GOLF

At the risk of upsetting the proud traditions of this site, I would like to discuss the player mentioned in the thread title: Maric. At the moment the only role he seems to function in is small forward. As we currently seem to only employ one of these, he is in direct competition with Wona, Bennell and Jetta at least. Where do we think he rates against those three? Admittedly Bennell may take some other roles around the ground, but in general we are well staffed in those other roles as well, so Maric should be considered against all three. I think he may be ahead of Jetta, but not on Jetta's good days. I also think 3 players for one position is adequate depth. So I can see the case that Maric is surplus to our current, and unless he shows dramatic development, our mid to long term, requirements. It would therefore be A Good Thing if we can trade him for a type we are currently or potentially in need of. We need a mature bodied ruck as back up for Jamar for the next 2 years. Could even be 28yo. Might get one for Maric if the other club is well stocked with tall timber. We need a tall forward or prospect in case Watts or Fitzpatrick don't make it. Could be up to 19-25yo. Might get one for Maric plus a pick, but won't be a star. We need tall defender prospects who will be AFL ready in 2014 and on. An Apprentice gorrilla-handler would be nice, as Warnock is the oldest of our tall defenders. Might get a youngster (1-2 year player) who wants to come home for Maric and a pick. We can always do, even in a corrupted draft, with improving our draft picks (eg, Maric plus pick 49 for something around 30 or below). But we will not get outright stars for a player like Maric, even if we throw in late picks. So consider: can we get a trade for any of our required types for Maric plus 49? If not, can we improve our draft pick 49 for Maric? If not, what can we do that is notably better than retaining Maric on the list and trying to develop him into other roles?

As two sheds said this has got coterie written all over it. Hird may, however, turn out to be a good coach. But if he doesn't, what will the Essendon coterie groups try for their next trick. And even if he does turn out to be a good coach, he'll be trying to make bricks without straw. A poor list and two corrupted drafts coming up. He'll be lucky to get 4 good youngsters over the next two drafts, and he has more than that number of spuds he would want to let go. But if he is not showing real progress by end 2013, the coterie groups will tear him down.

Not Warnock. Maybe Bate/Maric/Jetta. Maybe 3rd pick as well. But we might pick up a disaffected ruck in the draft with our third pick, or even get a mature age rookie. Remember we need this person for 2 years, so they can be 27-29yo. The other thing (apart from Warnock) that we don't give uop for him is pick 12.

We need a mature bodied ruckman as insurance in case Jamar goes down. Trade if we can get one cheap, draft if any turn up about pick 49, or rookie a mature aged VFL or near retirement, disaffected AFL ruck. Need is for 2 years until Gawn/Spencer/Fitzpatrick come through in 2013. So if we send him to the knackers at end 2012, no tears. We need another tall forward in case either of Watts or Fitzpatrick don't make the grade. We can trade (2nd round pick + player?) and get one who can be played now, or draft (1st or second round) and get one who may be ready by 2013 or may never be ready. Or we can throw the crown jewels at it and get a relatively young forward/ruck who does both. At what cost? Try pick 12 plus Gysberts or Tapscott to a team needing midfield class. Should be deciding what course of action we are following before we start naming targets.

What we need is insurance. We are one Russian cruciate ligament injury away from having such a rubbish ruck division that we won't make the 8 for two or three years. Spencer, Fitzpatrick and Gawn are young. Jamar hit his straps as a no 1 AFL ruck at age 26; why do you think the three youngsters are going to be adequate first rucks in their teens or early twenties? I would be happy to see us ruck next year with Jamar plus one of Gawn/Spencer/Fitzpatrick, but not to see PJ go as first ruck with one of those young behind him, let alone see Spencer as first ruck plus Fitzpatrick as second. The mature bodied ruckman we need to recruit may play no senior games at all in 2011/12, if Jamar stays fit and doesn't start to wear out as he did in 2010. He is there in case Jamar goes down. He could usefully give Jamar a bit of a rest (say the games just before and/or after the byes next year, or before and/or after the split round in 2012), but he is not, repeat not, there to play alongside Jamar on a regular basis. He will be there to ensure we get finals experience and development of a winning culture into our kids in 2011/12, even if Jamar has a serious injury. He might also help Jamar get into 2013 in good enough fettle to help us get to the GF and hopefully a flag. If Meesen had not been injured so badly/so often he might have filled this role. If PJ had developed like we hoped he would he might have filled this role. If Martin had not gone into reverse at high speed in 2010 he might have filled this role. If Newton was not a 193cm spud, he might have filled this role. But none of them came up with the goods, so none of them can fill this role. We want to be in the 8 in 2011, and the 4 in 2012. We won't do it if Jamar is injured and we have no solid (not brilliant, but solid) replacement to throw into the breach.

You got chapter and verse on that old55?

