Rodney (Balls) Grinter

I was hoping for much better impact from big Preussy these last two games. Part of the disappointment and the issue I think is that he isn't holding his marks as well as he did in his stints earlier in the season and even in the game against Carlton he took a handful of big strong grabs around the ground that he hasn't done the past two weeks. For me I think it's two fold: 1. He's now being targeted and closer checked by defenders when he presents as a forward option as there isn't a T Mac or Weid to take the best two key backs; 2. As a result of 1. he's lost a bit of confidence in his marking ability and is fumbling his marks around the ground when he has more time space and body size advantage to clunk them. Not a lost cause by any stretch to me and I think the more AFL games we can get into him over the next 5 games to develop, better pick up the pace and elivated intensity compared VFL the better he will be next year.

Disagree with your assessment of Max's early days there Neil. I always thought he looked quite coordinated and footy smart for a guys his size. I think it was more injuries, as well as a lack of endurance (physical and mental) to maintain the required level of intensity over whole games that kept Max from having the impact he is as a player now earlier in his career.

Great fight back. Viney playing a great game. Fritta doing a top job up forward. Jetta getting amongst it as is Harmes. Brilliant move Lewis up forward (who ever would have thought). Have been quite happy with Corey Wagner's game so far as will.

So Freitch being held - play on.

The umpiring isn't a non issue. Alot of very borderline free kicks to them, whilst any for us the same - play on. Complete BS

I think that's a somewhat inaccurate assessment of our performance Vs GWS. They would have been trying pretty hard to win I recon: 1. What team wants to go into an elimination final against a team they just lost to {I think that was one of the scenarios}; 2. Whilst top 4 might have been unlikely/out of the equation, GWS were still playing at least for the guarantee of a home final.

Fair call, but I think alot of us are over the pepetual pessimism and self flagellation (well maybe not all on this last part). It's bad enough watching the teams performances this season without having to convince ourselves that we are even more pathetic an unworthy of last year's finals apperance. I do think the question was framed in the most negative way possible though and it's not such a simple issue. Should beating Geelong and Hawthorn in finals be counted because they were games against top 8 sides or should they be discounted, because although they made finals, they turned out to be pretty meek opponents on the day(night). Likewise while Adelaide were technically top 8 when we played them (thumped them) perhaps that too was artificial as they turned out to have a stinker of a season, somewhat helped by what we started. Do we actually discount the West Coast win because they were down some of their stars (Kenedy and Darling mid game, although we were also down Hogan). For me the GWS game was probably the highlight, with two in form teams pushing for the best top 8 position and we beat them convincingly. I do think that last season we turned one corner in mental maturity, but consistently beating the teams below us that we should have beaten, but that in previous years we would have lost to via a combination of complacency, lapses in intensity/concentration and then shittting our pants when the came at us. Winning all those games against the lesser sides was what mostly got us to finals. I think this year we have succumbed to a combination of injuries, mental/emotional fatigue, game plan and lack of maturity. We really need the offseason to reset those things. Moving forward next season, I think we do need to go through that next phase in our development of beating the genuine top 8 sides. I think this has to come with a further maturing of mental application. I think we have both a lack of confidence, of being able to produce sustained effort in games and being able to sense when to attack and defend against the mature sides. Last season for instance, we absolutely smashed Hawthorn in the first quarter of the home and away, but then gave back that lead far too easily and in the end let them play all over us, when we dropped our heads completely and they asserted their dominance. Part of that all was lack of defensive effort, but part of it I think was us also being overawed by the team and the situation. I suspect that it works both ways too, in so far as genuine teams have a sense that we are gettable even when they are being beaten and that keeps them mentally in the game and/or in a position to exploit it if they get on top. This is the sort of leadership issue that having someone like Lewis around should have addressed, but our players now need reconise it for themselves, step up and make the changes within themselves over the seasons ahead. I don't think it is something that Goodwin can significantly influence as these swings within games that we need to address happen within quarters when the coaches now have very little chance of addressing via the runner.

Some of Hunt's defensive pressure and run down work has also been pretty decient at times and has created scoring opertunities for us, but I'm also left feeling like I want more from him in this regards, but perhaps he has been assigned a more offensive role and/or perhaps I greedy, although applying manic defensive pressure in forward lines has become the new black and something that every player needs to excell at for teams to suceeed it would seem.

