Nasher

Jeepers. This thread has officially jumped the shark.

I won't delete the topic but I will close it. While I accept that there's no stopping these stories once they start, I believe as supporters of the MFC we have a responsibility not to fan the fire. This is the ugly side of our "can't get enough" footy media.

Social media 101: Don't. Read. The. Comments.

Default setting in the software. Don't know why - to prevent like spamming I suppose. Don't know why that might be a problem, but I guess we'll find out as I've just changed it to unlimited. Like away!

Fair enough. He took a long time to show it at AFL level.

You've forgotten: Gawn had all the marking power of a man with watermelons for hands until the last few years. As recently as 2015, Gawn was kicking around in the twos, with Spencer the lead ruck(!), with Roos and co going "hrmm, this guy is a bit of a worry". He was textbook "bean-pole ruckman". King was taken where he was because that's where the recruiting team ranked him.

Should have waited until the rookie draft to get Max Gawn too I suppose.

Don't know how you can be so sure. Hogan first forward, Tim Smith second forward, Watts third forward/10% ruck seems like a reasonable setup to me. The alternative is Hogan first forward, Watts second forward, Pedersen third forward/10% ruck, but that is just urinating around the edges as far as the ruck goes, it only means 10% more Watts in the forward line, and I'd prefer we got a good look at Smith. I don't see it as such a huge leap forward over what we picked to be able to use absolute words like wrong. Not directing this at you specifically Gonzo but the "she'd have all been fine if we'd picked Pedersen" mentality is breaking my brain a bit. Surely it is beyond question that the reason it went pear-shaped is because we lost two key pieces of the infrastructure, and that what would have happened had we not is unknown.

I'm not sure if it's that or he just processes things really fast - I can't remember if it was in the JLT or round 1 but I remember one play where he was charging inside 50, looked set to have a flying shot at goal, then passed it to 20m out at the absolute last second. It's one aspect of his game I'd love to see more of - getting on the end of outside ball.

Hah, burn! It wouldn't surprise me if Clarry had a brother who was a plonker. That's a bit what Clarry looked like too, even to some professional scouts, before everyone realised what a gift he had. It's the speed in which his brain operates and can deliver signals to his hands that sets him apart. It's a one in a million trait, and without it he's just another player. Being built like a brick outhouse also helps, though that trait is a lot more common.

He'd have to be better in terms of taps, definitely. The questions for me would be 1) is he fit enough to shoulder 90% ruck duties as you'd expect a first ruck? If we ended up needing to put Watts (or other) in to the ruck for 30% of the game, that would defeat the purpose, and 2) can he contribute anything around the ground? Secondary functions of the ruck are to move forward or back in to the hole when required. Even if Pedersen is totally inadequate in the ruck, at least we could be pretty confident he would be able to do that. All obviously questions we can't answer from the armchair, but probably also difficult to answer on such a small sample size at Casey. I reckon there's a good chance Goodwin and co would want a few more weeks of feedback from Plapp on those questions before calling him in.

Lewis will play zero games at Casey. Will retire still a regular player in the MFC side.

Nothing against Keilty, but the fact that he's currently playing as first ruck for Casey makes a mockery of the couple of people who wanted to bring King in to the senior side. Not even ready to be the chief ruck at Casey yet. [Edit: that's from the round 1 report. By the sounds of it, King was first ruck in round 2.] Let's just leave our undeveloped rookies alone. This isn't an issue they need to be concerned with. We will have to make do with part timers until one of the big men recover.

Anyone know off the top of their heads what ruck division looks like on other club lists? I said so in the thread LH linked too I think, but to me 1xSenior ruck, 1xAFL capable backup and 2xJuniors seems about right (edit: I argued for only 3 in that thread - probably too few in hindsight). Any more "AFL capable" rucks on the list and you risk hindering the development of your junior rucks - you only need one ruckman in the VFL. In most cases it would be very rare for you to end up having to fall through to your junior rucks; in our case this is further exacerbated by the fact that one of our junior rucks also is coming off a long term injury. It's all well and good to say we should have got Nathan Vardy who can play ruck or forward, but that wasn't without its own risks - he'd barely been on the park in years. Imagine if we'd been sitting here now with Gawn, Spencer, King and Vardy all on the sidelines or underdone. Ruckmen who can play as a genuine ruckman and loaf about as a forward when not required in the ruck are few and scarcely become available, because every club wants a player like that. The ones that do become available usually do because there's some increased risk - see Vardy. In an environment where you have finite list places, it's not possible to mitigate or eliminate every single risk. The position we've landed in sucks, but I'm still not sure I'd take a different course without having the benefit of a crystal ball.

I think you can achieve all of that without changing who does the kicking. It's a tactical issue rather than a personnel issue.

Vince is a good kick of the footy and can kick it long when required. I don't see why he should not continue the duties. If we're not setting up right for kick ins, or his instructions are poor or unclear or too much is being left to him to decide, these are all team/coaching issues. The kicker is really only the one executing the plan. Unless the question is of skill, which in this case I don't think it is, then the issue is broader than the kicker and he should not be made the scapegoat for it.

Hahahahahahahahahaha, was there anything more predictable than olisik picking up on this stat and running with it?

Yep - I thought Oliver was best on - and that's absolutely no slight on Hibberd who was awesome. Thought I was the only one though based on the votes thread.

Exactly. How is it since 2014?

Bloody Goodwin should have selected Pedersen - it was obvious Jake was going to do his shoulder in the first quarter.

That's a huge piece taken out of our defence though. I think I'd prefer to ruck nobody.

Pedersen might feel unlucky but "right to be peeved" is a bit rich. He's been playing AFL footy for 7 years as an honest toiler. If I were him I'd probably be grateful that I still had a job most people would dream about for the rest of the year.

In: Pedersen, Bugg, Lewis Out: Smith, Spencer, JKH. Pedersen to play sacrificial lamb in the ruck. Would also consider putting Oscar back in and playing Frost in the ruck, but I think that weakens us down back a bit. Bugg to come in as best VFL player. JKH not up to it.

6. Oliver - this guy. If he's not already the best player I've ever seen at the MFC, he's not far off. Only gets pinged for throws because the poor mere mortal umps can't see how fast his hands go. 5. Hibberd - looked good as soon as he appeared in play. Can kick and is tough. Set the bar pretty bloody high in his first game. 4. Hunt 3. Watts 2. Petracca - great effort when clearly lame. 1. Jones

Had the "sounds of the game" mic on tonight - first time I've ever heard it on a player who was clearly talking, directing and encouraging the whole time - be it on the ground or on the bench. Usually you just hear the "yeaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhs" after a goal and them calling for the ball. Gave Oliver a "that was your goal" after the Garlett goal, and regularly mentioned about going more direct rather than boundary hugging. He's still developing (cough... on a journey... cough) as a player, but there's no doubt he acts as a mouthpiece for the coach out there. That's at least one of the functions of the captain that he is performing.