After 5 years of rebuilding and tanking.... I mean drafting our list has pretty much come together. Is there anyway possible this list could win a flag in the next 10 years or are we going to see another rebuild with fresh air (actually probably dust) still next to that 1964 premiership cup??

I have often wondered what would have happened if we had chosen Nic Nat and W C took Watts. Would Nic Nat now be a wait and see player and Watts a Champion. IE is it our team or just wrong picks.

When you break it down it doesn't look we will get anywhere a premiership with this list - we need to face facts. We're 5 years into a rebuild and don't have one single A-Grader - this is depressing!!!!

Trengove, Grimes, Watts, Sylvia, Frawley, Pettered and perhaps Gysberts look to be our only potential A Graders. None of these players are anywhere near it yet.

Bate, Dunn, Batram, Jetta, Bennell, J McDonald, Cale Morton have been around for long enough and just haven't delivered. No flag comming from these guys. Trade or delist at season's end

Davey, Green Spencer get rid of them

Jurrah - who knows what's going to happen with Liam.

Rivers - depth player at best thse days

Seller - unsure

L Cook, Taggert, Blease, Fitzpatrick, Tynan,Tapscott, Strauss, Gawn, Davis, Howe, T McDonald are still quite raw. There is some potential in this lot but how many will turn into decent players is anyones guess..

Jones, McKenzie, Couch and Magner will give a contest but none will be A grade stars. Very good B Grade types.

Martin, Jamar, Moloney, Clark and Garland are all required players although not sold that Mitch Clark can be the forward we need him to be. Still think his best postion is in the ruck. I still consider Moloney a required player at this stage but if he puts in many more performances like yesteday they can place him on the trade table to be honest. Didn't give a yelp!

I just cannot see a premieship comming with this list. Too many similair type of midfieldes, we have no run and spread whatsover which is the most concerning aspect of our list. Unfortunately, we are going to need to rebuild again. Get rid of the dead wood and get some decent recruiters into the club so we can build a list that has a realistic chance of winning a flag. We can't make the same mistake and put faith in drafting a plethora of kids again. Sure we need to get the best kids we can to the club but we really need to go after some established stars with leadership qualities that can take this club forward. A bare minimum of 2 classy outside midfielders with pace that can break the lines and a decent crumbing forward should be 1st on the recruiting agenda.

Edited April 1, 201213 yr by simma02

Thanks for the analysis to support my thread simma02. Agree with most of it except for probably Rivers. Will concede that he was poor yesterday but is better than a depth player IMO. Third in the B+F last year was just reward for a serviceable and gutsy player

It has been obvious since 2007 that we would never compete with the current crop.

That means, until Green, Davey, Rivers, Bate, Dunn, etc. are gone, and the older players are Grimes, Frawley, Garland, Jones, Petterd, etc. we will not be where we need to be.

We needed a cleanout, but the problem was that so so much of our list was made up of NQR senior players, means it was always going to take a long time.

Long-term development players like Morton, Watts and Blease haven't expedited this process - they've exacerbated the problem.

It doesn't necessarily mean they were the wrong choices.

But I believe in Daniher's time we mortgaged our future.

It has been obvious since 2007 that we would never compete with the current crop.

That means, until Green, Davey, Rivers, Bate, Dunn, etc. are gone, and the older players are Grimes, Frawley, Garland, Jones, Petterd, etc. we will not be where we need to be.

We needed a cleanout, but the problem was that so so much of our list was made up of NQR senior players, means it was always going to take a long time.

Long-term development players like Morton, Watts and Blease haven't expedited this process - they've exacerbated the problem.

It doesn't necessarily mean they were the wrong choices.

But I believe in Daniher's time we mortgaged our future.

Question is; would we have been any worse now if we had a fast tracked clean out earlier on?

Question is; would we have been any worse now if we had a fast tracked clean out earlier on?

wish we had. 3 years of serious pain is far better than 10...we have gone backwards since mid 2010...

Question is; would we have been any worse now if we had a fast tracked clean out earlier on?

We'd have had a zero win season fielding a combined TAC/VFL side and as a result the club would no longer exist, so yes, we would have been a lot worse off now.

wish we had. 3 years of serious pain is far better than 10...we have gone backwards since mid 2010...

We've gone through serious pain.

I don't think you understand how bleak it would've been if we'd had that sort of clean out.

Our list was in a perilous state, but contributing to that was a dysfunctional and underfunded football department.

We'd have had a zero win season fielding a combined TAC/VFL side and as a result the club would no longer exist, so yes, we would have been a lot worse off now.

With trades and a big hole in our salary cap we could have found some replacements. Then again as you say out football department was dysfunctional so inspired decisions or strokes of genius were never likely to occur.

Edited April 1, 201213 yr by Jackie

What names could we have attracted with our cap space that we didn't already try to entice?

WHo would you have traded, and for what?

Clubs aren't looking to trade gun 3rd year players for guys like Green and Davey, once great, but with only a few years left.

Once they have that bird in the hand, they want to hang onto it.

WE might've got a few handy draft picks, but then we'd have been even more of a kindergarten.

It'd be like starting up GWS in melbourne, but with existing prejudices.

