Macca

As previously stated, I don't have a pronlem with India's stance on DRS at all. And I stlll don"t because of where we sit right now. And because of the mixed outcmes that we've seen with DRS, India has been proven correct in a lot of ways. Pointing the finger at India is missing the point anyway. They're not the problem. But my view is in the minority so I don't expect anyone to agree with me. India has softened their stance anyway so it's all heading to a point where the umpires are going to act more like orderly's rather than decision makers. But the DRS technology has it's issues as well. I don't believe it's all that accurate so the flaws will still create arguments.

The technology is only as good as the knowledge & judgement abilities of those programming the technology. And is the programming uniform from country to country? The judgements using the technology on any given decision would be the same for both teams within a match you'd reckon. Where as the 2 umpires might judge things differently and any given umpire might see 2 similar incidents differently. I'd prefer total technology as we're very close to that outcome anyway. Any given decision can right now be challenged depending on the review situation. And the technology should get better & better. And I'm coming from a platform where I've never had a problem with umpires. The rub of the green was fine with me but we're now in the middle ground where howlers can still happen in a random way. As we saw on Sunday night. I didn't see it as out but that's just me. The majority did however see it as out so the majority is probably right. But not definitely right (IMO).

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And maybe India are making a good point DJ ... this middle area we are in frustrates me more than when we had no technology at all I don't believe that India have any sinister reasons for having the stance that they have either. Maybe they just prefer an old school approach where the rub of the green ruled. My preference now is to do as you've suggested. Just review everything because the pace of the sport allows it. But can an LBW be given out if there is no appeal? ha ha I played in a SF once where the umpire told us that he would have given a player out caught at bat-pad but no one on our side appealed. The bloke missed it by a foot but according to the umpire he edged it onto his pad before popping it up to short leg. Needless to say there were any number of stunned looks as the player in question went on to make a 100 and we subsequently lost the game. A 'needless' appeal would have come in handy!

Excellent Summation DG. And like anything else in sport (or life for that matter) there are nearly always unintended consequences when change occurs (or when change is thrust upon us) But I'm in 2 minds on how DRS has effected the umpires and umpiring It could be that they have always made a number of errors and DRS is now showing them up and/or they are 2nd guessing themselves as a result of the 'accepted' technology. I reckon it's both. Baseball is experimenting with 'Total Technology' in AAA baseball (one rung lower than the majors) and I know a couple of real baseball fans who reckon that the umpires in baseball will eventually become a thing of the past. That's for every pitch and all the rest of it. Of course, no such thing is even possible in footy so the disillusionment with umpiring will rage on forever! Footy will never get close to getting all the myriad of decisions correct. But cricket can go very close to getting it near perfect. Total technology will give us that near-perfect solution but otherwise we have to put up with human error. Ongoing. The other thing we should remember is that we are often the recipients of the good fortune. It's just that our minds can neither acknowledge or even remember when that happens. But it does happen. It has to.

Arriving at the correct decisions shouldn't have anything to do with the captains and the majorly flawed review system Instead of arriving at the correct decision in a sensible way we now have a situation where a 'probable' howler happens coupled with a stuffed up review by Paine So 2 problems exist when no problem should exist. It really is quite ridiculous.

I wasn't sure that it was out as I thought it might have been sliding down leg. Might have just clipped the front pad too which could have straightened the ball up. Not sure that ball tracking picked that up or whether ball tracking is accurate anyway. Pretty images but I'm not sold. Anyway, you take the good with the bad and we threw the game away beforehand with poor bowling, average fielding and questionable captaincy. The last umpiring decision was less than 5% of it but will become the focus. To me it is negligible and it all evens itself out anyway Wadda. Given how the rulings are dealt with you have to expect a couple of poor umpiring adjudications anyway. Umpires are going to make errors. We can replace umpires but the next person in line will be no better. It will be more of the same. I see what everyone else sees. But as previously stated, the howlers still exist because we've now turned it into a game of reviews. There should at least be an over ruling party that can review decisions. So if a batsman is out (or not out) we should be able to arrive at the correct decision The whole thing really is quite amateurish. We don't actually need umpires in cricket anymore so the quicker we move to the technological age the better. Or go back to just umpires making the decisions. At the moment we're stuck in the middle and the controversy rages on. But most people just hate umpires if we're being honest so the above won't make any sense to them. Besides which, the decisions often are in your favour which most fail to acknowledge. They just see red and that's it.

