Bedraggled Dee

Good luck to the bloke. It obvioulsy didnt work at the Dees but at the end if the day I recon he had the toughest ride of any coach over the last 20 years and managed to end with some dignity and without spitting the dummy. Good bloke rubbish AFL senior coach

I dont think the ACC will take any action themselves, they will refer it to the AFP or State Police for that. If there is evidence of criminal offences the relevant State or Federal Agency will commence procedings if it meets the threshold of public interest. This will be based on the seriousness of the offence, the cost of procedings and whole bunch of other factors designed to prevent public money being wasted on minor or speculative matters. The time elepased between the offence and the prosecution and whether the individuals are still emplyed by the club will be minor considerations at best. I would not be surprised to see criminal procedings against Dank (and his dodgy doctors and phamacists), Roinson and Charters under various Acts. This will also trigger deregistration by governing bodies who will want them out of their industries. I have no knowledge of corporate law but if there is sufficient evidence of offences it would not surprise me if procedings occur against ex office holders at the Bombers. Hird may be subject to workcover offences as might the club and other employees. He may also be caught up in the Dank etc offences but I have my doubts about that. IMO this will all be after the ASADA investigations of any WADA code breaches has been completed and will use evidence from both the AFL and NRL enquiries.

Al. if there is one thing that is certain in business, change will happen. You either grow or contract one or the other. The key is make continualy change without taking un-nessecary risks. GWS IMO is not a great risk. The AFL have enough cash to pump in to ensure they dont start with an unmanageable debt. They have put in place draft concessions that will eventually provide GWS with a very strong side allbeit later than the AFL would have wanted. I assume the stadium deals the AFL have brokered for GWS means they will make a quid with small crowds and I am sure that the record media rights deal the AFL acheived was on the back of exposure to this huge market. To expand and grow the competition needs to gain greater market share in Sydney and the only way is get more sides there (The same is true for the NRL, they need to expand into Melbourne). Other options like ACT, NT and Tas would have been looked at but ACT is not big enough even if the team was marketed as a central Australia side and include Albury/Wodonga and Wagga etc, NT is relatvely small and isolated and Tas is small and has the North/South divide. If you compare the potential returns Sydney would be a mile in front. If people dont agree with the Sydney expansion I would be interested to hear what decisions the AFL should have made to grow the competition.

Hows it going Deb? Have you got enough takers yet? My wife signed us up a few days ago, but I may be able to rustle up a couple of others if you need them.

Oh that part!!! LOL I agree he was rubbish ad a waste pf money.

I agree with Ron, the move to western Sydney was a no brainer. The issue so far has been the execution but the move to grow the brand in such a vast untapped market was correct. The AFL set up rules for the creation of the side with the view that GWS would recruit a bunch of quality youngsters supported by some experienced players obtained through trading picks to existing sides. GWS decided to put all their eggs in the youngster basket. In hindsight the AFL should have been more prescritive in the rules to ensure GWS would start as a competetive outfit, I dont think they expected GWS to take the path they have. From the comeptition perspective the quicker that side comes good and wins a premiership the better. From my perspective I hope we do it first. Sheedy was a mistake. I think someone with greater links to the target market would have been better, Not sure who though (Roos???) The other mistake was recuiting Folau. A disaster under any measure both financially and as a player. The loss of Buddy to the Swans was also a disater for GWS he was critical for the club. The AFL were between a rock and hard place in that they could not intervene prior to any contract being signed and risk the media and everyother conspriacy theorist carping about the AFL costing Hawthorn Buddy, but they would have provided any amount of promotional money to Buddy to get him there. All in all I recon the move is a good just done poorly.

El Preisdente is heading down this morning with her dad. I will post any reports I get.

In the Melbourne side I would definately go for Hogan, we have Clarke and Dawes and are not looking for Hogan to play the game the Daniher and Patton will be required to do. I can see Hogan roaming a bot more than a traditionla key forward, a bit more like Franklin does when Roughead plays up front. I think we finally have the makings of an A grader in the side with Hogan and rcon hw will win a couple of games for us this year.

Nerves still janglling, facial twich easing, gonna be a race for a celebratory beer as soon as the clock hits 5pm.

Bloody Hell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :( Clark has twinged a Hammy, Dawes recovering from surgey and now Hogan with a knee of some sort. I wonder how Fitzy is travelling

Tally so far 3 x mates kids all now demons for life 2 x cousins from the UK departed with scarves and traning singlets Currently working on a single mate and will give him a membership scarf and take him along to0 a couple of games this year.

Young kids grow beards at the moment get over it

We have the cattle We have a seasoned well drilled backline with some depth and potemtially a very dangerous forwardline that can kick winning scores. You cant have that many early picks and not get at least a couple right in the current system. It is too scentific and too well done these days to be completely wrong. Out of early picks Trengove, Grimes, Hogan, Dyson, Viney, Watts, Salem, Vince and Toumpas we will get a couple of stars.