I have often wondered what would have happened if we had chosen Nic Nat and W C took Watts. Would Nic Nat now be a wait and see player and Watts a Champion. IE is it our team or just wrong picks.

Natinui probably would have pulled a "scully" and jumped ship. Bailey's soft touch destroyed any chance Watts had of forging himself as elite.

KEEP : Watts Grimes Trengrove Tappscott Blease Frawley Garland Clark Jurruh Gawn and Howe

The rest should be on the table going forward to get some real players cheers

Edited April 1, 201213 yr by BIG JIM

playing hypotheticals here: assuming we could nab 2 of the free agents listed by AFL website (http://www.afl.com.a...x?newsid=130821) who would you try and pick up at season's end?

I'd take Brad Sewel and Sam Mitchell

obviously never going to happen, who the hell would leave hawthorn to play for us? I feel we need playing mentors from successful clubs like Hawthorn, Collingwood, Geelong, WCE to lead by example (like Judd has at Carlton) even if we only get 1 or 2 seasons out of these players, it could be seen as a waste of money but may well turn out to be a good long term investment for the development of our core group of youngsters. We need a bloody leader at this club so badly. Haven't had one since Neitz retired. Shocking that.

Edited April 1, 201213 yr by leucopogon

playing hypotheticals here: assuming we could nab 2 of the free agents listed by AFL website (http://www.afl.com.a...x?newsid=130821) who would you try and pick up at season's end?

I'd take Brad Sewel and Sam Mitchell

obviously never going to happen, who the hell would leave hawthorn to play for us? I feel we need playing mentors from successful clubs like Hawthorn, Collingwood, Geelong, WCE to lead by example (like Judd has at Carlton) even if we only get 1 or 2 seasons out of these players, it could be seen as a waste of money but may well turn out to be a good long term investment for the development of our core group of youngsters. We need a bloody leader at this club so badly. Haven't had one since Neitz retired. Shocking that.

how I'd kill for Luke Hodge

ive watched games where Dunn has been the only bloke even trying.

playing hypotheticals here: assuming we could nab 2 of the free agents listed by AFL website (http://www.afl.com.a...x?newsid=130821) who would you try and pick up at season's end?

I'd take Brad Sewel and Sam Mitchell

obviously never going to happen, who the hell would leave hawthorn to play for us? I feel we need playing mentors from successful clubs like Hawthorn, Collingwood, Geelong, WCE to lead by example (like Judd has at Carlton) even if we only get 1 or 2 seasons out of these players, it could be seen as a waste of money but may well turn out to be a good long term investment for the development of our core group of youngsters. We need a bloody leader at this club so badly. Haven't had one since Neitz retired. Shocking that.

I thought we had begun this proces with our coaching blend.

We now need the players to absorb some of their (coaches) experiences and forge their own identity.

We cannot begin another rebuild (Which incidentally can never be finished)

We must give our playesr the confidence in their abilities so that they can use them in structures and patterns that they are able to use.

Perhaps we need the players to know they can play to exhaustion and be rested the next week if necessary but that they must give their all.

OH Hell I dont know

Its just so bloody disapointing that it looks like more agony!!!!

We've gone through serious pain.

I don't think you understand how bleak it would've been if we'd had that sort of clean out.

Our list was in a perilous state, but contributing to that was a dysfunctional and underfunded football department.

Oh i am well aware how bleak it would have been. As it is now, we still face the same bleakness. I would have preferred to be past the worst of it by now.

Oh i am well aware how bleak it would have been. As it is now, we still face the same bleakness. I would have preferred to be past the worst of it by now.

Well then you're obviously NOT aware how bleak it was, because for it to have been much worse, there'd no longer be a MFC.

You'd be past the worst and into non-existence.

It'd be like starting up GWS in melbourne, but with existing prejudices.

that is exactly what needs to happen. Sad but true.

that is exactly what needs to happen. Sad but true.

What are you talking about?

That makes no sense.

Well then you're obviously NOT aware how bleak it was, because for it to have been much worse, there'd no longer be a MFC.

You'd be past the worst and into non-existence.

And you believe the alternative has been successful thus far?

The club would have survived as long as the members were fully informed.

As it is now we are right on the edge as far as the list goes.

I have often wondered what would have happened if we had chosen Nic Nat and W C took Watts. Would Nic Nat now be a wait and see player and Watts a Champion. IE is it our team or just wrong picks.

I'm going to be the cynic and say that a lot of players haven't sprouted due to the losing culture that has plagued the club of late.

Well then you're obviously NOT aware how bleak it was, because for it to have been much worse, there'd no longer be a MFC.

You'd be past the worst and into non-existence.

Can you please show me where on the field we are better than we were in 2007

It is now 4+ years ago 89 games and IMO we have gone no where.

If we pull up our socks we may finish third last.

That will have been 5 years or 110 games or half a decade for Zero improvement.

By anyones standards that is deplorable.

What are you talking about?

That makes no sense.

It makes more sense than carrying a bunch of over rated passengers on big contracts which is what we are looking at right now.

A first game rookie player was our best player yesterday after a 4-5 year rebuild FFS. It is obvious that the club has not handled the list right.