Ben Cousins arrested on drug charges

[Dr. Gonzo 23,699]

I see many people on here commenting that they have no empathy or compassion for Cousins for whatever reason - but they miss the point that this isn't about someone seeking public approval, empathy or compassion. This is a man (still young) who has personal demons to battle which is made even more difficult by being in the public eye and having an ego fuelled by too many slaps on the back and wry smiles from a young age because he can run and kick an inflated piece of leather. I don't see him out there pleading for your approval so why do people on here feel the need to use the opportunity for their self-righteous moralising and judgment? It really is egotistical of them

Just to pick out one argument, RobbieF commented on having given up the drink but also stating he can't understand why someone would inject or swallow something that is potentially harmful. The fact is regardless of having now given up booze you did pick up a drink for the first time once so you would know exactly why someone would inject or swallw something that is potentially harmful. You were lucky enough that your drug of choice was easier to give up than some others which create a greater chemical dependence due to the foreign nature of the chemicals used to our biology. Some drugs the body absorbs and processes better than others for this reason which is why it is more difficult for someone on speed to go cold turkey than someone who is on weed or MDMA.

This is a broader social issue but the facts coming in are that prohibition doesn't work. There are many reasons but taking this one in particular, question why does speed/meth even exist? It's a cheap, easy to make substitute for cocaine. If natural drugs like weed, opium, psilocybin, coca were decriminalised or god forbid legalised it would take out a massive market for other prohibited drugs which are more potent & more addictive and are used to fund violent gangsters, dictatorships and even coups, assassinations and terrorism of the CIA who is one of the biggest drug runners in the world. When the Afghan war started Afghan opium accounted for about 7% of world supply - it now makes up somewhere around 92%. Same thing happened during the Vietnam War. This is why drugs remain illegal and why the chances of them ever being decriminalised are slim to none while the current world order remains.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Well the thread is a train wreck now.

Its too general

Seems to now cover all drugs, all addiction and all levels of compassion

I'm outta here

Me too, I don't think I have anything further to add and I can't be bothered saying the same thing over and over again except in a different form.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

I see many people on here commenting that they have no empathy or compassion for Cousins for whatever reason - but they miss the point that this isn't about someone seeking public approval, empathy or compassion. This is a man (still young) who has personal demons to battle which is made even more difficult by being in the public eye and having an ego fuelled by too many slaps on the back and wry smiles from a young age because he can run and kick an inflated piece of leather. I don't see him out there pleading for your approval so why do people on here feel the need to use the opportunity for their self-righteous moralising and judgment? It really is egotistical of them

Just to pick out one argument, RobbieF commented on having given up the drink but also stating he can't understand why someone would inject or swallow something that is potentially harmful. The fact is regardless of having now given up booze you did pick up a drink for the first time once so you would know exactly why someone would inject or swallw something that is potentially harmful. You were lucky enough that your drug of choice was easier to give up than some others which create a greater chemical dependence due to the foreign nature of the chemicals used to our biology. Some drugs the body absorbs and processes better than others for this reason which is why it is more difficult for someone on speed to go cold turkey than someone who is on weed or MDMA.

This is a broader social issue but the facts coming in are that prohibition doesn't work. There are many reasons but taking this one in particular, question why does speed/meth even exist? It's a cheap, easy to make substitute for cocaine. If natural drugs like weed, opium, psilocybin, coca were decriminalised or god forbid legalised it would take out a massive market for other prohibited drugs which are more potent & more addictive and are used to fund violent gangsters, dictatorships and even coups, assassinations and terrorism of the CIA who is one of the biggest drug runners in the world. When the Afghan war started Afghan opium accounted for about 7% of world supply - it now makes up somewhere around 92%. Same thing happened during the Vietnam War. This is why drugs remain illegal and why the chances of them ever being decriminalised are slim to none while the current world order remains.

You will also note that I said that a lot of kids who were unaware of the consequences start drinking at an early stage through peer pressure and I fit in to that category. I'm probably a lot older than you and when I was a very young boy there were no warnings about the problems of drinking, I caved in to the pressure when I was about 14 and unable to make an informed decision whether drinking was good for me or not.

