58er

Read Maxy's book it's that type of book.

After all your fluffing around about form selection merit and now a more youthful team you are really only trying to get HUNTY and TOMMO included for HIBBO and TMAC. Trying to justify that by moving SALEM from defence ( prob 3rd best in GF side) to centre. (Or is that Panama Papers maybe). Salo is like Bowey fast and great disposal and links up well.from defence. It's not a better team yours or Panama Papers. with Tommo in as another tall that makes the backline too slow and tall. Hibbo ( or Hunt) are good size for medium/small types to mind Hibbo can play a bit taller in fact so can if fit Joel Smith. Rivers spot is not up for grabs he has a good record snd is strong courageous and is a great team man with good hand and foot disposal. Forward line without Tmac ( no his form after injury was not great but still better than Weids.) Different types of players Tmac has to have a strong defender on him and brings the ball to ground after a marking contest ( if he doesn't mark) for our smalls Kossie Spargs and ANB. and Weid is lucky to get his hands on the ball so our forward line lacks competitiveness. This also enables Fritta to get the 4 th defender. Jacko is agile and so is Gawny to rest in the forward pocket or roam at Will on the forward line. Our 7 and 9 goal bursts were when the opposition was worried about Maxy on the ball or Jacko, Tmac BBB as well as Fritta which tested them. It's all about team balance with our 3 smalls and Trac Clarry Sparrow and Harmsey plus Viney getting the hard ball out to our runners a fair portion of the time. There are the occasions we may need to go taller in defence Tmac can do that and Petty can go forward also to change things up. All bases are covered in other words. Tommo and Hunty will play in 2022 no doubt as I expect Hibbo could be playing his last season. But if things aren't broken don't fix them yet plenty of time for that as the season gets underway if needed.

Very good reason I left out Paul Prymke I didn't see him play many games than and IMO he was not around a long time. Not sure of Paul's games total but I don't think played many and he was not that good. Did WJ have him in his top100? Don't think so. Please enlighten me with facts if you have them on Paul Prymke.

Good debate Dee17.

Dee 56 I have followed the Dees since 1958 and have no real disagreement that Gary Hardemann was a very good CHB but to say he was our best ever Backman ( despite the Team of the Century) is what I don't endorse. For the following two reasons : 1. Gary was undersized as a KPD and could be out marked by taller opponents 2. tended to make the ball his object ( what footy is about and he was bloody good at obtaining it I admit) but he did give his opponent a chance (or a sniff ) to cause damage as they say. He did also provide great drive for us and was a very good CHF later in his career. A back man is there to mind his man so Gary might be the best footballer perhaps to play in defence in the last 50 years BUT David Neitz would be my best CHB ( probably our best KP player ever or since 1972, although he only played about 1/3 or 1/2 of his 300 plus games in defence before he excelled on the forward line for about 6/7 years. While we are on the topic David Schwartz would no doubt in my mind be the best KP player and forward and be in our top 3 players of all time but for his heartbreaking injury run that I also believe probably cost us a premiership in say 1998 as he was never the same. Also if we had Both Schwarta and Neiter today both fit as in 1994 I have no doubt that Neiter would be a KPD and Schwartz a KPF who with Gazza Jacko and Pike plus whiz and Charles might have got us over the line. Our defence has been always our bugbear either not big/good enough or tough enough and physically strong as well. Look at our Glory days teams defence and also our 2021 model and we are as tough as any Melb team that has triumphed since WW11. It has helped of course by our midfielders and wingers and forwards being as hard as nails in any contest. So are our smalls and in the 50/60's 95% ( maybe except for Jeff Tunbridge ) we were the toughest going around. ( Hawks and Lions also had this trait) and Cats and Tigers were hardly soft either. I also think that Doc Roet was a great CHB who only played about 70 games in the 60's but stood up in those games as a class and close defender of size and agility but was not around in 1972 of course. Tassie (Bob) could still be our best FB but is too early for the Top 100 since 1972. It's always hard judging players in different eras but champions are still champions even if they have not got that or those premiership medal/s. We are blessed know with possibly this new generation that in 5 years time many will no doubt be elevated from our Top 20 to our Top 10 from 1972. It's a hard job then comparing we hope this group if we become a dynasty to our immortal glory days heroes that very few of us were lucky enough to see only the last years or very small numbers of games excel in the Red and Blue.

