stevethemanjordan

You're crazy and you don't read posts properly. I enjoyed the win as much as anyone.

Where'd you read it? Richmond supporters forum? Or Melbourne supporters forum?

He was/is the worst of the lot of them.

More than just a line-breaker which is what has surprised me most. Has an appetite for the contest which I didn't know and also isn't afraid to fly for a mark. Also quite composed in close and under pressure with ball in hand. They're great signs, means the kid backs himself and is confident in his ability. The only thing that may hold him back is his disposal by foot. Up and under when going forward and is clearly his weak-link. No idea how much it can be improved. I think similarly to McDonald it's a technique thing more than a decision making thing. Players like that can generally clean up mistakes and mask their technique flaws by making better decisions on where and to whom to kick to. Hopefully he continues to play well, am enjoying his development.

Again, don't like raining on parades but I hope people realise part of the reason we were able to do so much scoreboard damage after half-time was because of the following: Rosa and Sexton both played no part in the game after mid-way into the second quarter which hugely affected their rotations. Prestia and Miller were also unable to play at 100 percent because of injuries. Miller was almost hobbling around with his ankle. That's a significant chunk of their midfield and I know there'd be supporters using that as an excuse as to why we'd been so comprehensively beaten had we been at the receiving end. Perspective. Plenty of positives obviously. Even contribution of effort and buy-in. Great tackling pressure and ferocity at the ball. But clearly plenty to work on. For one, our ability to continually keep teams in the game due to turnovers in our back-half remains a concern and if it happens too often against a team like the dogs we are absolutely no chance. Salem is still so important to that back group simply because of his decision making and kicking skills. So surely he comes in. Having Dunn and Garland coming in and out of the team at their age concerns me majorly. We can't seem to get any sort of rhythm going with our two KP defenders and I reckon it makes the entire back six look wobbly. I consistently see bad decision making and dumb positioning. Hard to drop Garland as he didn't really get to see enough of the ball down there. Checked his man as blokes of his experience should do and played tight. Handball in the first quarter just baffled me. Still don't understand how someone who has played for that long continues to make errors like that. If it were a one off it would be fine. He seems to have a habit of doing something like that every game. Salem a definite in and Michie unlucky. If Dunn tears it up today, I'd rather see him back in over Garland.

It's getting interesting. At the beginning of the year I was all for a player like Prestia to come to the club and whilst I haven't completely changed my mind, I do think that there are some rather glaringly obvious weaknesses positionally speaking that certain players would be able to fill and I'm not sure Prestia is on of those. The next layer for our squad is to inject one or two quality two-way outside/power runners who are skilled and they obviously won't come cheap. Prestia has a lot of things going for him as a player who excels at stoppages and clearances. But last night all but confirmed we have the best crop of young clearance and stoppage mids within the AFL. I'm starting to think the money could be better spent if there is someone who could really add to what we're crying out for. Then again, I wouldn't complain if we landed Dion. (Jeez Maxy was really getting into him last night in a physical way).

This is the type of game where we'll allow a bloke like Wright to dominate. We seem to play these guys into some sort of form.

Solid post and fair points.

Like others, I have no idea why we'd drop Dunn and Frost given Gold Coast have 2 x 200 cm tall forwards and we play a defensive zone which only gives those guys more of an advantage... Dunn is taller than Garland and Frost is too. How many times is Roos going to pull the 'in hindsight we probably made an error by selecting him' line? He has now done it with Lumumba by stating that they shouldn't have played him last week. WTF? Does he understand how unprofessional he sounds given this is a repeat offence and we're only six rounds into a season? It only amplifies my concern about this week's selections. Truly baffled. The midfield will be where it's won obviously. But again, if we're out-marked and bodied simply because of a lack of height in defence, I'm going to have issues.

The answers do become tiresome. But that's because the questions are tiresome. Matt Burgan asks questions that result in answers like that unfortunately. The better the questions, the better the answers.

There's no big thing and I'm far from offended. Others have shared views about the 'aesthetics' of the jumpers even if they didn't say what you did about Cyril. I'm just saying clearly ya'll are missing the point. The designs hold stories which are why they're made and I'm not sure that everyone knows that. Because if they did, I can't imagine there'd be the same response in regards to the 'aesthetic' of the jumper.

