 I'd say we make it harder in the short term when injuries hit.

Amen. I think Neeld knows it. I also think having Couch and Magner remind the first round draft picks that you have to take your chances. Thats a HUGE insult to a bloke that has traveled all over the country working hard on improving when everyone wrote him off. If half our list over the past 5 years had the work ethnic and desire of Couch and Magner I can guarantee we wouldn't be 16th.

I would have thought that this kind of thing goes without saying. Am I also fortunate to have running water and live in democracy? Thanks for the insight.

I think I read on here that Jamar and Rivers can go onto the vet list next year and come out of the salary cap. This will push Brad out. Would free up some cash for us to go really hard after a free agent. Think Brad's been a really good servant of the club but I just don't see the point in holding onto him after this year. It looks like his body has given up on him. Doesn't help him that the boys at Casey refer to him as "Fossil' either.

Or there simply are no words for players that get paid 250k a year to kick a ball that can't hit a target 20 metres away. I know I've stopped yelling at them because it's not making them better. Maybe Neeld saves it for during the week.

Well thought out post Bergly Sanders. I already know I'm in for a bashing here but I do find it fascinating that the basic construct of the argument boils down to who is better Neeld vs Bailey. Is it naive to assume based on what we've seen that Bailey wasn't much good and Neeld's done nothing to encourage the thought that he's a good coach either? Don't get me wrong I genuinely want him to succeed and I 100% agree he's had no luck with injuries and things outside his control. But just as the original argument is that the club lacked ambition and genuine drive can the same argument be made for a supporter base that accepts the lack of competitiveness we've shown in 80% of our games this year? I guess the crux of my argument is that I'm not sold until its proven I should buy in and I've seen nothing to make me believe yet.

I've actually fallen in love with the word 'mediocraty'. It sounds exactly like what you get when everyone gets a vote in a democratic sense regardless of knowledge base. There's a great deal of 'mediocratic' thinking around here at the moment. ;-)

Agree on the midfield and the sentiment of not blaming the coach solely. Unfortunately we've already had our super draft and one of our picks has struggled with pace while the other moved to surfers pardise. I suspect the frustration aimed at Neeld is actually misguided frustration at the clubs ability to uncover and develop genuine talent.

Carrot Top you better hope those 'best availables' aren't scrawny outside mids or I'm going to lose it.

Calm down and actually read what I said. Where did I say that? I actually said it was a solid plan. We just have no midfield to execute it. Some people on here want to rush to attack or defend a game plan that I don't think we've really seen executed. So all we can take from that is that we can't evaluate the coach yet (which is fortunate for him as we've looked terrible). I don't get beating him up but I also hate the blind faith. You get faith when you show something to deserve it.

The idea was right for Collingwood in 2010. It is a solid plan but it's clearly not built on anything we have. That's why the draft and trading period is a great indicator of the goal. If we go after bigger bodies the club and coach are aware of the need for short term accountability. If they don't get what they want or go young then I fear for Neeld in the current climate.

I could be wrong but it looks like the game plan is built on contested ball and percentage play (boundary) that gets us a stoppage and keeps the ball in dispute if not in our favor. Great plan! One slight problem - we have the worst list in the league for this style. Next year is going to be equally as rough. It's a very long term plan and I'm not sure an industry built on winning can withstand the pressure of the losses sure to come. I hope the club can keep the faith that it's asking of all it's supporters when the sharks start really circling.

It's not worse than 2008 in execution on field but it's much worse in terms of hope. It's pretty clear from the support at games that most believe we are going nowhere and have really resigned themselves to kicking the club. It's not pretty but it's not entirely unfounded either.

Jose, just wondering what you think these improvements are? Not saying they aren't there just interested in where the improvements been from your perspective.

I agree Clint. Neeld is a whipping boy for the ineptitude of the MFC across the board. He deserves a chance but he has to be held accountable for what is happening with what he's got. (I also hate how often he dwells on positives in the presser now. Nobody believes it and it just looks really disingenuous).

Put Clark, Jurrah, Jamar, Watts and Davey in and we'd still be terrible because we have no midfield, but we wouldn't be THAT terrible. Is the club still having those crisis meetings with members? I think they might need to hold a few more if this keeps us. Not a lot to look forward to I'm afraid.