They are taking (so they say) 8 of their "out of contract" singings this year, so will have 8 more to come. They really need a couple of tall forwards and a couple of developed ruckmen. Their young players are a year behind ours, and should therefore be peaking in 2014/15. They have a lot of these, and some very early draft picks this year. They have to get themselves together, hovever, and with only 8-12 players who are not 18-20, that will be uphill going in 2011/12. I reckon: 2011: 13-15, or bottom 2 if they can't get a decent culture going. 2012: 10-14 2013: 5-8 2014: maybe top 4 2015: top 4, maybe GF. These predictions depend on things going right for them, including McKenna proving to be a good coach, being able to get thje right "out of contract" signings, a good culture developing, and the overpaid young not going off the rails, and most of their current young and the ones they get in 2011 and 2012 drafts living up to their potential.

Think they will have to go for extra time if they get a draw next week. Another replay would conflict with trade week.

I hear it will be announced just after the rerun of the sprint.

McEvoy may well now be out of the running. Gardiner was off the ground for a fair bit of the 2nd half, so McEvoy may well get a start in the replay GF. Off course, if he is left out again, he will be out of there faster than a winged mammal from the infernal regions.

PJ won the VFL Brownlow equivalent for Sandy a few years back. But this news still doesn't make me want to keep Miller on.

Current replay rule should remain unless Collingwood are involved. Unfair to other team to have a replay against the filth in October when the wobbles are no longer active. If Collingwood are involved there should be an unlimited number of extra time periods until the match is resolved, with whoever is playing collingwood allowed any number of fresh substitutes for each period of ectra time.

There are a few ruck types rumoured to be coming loose this year. McEvoy may be one. Hale may be another. One from Carlton maybe. Add your own favourite rumours. We need backup for Jamar for the next 2 years until Spencer/Gawn/Fitzpatrick are ready. We can either keep PJ for this, or try to get something in trade. Can't rely on the draft, as we need an AFL ready hard bodied ruck, not a 19yo who will take years. GC will be looking for one or two of these types to shoulder the load until young Zac and any other beanpoles they have or may draft come good as AFL level ruckmen in 2014/15. And they will be the Lola's of the 2010 trade period (whatever GC wants, GC gets). You can then make your own list of who else may be chasing them. We don't need an absolute star. We don't need a relatively young lad. Our need is for 2 years, so we could take a 28 to 30 yo. So rule 1 for this trade is: "Don't get into bidding wars (especially with GC) and waste our value". If we can get someone surplus to requirements or disatisfied with their current club for a reasonable price (which I put at pick 30 plus one of Bate/Jetta/Maric - our surpluses) then go for it. I think McEvoy will command a higher trade price than this. I would not, on any account, use our pick 12 for this trade. Remember, we don't need a star ruck here, just 2 years insurance on the Russian's cruciate ligaments. If we can't get anyone on trade, then we can either retain PJ or look for a mature age rookie. Or both.

The FD are right to offer one year only. The main reason that Cam played 20+ games in 2010 was that Grimes was injured. I will miss him if he goes, but he would not be guaranteed a regular seniors spot in 2011. Still a great utlity and depth player, but does not have a lock on any one position. If he goes I will say godspeed and I hope they give you a lot of money - you deserve it.

All this discussion of who to delist should be moderated by a discussion of when to trade and when to draft. Trade is you can get something you need that won't be available in the draft. Or to improve your draft picks. Or if Carlton want to give us pick 11 again. Draft for young blood to develop into future players. Rookie opportunistically, or even speculatively. We need something to protect us from Jamar going lame. Gawn, Spencer and Fitzpatrick may be ready for this role by 2013 (just maybe 2012 in the case of Spencer) but they are not ready yet. We can either keep PJ in this role, or get a mature bodied ruckman to replace him. This person can be one of the several 3rd/4th in line ruckmen rumoured to be on offer, but must have real AFL experience. But if we trade, don't use our first draft pick and be very reluctant to use our second. Good players are available in even a rorted draft at 12 and 30. We might even find a suitable candidate in the rookie draft. I'm thinking Orren Stephenson, but there may be others. Wouldn't matter that he would be on the rookie list as he is only really required if Jamar goes down. Only trouble with waiting for the rookie draft is that we have to make the call on PJ before we know what we can get. My strategy is to Delist PJ upfront, look to trade, if no trade look to Rookie, if no rookie take a very deep breath and rely on Spencer/Gawn/Fitzpatrick/Martin (nervous breakdowns all round). Delisting PJ makes the space we require for the back up ruck, and maybe another if we trade. We should use two draft picks minimum, but only on player types we don't have already. We have lots of mids, lots of small/meduium forwards, and lots of defenders, albeit with some questions about delivery by foot. So tall forwards and defenders with extra special delivery skills look like the draft targets. Our forward structure is at the monent dependant on Watts and Fitzpatrick maturing into class tall forwards. No one else seems in the running. Jurrah is a great 3rd forward, Dunn is more middle sized HFF with great defensive skills. Bate, Martin, miller and Newton have falled by the wayside for this role. I don't think we can trade successfully for this type of player without offering pick 12, so it will have to be draft and hope, osing pick 30, and maybe rookie another prospect. But if we can get a backup ruckman by whatever means, a high skills defender with pick 12 and a tall forward prospect with pick 30, plus promoting Spencer and McKenzie, we will have moved our list forward. This will have cost us Junior, Miller, Bell, PJ and one other (maybe Warnock) as a trade for a ruck backup. Maybe not even Warnock if we get the backup in the rookie draft.