Good OP though. Mine are as follows: 1 : A more settled back-line. Clearly we're shuffling cards which is not ideal during the H&A season. I doubt any of the coaches thought Garland would be dropped two games into the season nor would they think this zone-defence would cause as many issues as it has. Not only that, it's an area in which our worst runners are almost all situated. Jetta, Dunn, Salem, Garland and Wagner. They all need to be a helluva lot fitter. Especially those who play HB. We are low on quality KP backmen and we have a host of players vying for a HB position. Clearly it's the most unsettled area of the ground. I still think we need one experienced HB flanker who can kick really well and is a really hard runner. And we need Hurley. I want him. 2: Outside run in through the middle of the ground. Look at any top side and they have really hard line breaking outside players who we just don't have. Very one-dimensional midfield in terms of pace which is why it's no surprise the same names slice us to pieces when we come up against them. Steven, Harvey, Christensen, Kelly, Scully, Hill etc etc. 3: Ruck backup/Forward Ruckman. Clearly if Gawn goes down, we are in big trouble.

Sometimes I reckon you think the AFL is like unders' footy and it's weird. These blokes get paid for their ability. It's more than evident that our Ruck stocks are extremely weak and that we can do a lot better than what we currently have in regards to upgraded talent. Your view of what is required to win a Grand Final within an elite competition is borderline crazy. List changes will continue. Spencer is another whose place on the list is not in jeopardy only because we have nobody else at the present time. But I'm sure that'll be addressed in the not too distant future. You said the same shite when McKenzie, Bail, Nicholson etc were running around in our best 22 and judging by what you continue to say, you'd still have them on the list because 'they compete'.

Each jumper design tells a story, (literally) and so aesthetic 'appeal' becomes secondary and almost a moot point for Indigenous round... So in that way, they're all great. The fact that posters think Cyril would be 'screaming internally' wearing something that details his proud heritage is humorous and completely misses the point of why these custom jumpers are made for Indigenous round.

I don't think anyone is disputing that we had a young side in, as we did the previous two weeks. However I refuse to say the loss came down to 'inexperience'. That's just garbage. Conceding seven goals with such ease is not solely down to inexperience. Dunn, McDonald and Lumumba have plenty of experience they all had really poor games. Not average. Poor. Pederson had his worst game for the year, Vince refused to play tough footy and Dom Tyson wasn't near it. Sure some of those players are still young and so off days are forgivable. The trend is there. We have players, including senior ones who are far too inconsistent in their output. The difference between McDonald's best and worst is far too great. The difference in Dunn's best and worst is far too great. The list goes on. It's the number one contributing factor as to why we still have what many supporters would call 'Melbourne moments'. We saw it with Frawley, Howe, Jamar, Bail, Grimes etc etc and with Garland who is playing ressies. Over a career at AFL level, the hope for all clubs is that the players who last the longest on AFL lists are the ones who will be the most consistent performers at their clubs. And if you look all around, you'll see that all other clubs have them. This has been the norm for all AFL clubs excluding ours which is another reason why we've been the laughing stock. We have one home grown player who fits the description. One. Nathan Jones. Jesse is part of a new breed who everyone is hoping will buck this trend at the MFC and I'm sure he'd be excited at the thought of what they could achieve together. However, I also strongly believe that he'd look at guys like Dunn and McDonald on their underperforming days and question whether or not these more senior guys have the ability to help carry the club also. As for the satisfaction comment. He is 21. Frawley was 27 when he left I'm pretty sure and went to the flag favourite who had just won back-to-back. Very different. Jesse would have a myriad of clubs to choose from unlike Frawley and lists with just as much talent and much better leaders. Jesse will not leave because of a 'loss'. He'd leave because of the perpetual underperforming of senior and experienced figures that have contaminated the club for years.

He was both. Caught out at times and unaccountable at times because he is lazy and unfit.

No, that's the trouble. I wouldn't say Melksham is known for his 'smarts'. What he'd definitely offer is really hard two-way running as a back-flanker who can rotate through the middle but again his skills aren't much chop. Really, I just see a mess in the way that our defence is playing with this zoning. It seems that the 'roles' of our players have now been confused as we have so many players covering the arses of of each other when the ball comes inside defensive 50. Dunn, McDonald and Jetta all play their best football when assigned a single opponent. All of them. I think adding both Hunt and Wagner is unsettling. They're both really inexperienced. It's just really messy.

