Rodney (Balls) Grinter

Umpires have F U C K E D this game

Umpires are a discrace.

This game is gigged

Great sides are full of vanilla players that play the team game. Besides, I don't think either of them are vanilla anyway. Josh is hard and tough-as, which is exactly how we should be playing and I've been pretty impressed with Cory's skills. Time will tell.

I would also like to see him get a game Drunkn, but for now I'd rather he kept developing his form and game at Casey and banning the door down for senior selection. I fear that if he is bought into our current unsettled side, he could become a whipping boy and scapegoat for a possibly bad team performance. Also a need to give Weid a good chance to establish himself within the side and I'd be confident given our present match committee's policy that Declan would be given similar opertunity when his time comes. Liked what I saw of Declan during JLT and just love it when those from the less well trodden pathway into AFL, but full of desire and determination make it as players.

Agree 100% Why it took so long astounds me. It ain't rocket science is it.

Except I don't think the bomb it long to a contest every time is actually the game plan Goodwin and Co have been trying to get us to play all along. Late last year the players started talking about lowering the eyes more headding inside 50, then started executing that well and that's when we played some of our best footy in the run home and the first few weeks of finals. I actually think the bomb it long to a contest is an undesired interim state of our game plan when we are not executing right, rather than the desired intent of the game plan.

Quite happy with the in's this week. The key things I think Josh Wagner certainly offers is hardness and good defensive intent. He is also quite quick and willing to take that game on creatively by foot. I thought Cory Wagner was pretty stiff to be dropped from our Rd.1 performance to be honest. Won enough of the ball as a defender and I thought his use of it was pretty good too.

Completely get your perspective about the difference in levels between full blown cyber bullying and what would more accuratly be described as character assassination or harassment, but personally, I think acceptance of one somewhat opens the door to the other. Why should socioty accept that it's ok to openly and publicly degrade others just because it's electronically communicated and not in person or on a more regulated form of media. I think the point of the MFC campaign is to encourage people to self regulate, but I think we also need to stand up and demand that the social media giants lift their game as well. Far from encouraging civil interactions between their users, the social media giants actually quite actively tolerate a high level of anti-social behavior on their platforms, because it often results in higher levels of interaction with their 'service', which they can then use to sell to their advertisers. It's a rotten unethical business model which needs to be rectified.

Must we set such a low standard for what is considered acceptable abuse of someone. I'm no prude, but I can understand why such abuse online could be more damaging than say a few non-racial expletives hurled over the fence during the heat of battle. In my view it's time Facebook, Twitter and the like faced up to their responsibilities and applied far more heavy handed approach to censorship on their platforms to stamp out what is more anti social, abusive behavior than the social interaction they proport to enable and promote. These platforms can and do set their own terms and conditions, so they shouldn't feel constrained by an obligation to enable totally free speach. Though I sometimes mildly loath the low threshold applied to abusive language here on Demonland, that means I can't use words like [censored], without it being censored, I also respect and appreciate the level of moderation applied to significantly limit the anti social abuse of those in the broader football comunity and my fellow posters. Facebook, Twitter etc could learn a lot from the Demonland moderators about how to conduct an ethical and responsible social media platform.

BTW, I think it's fairly unthoughtful of some on this thread to be so outright dismissive of the cyber bullying problem. Many who level hurtful comments at others on social media get to do so with a cloak of anonymity or the safe distance that being on the end of a keyboard puts them from their target. Such anonymity isn't afforded to the players on the receiving end of a barrage of such hurtful comments, the scale of which the ordanary person will never likely experience. I could well imagine that after a while or even in a moment of emotional vulnerability the effect of social media comments could become deeply personal. I know I have personally made some less than nice comments about individual players etc on this forum and this short clip from the players as well as the broader conversation around hatered and toxic language used on Facebook being discussed right now has given me some food for thought as to how I could do better at times. Similarly in the context of young people, the ease at which bullying could be amplified to a much broader audience with social media and intrude on life 24/7 beyond the school yard compared to in days gone by is quite scary. All well and good to say just stay off it, but social exclusion is a form of bullying in it's own right. When rightly or wrongly 'social' media is the medium for socialisation between young people today, anbsence from that platform is to be somewhat socially excluded. I'm quite proud that the AFL has taken a stand on social issues of importance in Australian society, think there is a role for it to play given the prominent part Aussie Rules plays in Australian culture and I hope it continues to lead on social issues.

