Precisely why things have to change and quickly. We are marginalising ourselves in the market place. The MFC needs to be seen as an attractive place to be. Clearly, we aren't at the moment.

Five years to fix, no matter the coach, which bit don't you get?

Precisely why things have to change and quickly. We are marginalising ourselves in the market place. The MFC needs to be seen as an attractive place to be. Clearly, we aren't at the moment.

well BIFF is back that should make it more attractive

weve been marginalised for years anew coach wont change that

The crux of the matter is, if Neeld had said it would take 5 years just to be competitive from the start, i doubt whether he would have even got the job.

"Five years to fix, no matter the coach, which bit don't you get?"

"Sat", you might find this hard to believe, but I am no dill. I understand the realities of the market place. I have said many times on here, no coach will bring Nirvana to us. But we need to be seen to be doing something. A new face, new ideas, a new way of selling the message can do remarkable things, in terms of reviving what appears to be a carcass.

"BIFF is back that should make it more attractive

weve been marginalised for years anew coach wont change that"

Sorry, but I am not dwelling in the past, but looking to the future. I'll say it again, Mark Neeld should not shoulder the entire blame. There needs to be a complete overhaul of the FD. But if we continue on the current path, we will lose experienced players, who will want out of this toxic culture and grasp at a chance of playing finals or even a premiership before their career ends. We then lose our core once again, erode the very fabric of this footy club, continue not to develop the stocks we have internally and the spiral will see us disappearing up our own ought. Simple as that.

The crux of the matter is, if Neeld had said it would take 5 years just to be competitive from the start, i doubt whether he would have even got the job.

What do you think he said at the interview, that he would come in and we would win the flag last year?

You lay out what you think, under different scenarios, that is why there are two or three interviews, do you really think the board and Schwab didn't know what was required

The only thing that shits me at the moment is one G. Lyon trying to get out from under now that he thinks it is all going pear shaped, can't have his reputation tarnished can we

"Five years to fix, no matter the coach, which bit don't you get?"

"Sat", you might find this hard to believe, but I am no dill. I understand the realities of the market place. I have said many times on here, no coach will bring Nirvana to us. But we need to be seen to be doing something. A new face, new ideas, a new way of selling the message can do remarkable things, in terms of reviving what appears to be a carcass.

"BIFF is back that should make it more attractive

weve been marginalised for years anew coach wont change that"

Sorry, but I am not dwelling in the past, but looking to the future. I'll say it again, Mark Neeld should not shoulder the entire blame. There needs to be a complete overhaul of the FD. But if we continue on the current path, we will lose experienced players, who will want out of this toxic culture and grasp at a chance of playing finals or even a premiership before their career ends. We then lose our core once again, erode the very fabric of this footy club, continue not to develop the stocks we have internally and the spiral will see us disappearing up our own ought. Simple as that.

Free agency is what the players have been asking for for years, it is now in place, do you really think players will not use it now.

You are burning bridges before we have even reached them, never mind crossing them, Rivers left it freed a spot on the list and we got Terlich, I don't mind that

Frawley - has another year to go

Sylvia - read every post on here about him, he frustrates, if he leaves - have we lost something/anything, personally I don't want to see him go, but..

Davey - if he puts his head down he may get another year offered, can't see another team being interested in him

Watts - he will stay, I would very very surprised if he leaves, but hey it happens

To answer this question:

I can't cop another 5 years if this is ground zero. Is it five years then we are competing for the premiership? Or five years just to win 10 or so games? If it is the former, get rid of him now because if he doesn't have faith in the blokes he is coaching, why should they have faith in him?

I'm lost I though tI was at base camp?!!! Where is BASE CCCCAAAAMMMPPPPPP???!!!

Free agency is what the players have been asking for for years, it is now in place, do you really think players will not use it now.

You are burning bridges before we have even reached them, never mind crossing them, Rivers left it freed a spot on the list and we got Terlich, I don't mind that

Frawley - has another year to go

Sylvia - read every post on here about him, he frustrates, if he leaves - have we lost something/anything, personally I don't want to see him go, but..

Davey - if he puts his head down he may get another year offered, can't see another team being interested in him

Watts - he will stay, I would very very surprised if he leaves, but hey it happens

Which bit don't you get? Of course the AFLPA wanted free agency. No secret there. The difference is, whether a player wants to stay at a club or not. Let's say all of the players named go. What do they take with them? I can assure you, they take more than just talent or even a lack of it.

