Rollo2

I don't know. Arguably we had plenty of in and under types with Jones, Mckenzie, Magner and the drafting of Viney. And we all know how much we were all calling out for more pace and spread last year. You need a bit of Steven Stretch to go with your Todd Viney, in other words. That's the kind of player Toumpas promises to become, so that's why we drafted him. And no pacey wingman type is going to look good in a team getting mauled every week. Surely the attacking running types only shine when teams are competitive or winning. I wish they weren't playing Toumpas. At a power club he'd be nowhere near getting a game and would be having a good apprenticeship via the VFL. But I'm going to be patient with this one. I remember when we drafted two supposed 'Bull at the gate' mids in Sylvia and Mclean. It arguably ushered in years of a midfield of substandard speed and class. This year is nothing. Let's not second guess Jimmy Toumpas before he has had a chance to play his natural game with us.

In as well. I didn't experience much of the eighties, but I've been thinking about that period in the past weeks. What those Dees fans put up with for all those long years. My Dad slogged through all those years and when he had kids taught us about the magic of Robbie Flower. And by the end of Robbie's career we had a good team again. I don't have kids but if I did maybe I would be telling them stories about Jeremy Howe marks or Jack Viney's blood, or big Jimma saving the club and inspiring the nation. Things will get better, it really will happen. It's harder for a club like ours that can't put the money into recruiting and the football department that an Essendon or Collingwood can, but it will happen. Not with Neeld, that's for sure. And probably not with this crop of players. Jesse Hogan may be in his seventh year by the time we're a decent club again. We may win a couple of wooden spoons before we finally find our Buddy or Reiwoldt in the draft. But given we're now debt free thanks to Jimma, we certainly will not fold any time soon, and simply based on history and AFL systems it is highly unlikely we can stay this bad for another five years. I'm also in just because there is more to this than football. The MFC brings my whole family together. Last week I was there with my young cousins. This week I was there with my brother. Even getting pumped we are sharing something we all care about and bonding. At the end of our lives those times are going to count for a lot. And finally, just imagine if we win a premiership in our lifetimes, how it would feel. Looking back on nights like this? I get a bit emotional just thinking about it. Red and Blue for life.

Just got home after leaving at three quarter time. Have to say for me it's not as disappointing as round 1 last year – purely because last year I had higher expectations. I think what today showed is that trying to fill holes with recycled players is really only something that can work for top teams. The recycled players need to fit into slots around on-field leadership structures. We expect them to come in and BE the leadership structures. But what I think we saw today is that Pederson, Gillies, Byrnes, Rodan, M Jones etc are not going to be any better than S Martin, Petterd, Moloney, Bennell, Morton & Gysberts were, and that this is probably going to mean the end of Mark Neeld. In other words, it wasn't, as Neeld would have probably liked to believe, a handful of rotten apples spoiling the club's systems or 'culture' - it was and still is a team lacking any top-tier talent, unwilling and unable to take the game on and create the opportunities to win games. Port were all over us today. Every single time we had the ball they wanted it back and fiercely fought for it back, because they knew they were the better, stronger, fitter team. The third quarter was as bad an effort as i've seen. How the players could come out after half time flat-footed in round one and not offer a shot against an opponent as beatable as Port, and at our home ground, is beyond me. It's actually pretty remarkable how bad we were today.

Just got around to watching the North replay last night and I have to say I'm surprised folks are being quite so pessimistic. Seemed to me we matched a good team pretty well for intensity, run and getting numbers to the ball and we looked dangerous going forward. Far better than what we've seen in NAB cups for the last four years i'd say. I don't think we're going to make the eight or anything, but given how bad we've been in recent years I think there's a good chance we might be able to enjoy some solid indications of progress this year. Haven't watched the Richmond game yet, but I do think playing back to back against a fresh team in 30 degree heat has to be at least taken into account.

Farewell Clint and thanks for everything. Probably one of the toughest players in the AFL. There are some small forwards around the league sleeping better now.

Not sure about this one, if it's true. When Jamar goes down with injury, who rucks? In my opinion i'd prefer Martin to Gawn or Spencer, I actually think he plays pretty well when forced to be the starting ruckman, and history shows we tend to need that from him for stags each year. God knows where Brisbane plans on playing him though. Bit strange all around in my book..

Phew! After kicking 1.5 I think i'll be relegated to the backline next time, but very relieved we snuck home. Thanks to the organisers and all who came out, especially Clint Bartram, was a fun dsy as always and good to see the other teams getting good numbers along as well.

GIRO, all are welcome. And there have been some late apologies. I think rollo1 is in bed, so I'm going to say come on down!

Is Bartram really coming? That's awesome, he's been one of my favorite players for years. Even stoutly defended him on this forum after that West Coast game when he should have kicked three goals. I've always had your back Barts! Anyway Rollo2 is now plus 3! Got some good news today, my club's b+f is able to make it Sunday and is bringing his brother. Both are mad keen melbourne supporters. Put them down as 'Cords1' and 'Cords2'. Can't speak for Cords2, but Cords1 (also known as 'The General') is a classy midfield type who also plays really well across half back, uses the ball exceptionally well and can run all day. If Cords2 is anything like his brother they will dominate. My other +1 you can put down as 'Strawbs' (his surname is O'Dwyer). Never seen him play but his Mum told me he's pretty good. Well-built pacy utility type. Can't wait!