Dees 2014 I suspect you have ruined your own argument by pointing out players you thought could have played in the GF but the selectors felt that Hunty was not fit enough or had the form and that Bowey's or Hibbo's form did earn selection. Also Tommo was not able to be considered due to injury. Nor was Joel Smith. To change the 23 players will have virtually only practice match form And training to assess any changes to the team. Have either Hibbo or say Bowey to date done anything wrong to deserve being dropped? What if they are all equal when the team selection for Round1. Categorically Hunty was unlucky but form in the end ( or fitness ) was the criteria for GF selection. There is no evidence since GF day that Hunty is a better player than Hibbo or Bowey and similarly that Tommo is better than Petty. Really if it ain't broke don't fix it. Unless the incumbents are really off form there is no reason to make a change or changes to 74 pt winning team. I also happen to think it's also just a preference for who the selectors believe is best suited to cover the opposition is the best guide but there is no more serious a guide than the GF. Those players answered every challenge on the big stage including the selection of Jordon and Sparrow who was very good in his career best game I reckon. Yes we have come a long way and have a great list but the very rules you laud about earning selection are exactly what I am supporting and as you have said will be followed by our selectors. Going on 2021 I don't think there is any real reason if all players are fit and have form there is no need to make any alteration given the even ability of the players under consideration. To name the same team ISNOT a message to our list that it's a boys club and we are resting on our laurels . It's exactly the opposite and says that all our 23 are fit and firing and ready to play in our first real test in 2022 to defend our Flag so hard won in 2021 by our total list including the 23 on the day. We are nit picking for reasons to make change it appears or totally believe one or two players are more really better or have improved dramatically over the proven members of the team who got the job done so magnificently. As I indicated there will be opportunities for changes during the season and about a dozen will come into that category and they will deserve their elevation and can make it just as hard for any other list member to take their place. Thats our criteria and long May it be!

I was there from GF eve to Wed the next week and universally the WA public ( along with visiting and local Dees fans) were very well treated and respected. Being a true AFL state you don't have to fight NRL fans about AFL for instance once you start mentioning footy as we know it!! I live in Brisbane BTW.

Read WJ in his Top 100 snd is he not also stating a probable well known fact in a different way. Demon 17 we don't live in an ideal world where rumours etc. are often true. My point about the same information in Brisbane is viewed far more seriously in Melbourne. Lethal was IMO not very discreet but I think he picked the time and place he felt to add to the transfer information. Proof in the pudding no one burnt by what he did.

Already "quite good" perhaps bl...y good by end of 2022.

We will have to agree to disagree DC .

Poor Jordon no matches to even keep his place!!

Agree Titan My point is that no one of the 23 have done anything ( or not done anything) to deserve being dropped. If we have no injuries and no genuine form issues all 23 deserve their chance of "immortality" even being enhanced on the night we unfurl our long awaited and astonishing Flag. The position of the 23 is that it's their spot to lose and a great effort only will be needed to break in yo the team. We all know deep down that their will be changes due to injuries and form snd Covid during the season especially as competition for spots appears the most contested ever for our team. 2022 can't come quick enough!

No it's a triple not 2 by back to back so 4 it is not 6.

Looking at it back to back is only 4 as indicated previously 3 is a three peat not 2back to backs You can't double count.

Angus is so highbrow isn't he at times !!!

No the issue was of six or four back to back snd it was 4 not six IMO.

Understand your point which is a good one but Lethal is a no nonsense person and tells it like it is! Maybe ok in Brisbane but not in Melbourne perhaps. BTW I saw Travis play this games for the skiing and reckon we still got the better out of him. What a player he would be with either Trac or Clarry or both now with our culture.