I regretted the day I started and continue to regret the time I lost in my life when I was drunk.

I did say I wouldn't post anymore but I had to respond to that.

[Dr. Gonzo 23,699]

Yeah I understand that and I'm not having a go at you, just using this as an example. Many kids are exposed to drugs by the age of 14-15 and are just as ill informed about making a decision. I know there were some kids in my school who had tried marijuana before they had even finished primary school. The problem is around education I agree but even that counts for nought sometimes when confronted by your peers and the invincibility of youth. Just saying drugs are bad and shouldn't be touched is counter-productive because once a kid tries marijuana at the age of 14 or 15 and realises there isn't much wrong with it and they are not going to die it increases the chances they will then try something a bit "harder" because they think, well if I was lied to about this drug they're probably lying about all drugs.

[Disco Demons 92]

i wish his dad or a close family memeber would come out and appeal to the media not to publish any stories on Ben Cousins. It's a very sad situation to be honest. All this media attention is not justified. He doesn't play AFL anymore.

The guy is suffering from Drug addictions and Mental Health issues. Let him get on with his treatment in peace.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

I see many people on here commenting that they have no empathy or compassion for Cousins for whatever reason - but they miss the point that this isn't about someone seeking public approval, empathy or compassion. This is a man (still young) who has personal demons to battle which is made even more difficult by being in the public eye and having an ego fuelled by too many slaps on the back and wry smiles from a young age because he can run and kick an inflated piece of leather. I don't see him out there pleading for your approval so why do people on here feel the need to use the opportunity for their self-righteous moralising and judgment? It really is egotistical of them

Just to pick out one argument, RobbieF commented on having given up the drink but also stating he can't understand why someone would inject or swallow something that is potentially harmful. The fact is regardless of having now given up booze you did pick up a drink for the first time once so you would know exactly why someone would inject or swallw something that is potentially harmful. You were lucky enough that your drug of choice was easier to give up than some others which create a greater chemical dependence due to the foreign nature of the chemicals used to our biology. Some drugs the body absorbs and processes better than others for this reason which is why it is more difficult for someone on speed to go cold turkey than someone who is on weed or MDMA.

This is a broader social issue but the facts coming in are that prohibition doesn't work. There are many reasons but taking this one in particular, question why does speed/meth even exist? It's a cheap, easy to make substitute for cocaine. If natural drugs like weed, opium, psilocybin, coca were decriminalised or god forbid legalised it would take out a massive market for other prohibited drugs which are more potent & more addictive and are used to fund violent gangsters, dictatorships and even coups, assassinations and terrorism of the CIA who is one of the biggest drug runners in the world. When the Afghan war started Afghan opium accounted for about 7% of world supply - it now makes up somewhere around 92%. Same thing happened during the Vietnam War. This is why drugs remain illegal and why the chances of them ever being decriminalised are slim to none while the current world order remains.

I think you miss the point. Using Meth is dumb, continuing to use it is dumber. I am comfortable with that judgement thanks. I will tell my kids that it is dumb, just like my six siblings and I were taught by my folks.

We had a few drug addicted people living in our house that were taken in by my mother when I was a teenager. One stayed with us for 2 years and lived in our loungeroom. I saw first hand what drug addiction did. As a result when my mates used to pull the bong out I would go home. Not everyone will have the conviction to do that, but I would rather take the honest approach rather than skirt around the issue.

I like the Neeld approach to drugs.

Edited March 29, 2012 by dandeeman

[Guest gidon]

After reading all the arguments on the issues of Ben Cousins, addiction and drug use from many differing perspectives I'll add just a little bit. The ADF (Aust drug foundation) has many stats and research, and most addicts do overcome their addictions. Some may remember back in 2000 the Herald Sun putting a Heroin Overdose Death Tally next to the Road Death tally on its front page. This was done in a time Heroin was lethal. The quality was pure and people were dropping everywhere. Still the ratio of users to deaths were relatively small.