"rollo2 is my son. Played his junior soccer as a close-checking defender, but in AFL does not have a defensive bone in his body. Took the winning mark and kicked the winning goal for us that sent talkingcarlton out of forum footy (hopefully not) forever… awkward kicking style, but has never missed a set shot for us, not quite 6 foot but marks above his height, especially when the kick is centered to the goal square. Recommend starting forward pocket…" Actually I'm 3.2 from set shots for Demonland. No Buddy Franklin, but still fairly bad. Also all my VAFA this year was in defence and am starting to get the hang of it. But do like a run up forward. PS I think Syrus may have played last game, I remember a fairly big key position type who played CHB but may deserve a shot up forward this time. Could be wrong though. ?

I'm in! Nice work Rollo and Scotty. Will also put the word out to the other dees supporters on my team once the date is set, hopefully a few will jump at the chance for a run.

Why move Clark? Ridiculous coaching.

OUT: Me watching the game IN: An enjoyable weekend. maybe.

Haven't been so depressed by a game of footy in a while. Very hard to see a way forward with this playing group and game plan. Agree wholeheartedly that our inability to spread, create options and hit up targets means we need to almost start again. Bloody hard to watch our team get torn apart by an average side like Brisbane on our home ground.

Neeld seems to be making a big statement here, that this is his team now and he doesn't care the slightest about what has happened in the past before he arrived, and maybe that attitude will be good for a playing group needing a fresh start, but at the same time, it could affect individual players badly. I just can't help wondering how Beamer would feel being rated as less of a leader than Bartram or Garland after winning the b+f and getting the most brownlow votes of any Demon. If you read Martin Flanagan's pieces about the Dees last year, he was wholly convinced that Moloney was the playing group's heart and soul. I also wonder whether Clark deserves this before stepping onto the field once for us. I also worry about what that kind of attitude could mean for a Jack Watts or an Aaron Davey. I don't want to see Wattsy dropped to Casey if he has one bad week so he can get [censored] from suburban footy fans and be the opportunity of a lifetime for some hack defender to prove themselves each week. I also don't want to see Aaron Davey handled in a way that could destroy whatever is left of his confidence. I know we all want to believe that our new coach is the messiah who will lead us to the promised land, but I have to say that this decision has me a at least slightly concerned about his attitudes about himself and the playing group.

Thanks guys. A couple have had surgery though right? Jurrah is one, but I forget the other. Anyone know who they are and if they'll be fit for round one? I have something (that is secret) riding on this...

Just curious, barring further injuries, who's likely not to be available for selection come round one?

B: Bartram Rivers Garland HB: Grimes Frawley Blease C: Green Jones Bail HF: Sylvia Watts Howe FF: Jurrah Clark Davey F: Jamar Moloney Trengove INT: Martin Morton McKenzie Petterd (sub) Like how many people have Flash in the forward line. Don't understand everyone assuming Stef can play CHB. Tap and MacDonald are stiff here, both can come in if Bartram misses three sitters again like he did against WC, and Gys for Morton if he still refuses to go hard, but this would be the most exciting lineup for mine.

Great day, thanks to all, especially Wise for his never-say-die leadership and Rollo 1 for organising. Apologies for giving away that goal for swearing at the umpire. He was a bit f**ked though.

Far be it from me to question the wisdom of the venerable Rollo1, just raising some food for thought. However, if the pies board is discussing this I don't suppose reasoned arguments will be required.

Just my 2 cents... Although the 2nd format solves the problem of having uneven rests, it doesn't guarantee all teams play each other. Say the team we beat in our first game goes on to win their second game, we'll just play them again in the last game, and we'll still only have played against two teams. You COULD just do a round robin with three games and two ovals, then work out who wins via points (and percentage if needed), which would solve both issues. But if we're voting, I'd keep it the way it's been. You only need one oval, you only need half as many umpires, more scope for fill-ins if some teams don't have enough players. Plus I don't think waiting two games to play again or playing consecutive games are massive disadvantages.

Hi, Few days ago I started a thread that was just asking people to suggest humorous text messages Mark Neeld may have received from the playing group. It was just a bit of fun. Looked back later and there were a few pretty funny responses. But then looked back again a bit later and the thread was completely gone. If someone deleted it, I'd be curious to find out why. Thanks.

Might just bags the other forward pocket while it's still available

Totally agree. It's like if you turn the ball over a couple of times a game fans will be calling for your head because it's obvious. But play soft bruise-free footy without one percenters and endeavor and you can play in MFC's defence. As Bartram's career stats show (16.12 before today – yes that doesn't include out of bounds on the full, if anyone has actual facts about that instead of conjecture and selective memory let us know), the guy is not that bad a shot at goal, he just had a shocking day today. But give me Bartram missing three great opportunities he's created himself with run (while stopping Kerr) than a Strauss, Cheney or Simon Buckley any day.

But the Pies are giving games to Buckley and the Hawks are giving games to Cheney. I'd have Bartram in my team before either.