I think leaders can exist in all shapes and forms and leadership can manifest itself in all sorts of ways, even the most introverted and timid person can show leadership through their actions while not being a leader in the traditional sense. I maintain that an effective team is comprised of people who all display leadership. Every player in a football team needs to take the initiative and shoulder the responsibility when required and that is why I think they all need to be leaders. Who and how many get placed in formal leadership roles is in my opinion the last block to be put in place and not as important. The problem at the MFC has not IMO been player leadership but coaching leadership, appropriate development and a half decent game plan that can be executed by the available players. Jones is a leader regardless of whether he is appointed Captain or not. Jones being Captain last year instead of Trengove and Grimes would not have made a blind bit of difference to the outcome. Its the underlying fundamentals that need to be fixed. Luckily it appears that PJ is doing that.

No is the answer to the topic. In an ideal world the entire team would be comprised of people who displayed good leadership skills but thats probably unreaslistic. I dont care how many captains we have or how many other official leaders we provided that translates to on field and off field leadership that drives and sets high standards amongst the entire playing group. I recon Grimes shows all the qualities of a great captain and should be retained in that role. Jones probably deserves to be rewarded but I think being VC for ter Melbourne football club is an honour.

Improvers The Toump - Watched him at training a couple of times and the young fella looks ready to go He has great skills and has added some strength. Hogan - Gonna be the star this club has needed for the last decade Blease - I was at traning before chistmas and he was working very hard on his fitness. If he can this right he will be a very damaging forward/mid. Lots of up side in the young bloke. Sliders Bail Pedersen Byrnes

Yep, being a pom I have not had a good summer. My soccer team West Brom has started poorly and just repalced the manager. England will probably do the same as usual at the World cup and scrap through to the quarters before being knocked out by Agentina. Looking forward to seeing a resurgent Demons and enjoying ging to the footy again.

I have had a look at the code and I dont think intent is requred in a breach of the code 2.2 Use or Attempted Use by an Athlete of a Prohibited Substance or a Prohibited Method 2.2.1 It is each Athlete’s personal duty to ensure that no Prohibited Substance enters his or her body. Accordingly, it is not necessary that intent, fault, negligence or knowing Use on the Athlete’s part be demonstrated in order to establish an anti-doping rule violation for Use of a Prohibited Substance or a Prohibited Method. The ASADA site states 2. Use or attempted use by an athlete of a prohibited substance or prohibited method. In addition to testing athletes, ASADA also has the power to investigate the possible use of prohibited substances, drugs, medications or methods in conjunction with the Australian Federal Police and Customs and Border Protection. An athlete does not have to have succeeded in using a prohibited substance or method – if there is sufficient evidence that the athlete has attempted to use a prohibited substance or method, they can be sanctioned. It is the athlete’s responsibility to ensure that no prohibited substance, drug or medication enters his or her body. Not knowing that you have taken something is not an excuse Accordng to the Code the standard of proof is: The standard of proof shall be whether the Anti-Doping Organization has established an antidoping rule violation to the comfortable satisfaction of the hearing panel bearing in mind the seriousness of the allegation which is made. This standard of proof in all cases is greater than a mere balance of probability but less than proof beyond a reasonable doubt. ASADA dont need to establish fault elements, they just need to extablish the physical evidence, ie, 1. that the use or attempted use occured, 2. that the athelete was the person who used or attmpted to use and 3. that the substance was prohibited and/or that the methd was prohibited. Once that is established to the satisfaction of the hearing panel, end of story

Your forgetting the lips and ears. There is nothing wrong with a luke warm 4n20 high fat offal bag at the footy washed down with a watered down low alcohol beverage. It makes the day complete.

The difference with Saad is that he tested positive and intent is not required for that offence.

Would not be suprised to see Clark and/or Hogan playing a role similar to Goodes in the midfield at times. I thnk Roos has made it pretty clear he wants a big tall midfield and both are mobile, big and strong and good with the ball on the ground.

Thanks Bing. Proving Intent is always a problem and may be the saviour of the players although the consent forms may be a problem. I still reckon that the three points I isted above can be proven with the published information but if you add intent to any of those then the odds of infractions being issued go down. Its funny how reading and hearng the professional media coverage of this issue over the last year has provided little information other than sensationalist headlines and spin to justfy that headline. I have got more information reading this forum than anything provided by any media outlet.

Deanox I will have a look at the code but I think I read on this site that the burdon of proof for ASADA/WADA matters is less then most criminal or civil matters. They only need to to pass a reaonable test to prove the elements and there is no need to prove intent and that is why I have that opinion. I agree with your point that the ADASA/AFL charge sheet contains the basics that both the AFL and ASADA have confidence is correct. Obvioulsy still to be proven in a hearing where the defense can put a case but IMO it looks pretty dodgy frm the Bombers point of view.

The only footy shows I like are on the couch, and before the game (Just been axed ). I tolerate Footy Classified and watch the Footy Show for an occasional laugh. The rest are abysmal. I have said it before on this site, the standard of AFL journalism (misnomer) is at an all time low. (Sorry Emma you are excluded) The entertainment (or lack of it) is sustained by the publics insatiable appetite (includng mine) for anything footy that any old rubbish dished up will get ratings. I would rather file my teeth down wnth an angle grinder the watch after the bounce and AFL360 makes me want to punch the tele.

Agree 100%. It wasnt what Scully did it was the way he did it that raised my hackles. He behaved with little or know integrity and you can blame agenst and parents but at the end of the day it is the mark of the man and he lost me. GWS are welcome to the self centred little %$%$#654. He is overpaid and is not the sort of person to build a team around. he would better off playing tennis or other non team sports.