There are two issues intertwining here: 1) What do we need 2) What of our needs should we be going for in the draft, and what in trade/rookie pickups. The Ruck position is that we need an AFL ready backup for Jamar to serve for the next 2 years. After that, Gawn, Spencer and Fitzpatrick may take up the slack. Unless we are happy with PJ for this role, we should trade for a mature ruck. Probably wont be available in the draft. Can be quite old as he only needs to last 2 years. Would be nice if he could stand in the forward line, kick one goals a game, and knock a few dowm to our smalls. The need of a KPF is for insurance in case Watts/Fitzpatrick don't make it. Choice between one who is ready to go at AFL level now (through trade) or a youngster in the draft who may not be really firing by 2013. Dealers choice. The skilled defender with the deadly foot will most likely need pick 12 in the draft. I'd like at least 190cm. So I would trade whoever we need to outside our core or whatever picks we need to except for pick 12 for a big hard ruck. If you accept a 28 yo, there shoulkd be someone available. If we can't get an AFL experienced guy, go for Orren Stephenson from North Ballarat by whatever means. Then work out where to look for the tall KPF insurance. But keep pick 12 for the skilled defender.

Play 17 rounds (ie each other tream once) varying home and away Each year. After 17 rounds, play: Week 1: 18 v 15 & 16 v 17, losers eliminated 14 v 11 & 13 v 12, Loser to play winners of above next week 1 - 10 play 1 v 10, 2 v 9, etc, results contributing to ongoing ladder positions. Week 2: Winners of 15-18 play losers of 11-14, losers eliminated Winners of 11-14 play 9& 10, Loser to play winners of above next week 1-8 play in some format to avoid repetition of last weeks games, results contributing to ongoing ladder positions. Weeks 3-5: Keep on doing that, losing 2 teams per week, until 8 are left and play the final 8 as is. Advantages: Play all teams on fair H&A over 2 years Works for 17 or 18 teams (Bye is eliminated in first week of "finals") Hopeless cases go out mercifully early All matches really count; tanking discouraged Same number of rounds as at presenr (22 + 5 finals weeks) Eddie can't get out of travelling Problems: Need to work out compensation for missed games by weak sides - some sort of finals gate pooling? Need to do some work on how games at top end of table avoid repetition.

Naaahhhh. Pies trailing by 3 points with seconds to go. Didak gets it in a big huddle 20 meters out from goal. He turns, he twists, and kicks over his own shoulder as three saints converge to bury him. The ball flies high and true through the big sticks, as the siren sounds. The Pies fans go wild. And the umpire signal "touched off the boot".

So who is the bigest DH? Fevola or Voss?

From the list given there, you may find: Bail contracted to 2011 Bate re-signed to 2012 Watts deep in discussions about an extension (2013?)

The one attribute of LJ not yet covered in this thread is his uncanny ability to get on his own on the goalside of all the defenders. Seems to happen at least once per game. I don't know of any position where this can be turned to advantage so well as deep in the forward line, so I'd have to vote for him staying there.

And we should continue with the development of the young. We should concsiously set aside 10 games for each of Tapscott, Blease, Gysberts, Strauss and Fitzpatrick. And at least 5 games each for Spencer, Gawn and McNamara. That's 65 games for these young - 3 in the side each of the 22 rounds. Otherwise we will be in no position to know who to keep and who to let go at the end of 2011.

I'm betting on them giving Richardson a one year contract to coach, in the knowledge that a whole raft of senior coaches (including Mark Harvey) will be coming free at end 2011. This should thouroughly destabilise Richardson and continue the downward spiral. Only alternative is to give Chocco a 5 year deal and find out at the end of year 1 that he has lost interest in coaching.

Minimise the damage. Teach her how to look after her teeth.

Try comparing Newton and PJ on a level playing field - the VFL. Both have a reasonanble number of appearances there this year. PJ is a dominant VFL ruckman, Newton is not. Hardly surprising given PJ is 199 cm, and Netwon is 193cm. Newton should only be considered if he can become a forward who can help out in the ruck. At the moment he hardly rates as a solid forward in the VFL. Needs to be producing goals and assists at AFL level whenever he gets a game to be considered for any further extension. There is talk on the sites about him having improved, being a late developer and so forth. But until he can show credible performance as an AFL level forward, his prowess or lack of it in the ruck is irrelevant.