Some seem to put a value base on different types of drug. Prescription drugs and alcohol propose a much higher cost of the health of individuals and cost to govt. Tobacco is another destructive drug cost wise.

Some are putting a value on Ben drug dealing. Consider this, doctors are effectively drug dealers too. They prescribe drugs to ppl. Yes they are qualified to do this, but this does not make them good at their job? Not always. Benzodiazepines are highly dangerous drugs (Xanax, temazapam, Valium etc) and place a higher cost to the tax payer and the lives of families than Ice

My last point is, in Vic, 100,000 ppl are homeless each night. 1 in 3 ppl in homeless services have a drug problem from stats in 2000 (34 000 roughly). Drugs and addiction is a complex issue. So much so it's hard to understand. My advise is value everyone, and hope ppl lead a fruitful life, regardless of circumstance. Addiction may hit your life, it's a societal issues that does not discriminate social or economic barriers. Some disclosed it already has. It's awful and frustrating. But do you wish death on the person?

[Jack Jack 415]

I think you miss the point. Using Meth is dumb, continuing to use it is dumber. I am comfortable with that judgement thanks. I will tell my kids that it is dumb, just like my six siblings and I were taught by my folks.

We had a few drug addicted people living in our house that were taken in by my mother when I was a teenager. One stayed with us for 2 years and lived in our loungeroom. I saw first hand what drug addiction did. As a result when my mates used to pull the bong out I would go home. Not everyone will have the conviction to do that, but I would rather take the honest approach rather than skirt around the issue.

I like the Neeld approach to drugs.

I wonder how many people would have your same convictions if they'd had that same experience.

I knew nothing of the dangers of drugs andI was very lucky that I disliked my first experience and never did it again.

[Tassie Devil 28]

Perhaps "Booze Bus Benny" should try using Modafinil.

http://www.gizmag.com/go/3574/

It's legal so must be okay.

I'm off to see my government sanctioned drug distributor (GP/pharmacist) to see if I can get some on the PBS.

[Dr. Gonzo 23,699]

Perhaps "Booze Bus Benny" should try using Modafinil.

http://www.gizmag.com/go/3574/

It's legal so must be okay.

I'm off to see my government sanctioned drug distributor (GP/pharmacist) to see if I can get some on the PBS.

It wouldn't surprise me if most of these drugs are developed by US intelligence/military related industries - they already feed their pilots (and probably other armed forces) "dextroamphetamine" i.e. speed to enable them to perform long missions at optimum level. Diet pills are also basically "speed" which suppresses a persons appetite. Drugs are everywhere and I agree that the issue needs to be addressed in an intelligent way rather than just illegal bad, legal good manner.

I think what is being fed to us in our food and what is prescribed by GP's/psych's is of far greater importance, particularly when people either don't know what they are consuming or are relying on someone else's "expertise" to make the decisions for them.

[Jack Jack 415]

It wouldn't surprise me if most of these drugs are developed by US intelligence/military related industries - they already feed their pilots (and probably other armed forces) "dextroamphetamine" i.e. speed to enable them to perform long missions at optimum level. Diet pills are also basically "speed" which suppresses a persons appetite. Drugs are everywhere and I agree that the issue needs to be addressed in an intelligent way rather than just illegal bad, legal good manner.

I think what is being fed to us in our food and what is prescribed by GP's/psych's is of far greater importance, particularly when people either don't know what they are consuming or are relying on someone else's "expertise" to make the decisions for them.

Wasn't speed first produced by the Nazis for military purposes?

Presciption drugs are certainly a grey area. I think some prescription drugs, such as certain antidepressants and sleeping pills, permantently change the bodys ability to produce certain vital chemicals and end up being a life long "addictions".

[Range Rover 1,935]

Yes. Just like MFC has to think it will win the premiership and it will happen.

I think when it comes to "beliefs", your assessment of the mental health industry is as distorted as the judgement to carry drugs on a flight.