Well after 10+ years of being on the butt end of beltings, getting smoke blown up their proverbial all off season and now promptly being cut down at by many after just two games, you would hope that the MFC have developed some good resilience over the years and have strategies to deal with the kind of Fugazi that comes with our territory. How good would it be if we can run through that banner on Friday night, symbolically smashing through the negativity of the past and turn around our 2019 seasons fortunes and decades wallowing in the mire. We can only know for sure in retrospect and it's totally in the hands of those pulling on the red and blue jumpers, but I dare to dream. COME ON THE MIGHTY DEMONS Look forward and act with the ethos of big Jimmy "Whatever it takes"

The guy whow is available that would really like to see in the side that is Petty. He has competed well and looked sound defensively and good offensively as well. But I don't think now is the time to bring him in. I think we need to give the core of the side time to settle and build cohesion and cofidence otherwise we are just making it hard for the rest of the guys that are in there to find any system if key personal keep changing. Rightly or not, I get the impression that Oscar is seen as a bit of a general in the backline, so taking him out of that when we are somewhat in chaos could be a recipe for disaster. Added to that it wouldn't be great for Petty's confidence and development to be bought into a side under siege. I'd give it another few weeks and hopefully once we get rolling more again, I recon we could even bring in Petty as the third tall option (depending on how long May is out for) and let each of our key backs make their case for a continued spot in the side from there. I wouldn't be averse to bringing back May and Lever through the VFL either - bringing back underdone players too fast has killed us over the last few years.

Anyone calling for Frost to be dropped has got rocks in their head as far as I'm concerned. Whilst I haven't watched the game again with a completely calm mind since Saturday, I thought he was our best key position back by a long way. Was good one on one, picked his times well when to leave his man to make another contest, provided good run without over extending himself (and getting caught) and played within his capability to hit good targets by foot. He also applied some good spoils on the last lines of defense. Comparitively I found Steven May somewhat underwhelming, even before he came off injured (was May carrying something all along? Who knows). I'm sure there were some times when Frost got caught out in no-mans-land, but I don't think he can be responsible for that when we played such poor team defense. Our mids had a feild day offensively and in tight, but our two way running was woeful. I forget how many times we were outnumbered 2 or 3 to 4 or 5 - that goal Tomahawk handballed back was the epitome of that.

But then the AFL and AFLPA reduduced the player/club contact hrs even further this year. Add that to our injuries. I'm not looking for excuses, more so that it provides hope that we will dramatically improve our form over the next few weeks. I still remember how many wrote us off last year after the late season losses to Geelong and Sydney, only for us to go on and convincingly beat West Coast and GWL to lock in a solid top 8 position. Zip and 5 would be hard to make much of a season out of (although didn't Sydney make a GF from there a few years back?), but if we can scratch out a few wins from the next 4, then we give ourselves a fighting chance to have a good back end of 2019.

Love it. Great analogy.

Understand this is the Petracca thread, but my point is that in the current context, why does Petracca deserve his own thread and the others not. If the rest of the forwardline was performing well and he was the odd one out in not providing the expected output, then I'd understand. But that's not the case and thus I think it's quite unfair to single one player out above others. It's a saviour mentality that people expect him to carry the team on his back and be a match winner whilst the rest of the team around him plays like rubbish, all before he has really yet to establish himself with that level of capacity. Players take time to develop and mature. Anyone seriously consider that we should trade him should ask themselves - should Richmond have traded out Dustin Martin in the years prior to him fully asserting himself on the competition when he was showing the occational flash of brilliance, but not providing a consistent level of output expected of a player of his physical attributes.