To me it's like the Demons losing a GF by a point to Collingwood after leading by 6 goals at 3/4 time. But I'm a test cricket tragic ... only the retention of the Ashes will ease the pain. And I'm not confident now. Stokes, Root, Archer, Broad and Anderson (if available) need to be curtailed. And their team will be brim full of confidence now. On the other hand we will be licking our wounds. The 10 day break before the 4th Test might help though. And I reckon Starc needs to play if only for variation. There was a sameness to our pace attack in this last test.

He'll stay on ... not many other choices anyway. His bowlers bowled the wrong lines and lengths whilst the fielding was below par too. Everything that could go wrong, went wrong. And we'll either bounce back well or maybe not England on the other hand will come at us looking for the kill. The momentum is with them on their home soil. I'm not confident at Old Trafford but we might do well at the Oval. It's my belief that whoever wins the next test wins the Ashes. Us by default and if they go 2-1 up the track at the Oval might end producing a draw ?

As for the last LBW umpiring decision. Murphy's Law. Because of the review system and the same presence of howlers because of the review system, human error is a factor. And the only way to get rid of the howler is to fix the system. Blaming and/or sacking an umpire only presents an opportunity for the next umpire to make the same type of error You want error free umpiring in cricket, you won't get it. Unless the system is fixed. Anyway, we lost the game because of numerous errors of judgement that fell on our own shoulders.

Stokes kicked our butts. There was no luck involved as he played a controlled, brilliant innings. And we had no answers. Credit to him. Kudos. All things considered, his innings was one of the best I've seen. As for the Australians, we had our chances and we blew it. Bowled and fielded poorly. The LBW review by Paine & Cummins will haunt the team. An insane decision. You might think of doing it if you had another review up your sleeve. Amateur hour. The Lyon fumble ... these things happen but we lost the match in other areas. None of it umpire related. We choked.

I thought Leach batted quite well. At least he didn't panic like our sorry lot In fact, Leach looked quite calm whilst Paine looked clueless, our bowlers were delivering pies and our fielding and field placements went to the pack. Bowling half volleys to Stokes is never going to work. His tempo batting destroyed our bowlers. The post mortems won't be kind. I won't be calming down in a hurry either. 1981 is still a bitter memory. If we can somehow retain the Ashes I'll have to eat my words but I reckon we're gone

I reckon we're gone. I was thinking they were going to win the last 2 tests anyway We needed to win this one and we choked and we blew it.

We are cooked Wadda That was a choke of monumental proportions and we won't recover. Hope I'm wrong but the Poms will take advantage now. 3-1 to them.

The umpiring has nothing to do with it. Nothing We blew it and there are no excuses

I do Paine panicked

It's bad enough watching our football team continually choke in front of goal and now the cricket team follow suit. Lose from an unloseable position. We won't recover from this ... Archer will tear us a new one. 3-1 to the Poms. 70+ for the last wicket. We bowled poorly and we bowled pies.

We are gone A long road back from this loss.

That was the greatest choke ever. How do you lose from that position? Why review an LBW when the ball is a foot outside off? Cummins & Paine panicked. And Lyon? Massive Epic fail Credit to England and Stokes was sensational. But we gave it to them. Stokes bullied us and we had no answers. Paine's field placings were all over the place.

So often 1 wicket brings another wicket ... and the bookies know all that of course. Lyon will probably stay on at one end you'd reckon. Run out!

I don't want the series to stay alive so my care factor for us winning this match is through the roof! To be honest If we don't win this test match I will be filthy. The cat, walls & tv aren't safe!

If we win, the last 2 Tests become dead rubbers but if they win, it's game on. But you'd imagine that we'd be shattered if we do lose after bowling them out for 67 in their first innings. I couldn't see us losing after that happened but here we are with England now favoured to win the match. It will be advantage England if they win especially with Archer at their disposal. What a great sport though Wadda? The drama that test cricket provides is 2nd to none. The ebb and flow of the 5 day game is amazing.

Fair enough too. They have fought gallantly. Still reckon that if the Aussies get a wicket soon then the pendulum can swing the other way. Butler & Woakes can bat but Broad, Archer & Leach aren't great. Their strength before the series started was identified as their late middle order but that included Moeen Ali (replaced by Leach who bats at no.11) I still favour the Aussies to win but only just.

Did the Poms replace the wicket at lunchtime yesterday? One of those drop-in types (road) that the Aussie curators specialise in? These 2 (Stokes & Bairstow) look super comfortable. Advantage England.

Their best chance is to counter-attack with these 2 at the crease. And of course if we bowl well to counter, the wickets should come. Or at least 1 wicket and that's all we need - 1 wicket to keep changing the balance.