If you think, in our current position, the football world is going to sit idly by while we contemplate our navels yet again, then you are sadly mistaken. People can malign sports journalists on here as much as they like, but they can't all be wrong. The football media universally condemn us. That cannot be good for current and future sponsors, let alone maintaining and attracting an on-going membership/supporter base. Many Foundation Heroes and Debt Demolition contributors are right royally [censored] off right now. The well is getting deeper and becoming dryer as we kangaroo the wallaby.

Adversity provides opportunity. For goodness sake, let's not miss it this time.

I have had a strange feeling of optimism this week in regards to the future. I reckon we will hold onto Sylvia and Watts. Our forward line is pretty set with the exception of a crumber, though Kent might fill this role, and the backline is looking fairly solid.

If we go soley mids this draft and trade period there is a fair chance we can pick up another couple of Matt Jones' or Dean Terlich's as well as an established mid (most likely not a star). By logic we have to get at least a couple of good players this year (especially with Jason Taylor on board) and maybe we can gel a bit over the off season and win a few more games next year, convincing Frawley and who else to stay. But who knows what will happen.

Precisely why things have to change and quickly. We are marginalising ourselves in the market place. The MFC needs to be seen as an attractive place to be. Clearly, we aren't at the moment.

Yep.....sacking another coach half way through a contract.....Gee all prospective coaches would be lining up.....Bring instant success or be sacked in a year and a half ....

Which bit don't you get? Of course the AFLPA wanted free agency. No secret there. The difference is, whether a player wants to stay at a club or not. Let's say all of the players named go. What do they take with them? I can assure you, they take more than just talent or even a lack of it.

If you think, in our current position, the football world is going to sit idly by while we contemplate our navels yet again, then you are sadly mistaken. People can malign sports journalists on here as much as they like, but they can't all be wrong. The football media universally condemn us. That cannot be good for current and future sponsors, let alone maintaining and attracting an on-going membership/supporter base. Many Foundation Heroes and Debt Demolition contributors are right royally [censored] off right now. The well is getting deeper and becoming dryer as we kangaroo the wallaby.

Adversity provides opportunity. For goodness sake, let's not miss it this time.

"That cannot be good for current and future sponsors, let alone maintaining and attracting an on-going membership/supporter base. Many Foundation Heroes and Debt Demolition contributors are right royally [censored] off right now"

How do you know?, you must be speaking to different people than I am, I know at least four players sponsors, and a Foundation hero or two, yes not happy Jan, but certainly/definitely/absolutely not thinking about walking away

The football media is on a bandwagon, what a journalist actually step away and say something different, not really, although Peter Ryan had the balls to put a slightly different slant on everything

As for the players, Goddard walked away from St Kilda, a club he later cried over, yeah right, it is all about the culture, no it's not

As for the membership, the Monday and Tuesday nights are still getting results, working on members who didn't sign up last year, but have now this year, strange that, small numbers but makes a lie of the media and some posters on here

I don;t mind debating posters on here, as long as they deal in facts and don't regurgitate Caroline Wilsonisms and Damain Barrett tittle tattle.....I await your reply with interest

Yep.....sacking another coach half way through a contract.....Gee all prospective coaches would be lining up.....Bring instant success or be sacked in a year and a half ....

You can editorialise as much as you like Bossdog, but that is not what I said.

You can editorialise as much as you like Bossdog, but that is not what I said.

I can't see how sacking our coaches every 2 years would make MFC an "attractive" place to be

I can't see how we would attract a new coach with the job security of Zero.......

IWS

this is a terrific debate your having with people about getting rid of neeld

while hopefully no offence has been taken or given, i was hoping you could broad outline ALL your reasons for getting rid of him . so we can see with fresh eyes your concerns.

The common argument from those posters that don't support the current coach is that while the current coach is not the sole reason for our problems, he is definitely part of the problem not part of the solution going forward.

Through Jackson (and the AFL) it is hoped that the problems including coaching can be identified and properly addressed.

I hope Jackson realises that the part of the train wreck that Neeld is responsible for and acts professionally, respectfully and promptly in terminating Mark Neeld's tenure and concentrates on securing a top flight coach.

I can't see how sacking our coaches every 2 years would make MFC an "attractive" place to be

I can't see how we would attract a new coach with the job security of Zero.......

