Rollo2

Morton was woeful. But it was hardly his conditions today. I'd leave him in and see how he goes on a dry track up at GC. But I definitely think we need Petterd in the team. There was just not enough targets to kick to up forward today. Maybe drop Watts for Rick (though I'm told Watts was decent early – I missed the first half).

We still haven't stuck it up Kennett for suggesting we go to the Gold Coast, though we have come very close. For that reason, plus the arrogance of the sample of their supporters I've had the misfortune of sitting next to in recent years, I dearly, dearly want to beat the hawks, and I imagine a number of players on our list feel the same. That might give us the extra boost needed to overcome what is probably a better side on paper right now. God I hope so.

Great hit, but if he had gone for the ball he probably would have prevented an inside 50...

Agree it was Maric's fault, but only a slight error of judgement. Matter of inches. More an amazing effort from the Sydney player (Bolton I think) than a clanger for Tapscott or Maric. And yes, brilliant debut. Very impressive.

And if you constantly count the rocks you've traversed, you are likely to end up going around in circles.

Obviously there is a difference between the things I drew an analogy between. As there is between all things one can draw an analogy between (without a difference, you would be drawing an analogy between a thing and itself). The similarity between them is what matters, and as I said, they are similar in being obscure and potentially misleading statistics, and not the kind of thing a coach should focus on for an upcoming season. I agree my example was outlandish, but this was not to confuse readers, but was conversely to make it clearer what aspect of 'winning quarters' I was attempting to criticize by analogy. There is no problem with Bailey talking to the team before a quarter about winning the quarter, and no one has said there is. If that is the way he gets the best out of the team for that half an hour then so be it. That isn't the issue. The issue is that Bailey doesn't just talk about winning quarters in that context, he talks about them as a goal for the upcoming season, which as posters have pointed out, isn't something you here from the more successful coaches in the league. Not a massive deal, I simply joined the thread because Range Rover was getting some pretty unfair and illogical feedback – though as I said, that was not your doing.

Well, it actually is 'kind of like that' in exactly the sense I referred to, i.e. both being 'obscure and potentially deceptive' statistics. There are a couple of reasons I felt tis should be clarified. First, there have been numerous illogical and simply incorrect claims made about winning more quarters, such as that winning X amount more will guarantee us an extra X number of wins, or that winning 2 quarters gives you a %50 chance of winning a game, and so on, so it's not obvious that everyone understands the deficiencies of the statistic. Second, one poster (not you) remarked that Range Rover 'had no point', which again is just wrong.

True. And I've got to say I agree with you Range Rover, and also think that a lot of the posters who have had a go at you have missed your point. No one is saying that winning more quarters is a bad thing, or that winning more quarters doesn't make it statistically more likely you'll win more games. What Range Rover (I believe) is saying is simply that won quarters are a fairly obscure and potentially deceptive statistic, so are not something a coach should be priding their self on or focusing on for an upcoming season. Kind of like if Bailey came out and said his aim for the year was to kick more goals from outside 50 towards the punt rd end of the MCG - sure, that will help, but it's surely not what we're about as a club. I'll also note that the other AFL coach who seems most keen on discussing won quarters is Damien Hardwick. Draw whatever conclusions you want from that.

Hear hear.

Thanks heaps for the game guys (especially organisers), had a lot of fun despite the poor numbers and clearly getting robbed by some creative scorekeeping from Rollo1 I love this photo. This is a 52-year-old Jetta leaving me in his wake. Legend.

Yet nonetheless defensive. But you're right in that I don't really have a clue about AFL defense. So just forward line for me then please coach! Or centre half bench.

Coff coff best and fairest full back for the wangaratta red devils* under 16s, coff! B) *a soccer team, admittedly.

I love the forward line, but then, so do most of us. In a lot better shape than last time I had a run, but still probably not fit enough for the midfield. So forward line or backline for me.

Congrats to Brad Green. I have a feeling that the way he wears the captaincy over the next two, maybe three, years will cement him as a rue great of the footy club. A bit surprised at the Rivers decision though. Wasn't really aware he was held in that high regard at the club. It's a pleasant surprise though. He's obviously matured greatly from the young tool beating up Swedes in Bali (or wherever that was). Perhaps that was all Brock's bad influence. Anyway, good on you Greeny. Carn the Dees!

If I can somehow manage to avoid injury between now and then i'm in! Playing basketball with friends this arvo so stay tuned

Green deserves it – the guy is a champion. The onfield leadership he showed last year was incredible. He was always stepping up when we needed it most, and our team hadn't had that for quite a while. Maybe he isn't the buddy of all the younger guys, but I don't think there's a mould you need your captain to fit into that says they have to be. He is just so obviously our captain on the field that it would feel wrong, for mine, for him not to get it. Davey is a champion as well, but I just don't see him being able to do the team-lifting things when they are needed like Green.

Nah, I wasn't advocating anything, just remarking that given that we haven't been blessed with a classic logo that's withstood the test of time, it's silly to imagine we can create one out of the blue and escape the modern AFL 4-5 year logo/branding turnaround.

Well said. The New York Yankees logo, for instance, says an incredible amount and means a heck of a lot with just two letters. And it means all that because it's been around for so long. Alternatively, some of the emblems of priemership league teams in England are very busy, but still carry that sense of history. But this is the AFL, and the dees, and i will bet anyone here that the MFC will change the logo again within, say, 5 years. That's just the way it is for our club, unfortunately, because we haven't had the good sense to just stick with something that is ours through thick and thin. And that's why I think it was probably a bit silly to try to create something out of the blue that could carry the kind of gravitas they were hoping for. But that said, who cares, really? For me the true logo of our club, the thing that gives me that feeling of instant recognition and pride, is and will always be our home guernsey. If they try to change THAT, then it's time to picket MFC headquarters.

Going to have to pull out too, sorry lads. Injury didn't come good in time unfortunately. Good luck, hope I can make it next time.

Ah, thanks!

Everyone's been saying that the Bulldog's kid was the first player to debut in a final in 25 years, but I could have sworn we had a ruckman debut in a final fairly recently. Totally forget his name, but I think the final was against Fremantle, and he was a bit overawed. It's been bugging me, would appreciate it if someone knows. Who was that guy, was it his debut, was it a final?

ditto. Not even a stat (I don't think), but definitely my favorite moment of the match.

Good point. People with Watts in their teams ahead of Dunn are being disingenuous. Dunn is giving us more as of now. Hardly anyone has a back up ruckman, which is understandable in a sense, but depending on who the opposition is could be a problem. I kind of like the idea that our ideal 22 would alter depending on the opposition. But great to see Bartram in everyone's!

As someone who has been quite closely associated with rollinson65 over the years, I can assure everyone here that he most certainly does NOT hate to crow. But aside from the misleading topic title, yes, I agree. Always loved Bartram. The fluoro boots were obviously the final piece of the puzzle there. And I'm definitely seeing your point about Dunn. He seems to be in the side when we're at our best, doesn't he? GO DEES!

Beamer as captain? I have to admit I hadn't thought of this before, but you make good points, he is a mentor and does bleed red and blue. The one issue I see arising is that in a few years could be, say, our fifth or sixth best midfielder behind Scully, Trengove, Gysberts, Davey, and maybe Morton, Grimes or Blease... He would then either have to retain the captaincy despite having much less of an on field leadership role, or would have to be stripped of it at some point. Neither scenario serves him as a player IMO. .