Not to forget Dunny.

You must mean Dunnyey, sureleyey

understandable people don't want to get their hopes up

my take on this subject is yes we can make the eight,with some luck

1carlton=list was not improved and hasn't been for 2014

2collingwood=list not improved,coach speaks to press language ,but not up to it

3.brisbane=bottom 4

4.gws=see brizzy

5.stkilda=see gws

6.gcs=improvers

7.essendon=asada will eventually happen

8.wc=unknown,on the downslope I think

so our improvement,

spine looks like its coming together and some extras available will have to wait in ressies until spot opens up

mids,after a long year,at least they got some run and learning into them,plus 3 newbies

forwards,plus jh and maybe a new jw.all good for 2014

backline will be taught to loesson mistakes and gain treng/grime

lots of plusses and more to come after 3rd pre by misson

all in all making the 8 not out of the question

I see us more like a Fremantle a few years ago with an additional year or two delay (not necessarily saying we will be playing in a premiership in 3 years though).

Prior to Lyon they finished 11th, Lyon's first season at the helm took them to the top 8 (7th overall) and his second to the top 4 (2nd overall).

In comparison to their list at the time of his takeover late in 2011, our list is a little younger and a little more inexperienced.

So from a realistic and positive perspective I believe we will be just outside the top 8 next year (which I will be happy with as an improvement), and come 2015 we should be pushing it or in it.

If we can turn it around as well as Port Adelaide I will be gob smacked and over the moon, it certainly is possible although I am not getting ahead of myself just yet. All I ask for next year is for a competitive brand off football from start to finish that is enjoyable to watch (e.g. a few wins or at least narrow losses), games that will help me convert my best mate from Essendon (certainly possible if I drag him along to a few matches).

People need a reality check.

We will not play finals.

We will not get close to 9th or 10th.

We were a 2-20 team and were one of the worst performed sides in history.

Yes we will improve but to magically expect us to win 10 or more games is nonsense.

I get the feeling those optimistic fans went overseas last year and/or didn't attend a game all of 2013.

We wont be anything like the same outfit on the park in 14...

No reason we couldnt make a fist of things in 2014

Some personnel to fill gaps and take charge, a bucket load of self belief and confidence in your team mates and coaches. A game plan thats tailored to suit

who knows what the limits are...or if any .

People need a reality check.

We will not play finals.

We will not get close to 9th or 10th.

We were a 2-20 team and were one of the worst performed sides in history.

Yes we will improve but to magically expect us to win 10 or more games is nonsense.

I get the feeling those optimistic fans went overseas last year and/or didn't attend a game all of 2013.

I went overseas this year in the middle of the footy season (Great Timing) yet I agree with Jazza (post #52) that we have a chance! There is no reason that Roos cannot engineer the same improvement with the Dees that Hinkley did with Port this year!

yep,cb if you were overseas good luck to ya

I stayed at most games and watched the positives,

some supporters im afraid watch the negatives and get lost in the mire

as pointed out,the positives were always going to be on show in 2014

the coach roos has always required less chances at giving back the ball and kicking to a contest on the line

it must be pointed out that neeld and misson also worked on the younger brigade,and set them up in the ressies to get good miles in their legs and build body confidence.this was for the 2014 season

hoping jamar/Clark/dawes have had their scrapes and are ready for a full season

also blease/howe/tapscott will at least be fully fit or waiting in ressies for an opputunity,unlike past years ,games were given to everybody that put their hand up.

don't let the mire overcome the positives CB,jump on the wagon and enjoy 2014

Edited December 6, 201311 yr by jazza

People need a reality check.

We will not play finals.

We will not get close to 9th or 10th.

We were a 2-20 team and were one of the worst performed sides in history.

Yes we will improve but to magically expect us to win 10 or more games is nonsense.

I get the feeling those optimistic fans went overseas last year and/or didn't attend a game all of 2013.

Ha. I was travelling all last season and only managed to see us play on tv twice and one was the win against the doggies. Listened to plenty more games on the net though so I have an inkling what you poor souls went through.

I think it's highly unlikely we'll make the finals next year, but not impossible. Stranger things have happened in the world of sport. For us to get there though we'll need a lot of luck and a lot of things to go right.

At a minimum we'd need:

-Our best players on the ground for the majority of the season, something we haven't managed for a long time. Injuries are always going to happen but for us to be any hope we need fewer of them, and those that do happen, to happen mostly to fringe players.

-Cross to earn himself another year, Vince to at least maintain his output from the crows and Jones to keep up his form. We don't have a lot of experience in the guts and we need these 3 guys to show the way, Jones can't do it on his own.

-At least two, preferably three, of Watts, Trengove, Tyson, Toumpas and Viney to show they are on track to be true A grade footballers. That doesn't mean glimpses of potential, it means solid consistent output that if they can maintain they will be top end players. A "breakout season" if you like.

-A good start. We need it all to come together quickly like it did for Port last year. A few early wins would give us some confidence and looking at he draw we'd need to be 3-2 after round 5 to be a realistic chance.

-If point 2 and 3 come to fruition our midfield should be at least competitive. We need our backs and forwards to be what we think they could be with an actual midfield between them. They look good on paper, we need them to look good on the field. Pretty simple really we need to score a lot more and be scored against a lot less.

I heard KB and either Denham or Smith say they thought 4-6 wins would be a pass mark for Roos this year. I think that's fair enough given where we're coming from even though I have to admit I'd be a bit disappointed with 4 wins, 6-8 is achievable imo.

Edited December 6, 201311 yr by furious d

Havn't looked at the full draw yet, but if the top six, Middle six and bottom six play each other twice,I would be backing Richmond to drop out of the eight. Yes they have an uncanny knack beating the hawks but struggle against the top sides. Add to that kangas, Carlton and a rejuvenated WC and tigers are out.

I retract my last statement, having drinks with a mate today who is a mad Richmond member. Apparently Tigers play Saints, Lions, GWS, GC twice. Time will tell.