Nice observations. I just posted in the 'leaking defence' thread and have similar worries. I don't believe he is the kind of player who should have the licence to run off his opponent to try and setup play in the future because of what you identify. He is far too hit and miss with his disposal and it's double trouble for a KP defender turning it over up field as their man will more than likely end up with the ball. With where our defence is presently, it's clear he's been allowed to play that role because he is the fittest bloke at the club and we have nobody else besides Lumumba who creates the same run and attack from defence. Salem, Jetta, Dunn, Garland etc are nowhere near as fit as they need to be. It's an area that I've wanted filled for years. A hard running and skillful half-back. Salem could be the player but he is far too unfit. Will be interesting to see what the coaches have planned for next year.

Zone defence requires fairly smart individuals. Understanding positioning, when and where to run and cover and when not to. When to go on the counter, when to switch play and when to hold. In all honestly I believe we're trying to play a system with blokes who simply don't have the attributes to master it. Of course it takes time but I've seen enough brain fades from Dunn and McDonald in my time to know that they're not players who are suited to playing a zone defence. Everyone is forgiven for an error or turnover. But not time and time and time again. Etihad is a fast deck. We're not a fast team and generally we're not the most skilled side and our defenders are pretty reactionary and slow. It's a problem no doubt and what doesn't help is that fact that we don't have a settled back-six. It's the most unsettled part of the ground at the moment. All of these weaknesses were highlighted on the weekend. Garland and Grimes are both playing reserves who like Dunn and T-Mac are just so up and down in form. Wagner and Hunt haven't played six games between them. Lumumba just had his worst game for the club and Salem has been handy but hardly inspiring. It's definitely a worry and I'm interested in knowing what the plan will be going forward and into next year also.

You are right, he lined up on Bruce from the start. But he wasn't always on him. For whatever reason, the way we press up as a defensive group and the way we zone means that on the counter, our guys quite often are caught out trying to cover multiple players. And I saw that with Dunn on a number of occasions. I saw Dunn on Roo a number of times throughout the day too as well as 5 goal Membrey. (Still can't believe we allowed a player like Membrey kick 5). If Dunn was truly playing so well, why was he moved forward toward the end of the game as Stu says? Clearly we struggled defensively as a group but also individually which is evidenced by that move.

Dunn like McDonald and others as part of this rotating defence circus handled multiple opponents during the game so again, forget looking at Bruce's stats. He was pretty unaccountable for the most part, incredibly sluggish, clumsy and persisted with bombing the ball down the line to no great effect. When was the last time he ran during pre-season? Does he just refuse to do running at training?

He won't and shouldn't be dropped simply because he is our biggest body back there and we have nobody to replace him with. Garland and O-Mac are hardly in-form. However, the guy has almost certainly got to be slapped in the face. Smarten the fark up, use your body, play tight and accountable one-on-one footy against your opponent and use the football when you have it. Weitering makes Dunn look ridiculous at present and he is just a kid. With barely a pre-season under his belt. I've lost patience with these guys now. They're in their late 20's and they still have NFI about what it means to play consistent football. No [censored] wonder Nathan Jones went bald so early in his career. He is the only one of the 'older' brigade who takes any sort of pride in his performance.

Yeh mate and Gysberts' first three games were each over the 25 disposal mark and how's that fella going? Not that I'm comparing Oliver to Gysberts. But disposals. Fark me, who cares at this stage of their careers. As long as they compete and show glimpses then all will be well.

Won't matter who comes in because it's already been scripted: Suns are decimated by injury and we will win in part because of this and also because this has again become another 'response' game for our club on the back of a quarter in which St Kilda kicked seven goals straight. We will then lose to the Dogs. You can almost take that to the bank on both counts. Had we lost to the Saints without having periods that again resembled the 2013 demons, nobody would be going on about it. I blame coaches for not bringing enough fresh legs in and I also point the finger at consistently underperforming players who are the reason this side is so [censored] up and down..

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