This just might be his year !! See his training photos looks by far the fittest ever and deserves a change of luck with his body. Time will tell but I am backing him in after 4 years of frustration !!! Such is our culture and competitiveness for spots.

With great respect to both Daniel and Kyle I believe that if their ages were reversed we would have gone for the younger player every time. Only my observation as it would not have worried me if we resigned both. Look at the training photos from yesterday and go back to Mid year 2021and see the difference in Turner. Big and more bulk no puppy fat now with a real footy players body to compete with.Also he has been doing running with Spargo extra workout so is very serious about this opportunity. Kerping the pressure on all the larger defenders is a good game to play and he deserves recognition for this alone.

Went back and had another look at toddy's Training photos. What I should have said was he ( Daniel Turner) looks more muscly and fitter and as indicated by DD lost his puppy fat.But overall he looks a bigger unit ready for some serious footy. Love the story how he has done extra work running etc. with Spargs. That's the great thing about our Club there is always a mate to help you go the extra mile. also Joel Smith looks by far the fittest he has been ever. The test will come when the real body work and match practice to see if his body can survive and give him a belated chance for a career in the defence in 2022. There are no vacancies now but it's amazing how they can in a full season esp. with Covid capers going on! He deserves a change of luck and this Year is his last chance. Another who looks much fitter is Rosman with a full first preseason under his body. May be the key to his form also with this base giving him confidence. Might also be the fact that one Blake Howes will be fighting like hell to challenge for a senior spot if one arises at any stage in our centreline. Wonder how much weights work JVR Howes Taj Juddy AMW are doing at this stage. If much at all. These players are really along with Dunstan starting their career but so much excitement as we look for more gems from the JT factory. Bring on a full Casey season so we can give these future players a decent chance of adjusting to an AFL Club already on its way to potentially its greatest modern period of sustained success.

Hibbo was his fittest since he joined us in 2017 last year and carried no extra weight at all and very good season by the end of year when the cards fell for him and not Hunty. Will still be handy this season to mind Martin snd Johanissen!!

WA would have had more concern for missing their BBL Scorchers games than the Test Match. They are only interested in WA not Australia for their sport and any thing they can divest themselves raft of Ceduna. But boy no boy were they not remarkable towards the AFL in 2021 and our Dees were very lucky to be the receiver of wonderful good Will and support from them in the month we stayed there as we bulldozed one and all to our magnificent 13 th Flag!! Thsnk you again WA.

I wouldn't be playing THOSE FOUR!!! all together as we get too tall and no one stays down. Refer Dogs first goal in the Granny!!! Either Petty or Tommo should be a no 3 tall defender then Hibbo (orJoel Smith if he earns it and we need a taller option) plus the balance including Riv Hunty Salo Bowery to mind mediums and smalls, depending upon the opposition. Greater balance ensures each player can stick to his role more easily. This assumes all players are playing at their best of course!

Actually Rand B realist I was at that game and clearly Cwood's win was largely due to their DELIBERATE and DI RECT low and hard approach into their forward line. Nothing chaotic about it.same game plan that Buckley upset us with in the last round in 2017, and caused us to miss the Finals. Be interesting to see if McRae learns from Buckley when we play them. Bowey should solve our small defender problem as Salem can also do that role if necessary and maybe Hunt. But those wanting May Lever Petty AND Tommo all in defence EACH WEEK have it wrong, occasionally yes if needed. Our balance is best suited with 3 talls plus a selection of Riv Hibbo Salo Hunt and Bowey and I imagine others like Deakyn Smith and Judd McVee will aspire to join the AFL's best defence of the last 50 years.! No holes in this Dyke like defence.!!!

Swap Jordon for med sub and Dunstan for mid duties with Majak and Laurie. Taj Will I hope be played on the ball but he is a versatile option. Love JVR on the forward line!!