I want a pair of the rose colored glasses you have Dazzle. Petty only actually took five marks, had 8 kicks and my perception was that he didn't actually provide that much of a target. Don't get me wrong, I have high hopes for Petty, largely based on some things he showed in a few preseason games for us this year. To be honest though, I've found his AFL performances to be somewhat underwhelming and I'm not about to jump on the group think band wagon that his game against the Dogs was some kind of break out game. I suspect that against the Dogs alot more defensive work would have been put into the likes of Petracca, Preuss, Hunt and Hannan than Petty and I don't there is that much chance of him reproducing anything like the same efforts on the scoreboard againsts West Coast as he did last week. A properly fit Tim Smith or Sam Weideman will provide more output than Petty. I agree that based on Hannans game on Sunday you would drop him, and that I'm largely picking him based on previous proven form, but my veiw is that you still need some players down there that know how to play that half forward position and I'm somewhat backing Hannan to regain his past form. He has shown glimpses of his former self to me, particularly against the Lions a few weeks back. We don't have the luxury of a heap of fit, in form AFL standard players to replace Hannan's role at the moment. I think the closest would be Baker, but I'm not entirely sure he would do much better than Hannan right now either. Just my thoughts.

Yeah, that was a bit of a brain faid. Was meant to be Out ANB... got confused by all the initials and hyphenated last names.

In: Corey Wagner, JKH and Weid or T Smith if 95% fit; Out: Dunckley, JKH and Petty contingent on Weid/T Smith; Dunkley just isn't there yet and it's poor for team morale to keep preferencing him over others that are performing in the VFL IMHO and we can't afford players that are not providing more output at AFL level right now; JKH keeps putting in the performances at VFL level and deserves one last opportunity to see if he can translate that to AFL level; It might seem harsh to demote Petty after kicking 3 goals for us last week, but whist it offered some encouragment, I honestly wasn't over the moon impressed by it. Tim Smith or Sam Weideman offer much more as key forward targets and Tim Smith for his greater strength and defensive presence in the forward line. It might also seem silly not to drop Hannan, who I admit is on very thin ice, but again, I think he actually offers much more forward smarts and speed than Petty.

Talking of which I wounder what the odds would have been for the MFC to finish bottom 4 this season back in January?

Although his season has been puntuated by injury and patches of poor form, I think I've also seen overall progress from Weid and the more games we have got into him at senior level I feel he is starting to rise to the challenge of being the second key target. Although he did miss that crucial goal against the Crows, I felt that he really did stand up, create a presence and make a difference in the last half of that game that nearly helped us hold onto that game.

From the small sample size I've seen thus far, since he has got himself right, I've been very impressed with Steven May and I think in the context, we can put that down as a little victory. With T Mac gone, too many other forwards either injured or out of form and such poor connection between our onballers and forwards, I don't have high expectations of us consistently being able to kick a wining score for the rest of the season. However, now that we have a pretty solid back six together, my hope is that at least those guys can get some good cohesion between themselves over what remains of the year. It may (pardon the pun) not provide too much cheer this year, but if we can achieve getting our backline bedded down and purring, then I think that would provide a pretty solid basis to start moving forward again next season.

In my view, Patracca's solid and consistent run of form amongst the carnage has been a big positive. Yes, he desperately needs to fix his mid range goal kicking, buy asides from that, I think he has been very workman like in his approach to keep presenting and bulldozing his way out of packs to often create forward movement for the team where the ball would otherwise have gone nowhere. Once the team gets it's act together around him, I can genuinely envisage thay he will start splitting games open at times. It's hard for him to have the same impact at the moment, when his performances and potential contributions are being dragged down by the team performance around him. Similarly, I really think Hunt has been very good particularly when measured by his consistency across the season and I also think his set shot goal kicking has improved the longer the season has gone on.

If only Gil the dil and his cronies weren't getting paid the millions of dollars they do at the expense of the everyday punters.

I don't think the AFL would want to bring the football world into disrepute by doing that. I think even they are attuned enough to realize that big Maxy would have the weight of the football public behind him on this one.

That incident in particular really infuriated me. It was clear the umpires changed their interpretation on the rule and were out to clamp down and get Max on that rule that day. So poorly managed. Instead of some kind of mid week or pre game breifing, they just unleashed on game day to the clear disadvantage of Max and the MFC. Was absolutely disgusting. The AFL play such favorites when there are these interpretations on the fringes that impact on and/or are taken advantage of by certain players. Think Selwood milking head high tackles for years and Buddy Franklin being able to run off the line during his approach to goal because of his 'natural arc'. #freemax #itsruckcraftbigboy

Or maybe we get him to nominate for the ruck in a pea heart little voice or wink to the umpires and get gifted a free kick in front of goal like Dangerfield at the cattery last season - that one might have just about cost us have cost us a top 4 finish. Slimy bloody turd that Dangerfield.