Thanks. Yes I knew that. VFL/state league. It's a really vexed issue really, there have been some great players recruited from the state leagues in recient years. Kelly from Geelong is a star and I think AVB would be seen in a similar light if he could just stay uninjured.

Totally agree. Like you, I don't nessasrily think the solution is to drop Patracca, which will just shift one of the opposition's best defenders onto one of our even lesser capable and lesser experienced players. The other point I'd make is that why is this conversation focused just on Patracca, when the output of guys like T Mac, Weid, ANB. Melksham has been just about our only forward to provide good output. I think part of the answer is that our whole forward system is a shambles at the moment and the other part is that it's not just Patracca.

I don't have a problem with us recruiting some of the top notch ones like Hannan, Freitch and AVB, it's some of the more speculative ones like T Smith, Hore and Keilty that I wounder if they are taking the spot of a younger player with more potential, but under developt/under achieved during their U18 time, like a fast outside version of James Harmes. I think at the moment we are particularly missing the pace, marking ability and opportunist goal sense of Hannan. Contrary to my concerns about Keilty, from what I understand, he is about the only key position type we have a the moment that is showing any real form. Sometimes you are dammed if you do and dammed if you don't. The one I'd question the most up to this point is Hore. A VFL best and fairest suggests that he could well be at or close to league standard, but we have a realitive abundance of backline talent, when you consider Lever on the comeback and Petty quietly developing into a quality player. It's all good to recruit the best available player in the draft, but if you rarely/never recruit based on need, then sooner or later you will have needs that are unforfilled.

Well, that was a filthy night at the office. Felt like we had worked our way back into the game in the second quarter, but the writing was on the wall for us when guys like T Mac, Melksham and Freitch miss relatively straight forward goals they would gobble up 80% of the time. Doesn't help when Geelong ended up with 25 free kicks to 12, including a very dubious 50m penalty to them. I really don't feel like the scoreboard reflected our performance tonight. It wasn't a great performance by us, but we weren't that bad either. Positives for me were our midfeild was dominant and most of our backs were ok. I thought Frosty put in a pretty decient game today. Forward line with the exception of Melksham was pretty bloody ordanary though to say the least. I don't think Sparrow is quite ready yet and needs to go back down to Casey for a bit. Nibbler has been practicality non existent, Weid and Tommy have been struggling big time. Pattraca had a stinker. I don't think we can drop too many at once, because all of a sudden, our forward stocks are pretty slim pickings through injury and form. From the Casey report, it sounds like Stretch deserves a game, so I'd like him back in the side, perhaps for Sparrow or Nibbler and then shuffle a few around. Our forward line looks very stagnant and is missing good delivery. I'd like to see one or both of Freitch and Hunt down their. Would also like Salem to push forward more, but don't think we can afford to loose his delivery out of our back half. Honestly, this game felt a lot like the Hawthorn loss of last year. It was a bad loss in it's own right, but I don't think we are that far off the pace. Just need to chalk up a few wins for some confidence and to stay in the Hunt.

6. Oliver 5. Brayshaw 4. Viney 3. Melksham 2. Gawn 1. Frost

Let's go DEMONS. Ive got a good feeling about this game.

For the most part, I think there is a big difference between my respect for the ex-players in the media that have and haven't coached. So easy for these good ex-players to spout their gobs off about the issues with team performance when they haven't coached and don't actually know or have the skills, experience and application to influence team performance. I haven't heard guys like Paul Roos going all panic stations over one or two games. As Goody says Fugazi. I have faith that our coaching brains trust have dissected the actual factors most influencing our relative under performace and have put in place strategies to address them and it won't just be "stop being soo soft".

Gee I loved the way Wheels played. We did have a few great tough players in that era - Todd Viney, Leoncelli, Rigoni, Junior Mac, Davey. Nathan 'Doggy' Brown was one of my favorites as well.