Neeld is our third coach in 16 years bossdog Not sure that makes the MFC a rapid sacker.

Now like almost everyone here Because our list is crap I have little idea of Neelds ability.

But to keep him simply because he is only half way through a 3 year term does not make much sense.

A lot of the 'everything is awesome' crowd remind me of Groundskeeper Willie in the Simpsons episode 'The Joy of Sect'. The Leader of the cult everyone in Springfield has joined is flying away in his mock UFO which has fallen to pieces to reveal a crudely made, pedal powered machine weighed down with moneybags.

Willie: Come back... Come back! Willie still loves ya o great one!

A lot of the 'everything is awesome' crowd remind me of Groundskeeper Willie in the Simpsons episode 'The Joy of Sect'. The Leader of the cult everyone in Springfield has joined is flying away in his mock UFO which has fallen to pieces to reveal a crudely made, pedal powered machine weighed down with moneybags.

Willie: Come back... Come back! Willie still loves ya o great one!

What's wrong CFB, afraid optimism might be contagious, you don't have to read the posts or post yourself, it must be really satisfying in a strange sort of way to be so negative about everything.

Although I do admire your many references to pop culture, you obviously fill your waking hours expanding yourself

The common argument from those posters that don't support the current coach is that while the current coach is not the sole reason for our problems, he is definitely part of the problem not part of the solution going forward.

Through Jackson (and the AFL) it is hoped that the problems including coaching can be identified and properly addressed.

I hope Jackson realises that the part of the train wreck that Neeld is responsible for and acts professionally, respectfully and promptly in terminating Mark Neeld's tenure and concentrates on securing a top flight coach.

I would argue that if he were to act professionally and respectfully then he will not act promptly.

Neeld is our third coach in 16 years bossdog Not sure that makes the MFC a rapid sacker.

Now like almost everyone here Because our list is crap I have little idea of Neelds ability.

But to keep him simply because he is only half way through a 3 year term does not make much sense.

i guess to get rid of him because our list is crap, and he is halfway through reforming doesnt make much sense either though?

of the players he brought in

terlich-looks good enough

matt jones- our second best mid this year

clark- clearly going to be a very helpful player

dawes - same with clark

byrnes and rodan-from all reports set the standard at training and show great leadership

pederson-may not be up to scratch but does perform well at vfl level

i dont think a coach can make a difference to the playing group immediately other than letting them get games into them, by giving him 3 years i have a feeling he will be able to at least build a hard working list that if is not performing then another coach can step in

Neeld is our third coach in 16 years bossdog Not sure that makes the MFC a rapid sacker.

Now like almost everyone here Because our list is crap I have little idea of Neelds ability.

But to keep him simply because he is only half way through a 3 year term does not make much sense.

From 1964 only 2 coaches have made it past 5 seasons... Daniher (10) who you conviently used in your stat old dee and Northey (6).

I had a look at a handfull of clubs and the only one who could match us was St. Kilda, the rest had lower turnaround rates.

You can editorialise as much as you like Bossdog, but that is not what I said.

I think you wil find that yourself, WYL, Old Dee and a few others are saying exactly that.

Still waiting for your reply

What's wrong CFB, afraid optimism might be contagious, you don't have to read the posts or post yourself, it must be really satisfying in a strange sort of way to be so negative about everything.

Although I do admire your many references to pop culture, you obviously fill your waking hours expanding yourself

Glad you like the Simpsons references. I prepared another for you especially.

Ironically enough, how Krusty was acting is how I feel whenever you come on the board to give us your sage wisdom.

I think you wil find that yourself, WYL, Old Dee and a few others are saying exactly that.

Still waiting for your reply

Read my lips. Neeld should not shoulder all the blame for where we currently find ourselves, but in the current market, we must be seen to be doing something. We cannot wait another 3 plus years for a discernible improvement. Any business needs to protects its revenue base. If you reckon we are doing that now, then I must be in the wrong business.

Glad you like the Simpsons references. I prepared another for you especially.

Ironically enough, how Krusty was acting is how I feel whenever you come on the board to give us your sage wisdom.

Oh good, not a fan of the Simpsons actually, lot of what they do is recycled, a bit like some posters on this board actually, are you actually going to go against history and actually provide some insightful commentary on this topic, or just your usual 'pop culutre', don't want you damaging anything