I don't think that's actually a bad thing if it has the intended effect. Don't need these tiggy touch wood free kicks determining outcomes. Perhaps it would actually be a better mechanism to use in the Max incident i.e. " I noticed you used your arm there to hold him out, if you do it again, I'm going to pay a free kick for a block" ...but perhaps that's just me being too sensible. #freemax

I agree with parts of what you are saying here Ding. The connection with forwards (or lack there of) could definitely be a contributer, as could the near continuous inconsistency of personal, but it's not like we even seem to start moving the ball confidently ouT of stoppages at the moment, which the forwardline is less responsible for, although possibly something being overlooked was Jessie Hogan's ability to get up the ground and provide an 'out' from our defence. I'd also have complete confidence in 2018 Hannan to win the ball and use it well, but not so much 2017 Hannan. This lack of confidence and clean ball use has become like an infection and it's really hard to stop the rot at this point in the season when we are comming up against settled teams full of confidence and system when we are struggling to get back up off the deck. Does make me wonder though - were is the emphasis on manic tackling pressure which requires little confidence.

I really do think the role of our injuries is being under played in the assessments of our performance on Sunday against the Dogs. I was just reflecting this morning how rotten our luck with injuries has been this year. Hardly a week goes by where we have not had to have made forced changes due to players going out with injuries. No sooner do we get players back than we get lumped with another handful of players we loose with realitively unavoidable injuries. Just take the last fortnight for example Hore (collar bone), T Mac (new knee injury), Weid (something or another) - I'm not sure that any of these injuries could have been avoided in the standard rough and tumble of the AFL, yet we just seem to keep copping more than our fair share them. I'd imagine that if T Mac had been in our forward line in the sort of form he had finally got him self back into, Hore had have played in place of an under done Jetta and Weid had played in place of either a raw Dunckley or scratchy Hannan, it probably would have been enough for us to have beaten the dogs and we would all have a somewhat/slightly different outlook on where the team is presently at. That all said, adding those aforementioned players back into the side would have unlikely changed the way we moved the ball through the middle of the ground, which for the most part I found to be pretty uninspiring and lacking in confidence and dominance. It also needs to be taken into consideration that the Dogs were a rotation out for most of the game after loosing McLean early on. All in all, I'm not completely dispondant about what our present performances mean for our potential in 2020, because our year has and continues to be wrecked by injury, but I am finding it hard to find many positives from the procession of mediocre performances that is all we seem destined to produce for the rest of the season. I guess now I'm just hoping to see some more games and development in the likes of Petty, Press, Weid, Hore, Dunkley, the settling of our back six and that we can have one hell of a reset in the offseason. It's not exactly that I don't think we shouldn't be playing to win, but more of an acceptance for now that many more wins not might be that practically achievable between now and the end of the season with the injury and form backlog we have built for ourselves and the likelihood of being able to peg much of that back between now and the end of the season.

Lucifer, think your assessment of ANB's potential contribution to the team is a bit narrow really. When he was in form over 2017 & 2018, ANB did provide some good connection through the middle of the ground and his ability to gut run and get out the back into our forward line was often a good additional avenue to goal for us. Out of all the players effected by the 6-6-6 rule change I think ANB has been effected probably most as he was often used very effectively as one of those 'spitters' running through off the back of the centre square at centre clearances. I don't see any present indications that the 6-6-6 rule will removed any time soon, so he simply must adjust and it's fair to say that he hasn't thus far, but neither has most of the team. On his present form, I don't think ANB would have as much currency as Tyson or Kent had at the time they were traded and I don't sense that he is the sort of player to go seeking greener pastures, particularly since he has always been given a pretty reasonable opportunities at the MFC. I'd reluctantly be looking to move on the likes of Stretch, probably Maynard and possibly JKH long before I started looking at ANB. With a pick in the 60s, all we are most likely to get is another 18yo that might or might not be a decient player in 3 or 4 years time, when our priority should be about mature players that can deliver and/or provide depth for the club now.

Agree. Last year when he (and the rest of the team) were in form, he was better than just depth though. These calls to trade him are grossly wrong though IMHO: 1. Trading him now would be like trading him out at the bottom of the market value; 2. What would we get for him? A pick in the 60s? Best case scenario would be that he could be a sweetener to go along with us trading out a decient draft pick for a player like Langdon. 3. In a season where we have been exposed for depth, doesn't that highlight the need to actually have it.

I can't defend either Hannan or ABN's games yesterday, although I would say over the past 4 weeks I have thought Hannan has been OK and I thought his 2 goal effort against the Lions was pretty good. At times over the past 4 weeks, I have thought Hannan was running himself into some form, but yesterday's game goes against that. To be totally honest, I'm not sure that Kyle Dunckley is exactly getting games on merit at the moment either. Sure I have seen him doing a few smart things that show he could be a decient prospect in seasons to come, but too little output overall from his games thus far for me. Guys like Spargo have been criticized on this forum and dropped from the side after showing a lot more than Dunkley has to date in my assessment. That said I'm not totally against us getting a few senior games into some of these guys in our present position, but it is hardly ideal.