From my reading and talking to doctors the ability to be clean of crystal meth is an extremely difficult and complex process. I have had a couple of doctors who expressed doubts that you can actually get off ice.

I think its naive to make generalist references to "drug addicts" because the disposition of what they are addcted to can impact their ability to remove the addiction.

I would be interested in comments from those that are actually health professionals who actually deal with this situation.

I said he has to not only think he can but also believe he can. There's an important difference.

In that sense his odds of surviving this battle and indeed triumphing over it can be likened to Melbourne's premiership drought. The odds get increasingly smaller but you've still got to think and believe you can.

I get very uncomfortable seeing the Ben Cousins' of the world get up on TV and (ghost) write newspaper articles declaring "I'm a drug addict and I have to accept I'll always be one even when I'm clean". How about encouraging them to say, "I've got a drug problem and I'm under no illusions about the difficulties I face, but I believe there's a way out of it and one day I won't be". Different mindset.

It's like a good ordinary footballer declaring that's what he is and all he is ever going to be.

I understand the issue is much more complex than this. Crystal meth is the devil incarnate. But I do think a better approach is needed and one which brings a spiritual dimension to rehabilitation in addition to dry Western psychology.

[Tassie Devil 28]

Is taking illicit drugs any more dangerous than surf life saving? Would appreciate someone crunching the data. I'm too unmotivated.

Edit - Good to see Jeff Kennett calling for him to be jailed. That will certainly fix things.

Edited March 29, 2012 by Tassie Devil

[McQueen 17,864]

Cavity search..

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/wa/13291046/not-again-ben/

[Guest Jackie]

Presciption drugs are certainly a grey area. I think some prescription drugs, such as certain antidepressants and sleeping pills, permantently change the bodys ability to produce certain vital chemicals and end up being a life long "addictions".

A dear girl I knew got hooked on antidepressants. Did anything she could to get them legally or illegally. She suffered from depression and once she got on the psychiatric therapy mill she became a total zombie. After she committed suicide two salad bowls full of tablets were found in her kitchen cupboard.

Edited March 29, 2012 by Jackie

[Tassie Devil 28]

Cavity search..

http://au.news.yahoo.../not-again-ben/

Is that where they found the "large quantity of cash"? Others who carry large quantities of cash are often called entrepreneurs.

[Guest gidon]

Incarceration is not always the answer. Prison is a whole sub culture of social structures within itself. Drugs are also more prevalent in prison. Ben would more than likely be idolized and sit well up the order of prison life. Drugs may come easily for him. Especiallly if it's true he has organized crime mates

[daisycutter 29,308]

Is taking illicit drugs any more dangerous than surf life saving? Would appreciate someone crunching the data. I'm too unmotivated.

Edit - Good to see Jeff Kennett calling for him to be jailed. That will certainly fix things.

well its a change from advocating national service in the military

[Tassie Devil 28]

well its a change from advocating national service in the military

Get 'em hooked on drugs and give 'em a gun - sounds like a robust Foreign Policy.

[old dee 23,486]

well its a change from advocating national service in the military

This is getting way off the thread DC but if you raised this subject with my father he would go right off.

His experienced was that the vast majority of bad people he met in the army where bad soldiers

The first to go Awol, last out the trench and almost always let you down and put your life at risk.

It did not improve them as people.

I can hear him right now.

" why inflict these idoits on good soldiers and put there lives at risk, the spot for them is Jail"

Edited March 29, 2012 by old dee

[daisycutter 29,308]

This is getting way off the thread DC but if you raised this subject with my father he would go right off.

His experienced was that the vast majority of bad people he met in the army where bad soldiers

The first to go Awol, last out the trench and almost always let you down and put your life at risk.

It did not improve them as people.

I can hear him right now.

" why inflict these idoits on good soldiers and put there lives at risk, the spot for them is Jail"

I'm sure he wouldn't have approved of the Dirlewanger Brigade then............

[Biffen 12,809]

Incarceration is not always the answer. Prison is a whole sub culture of social structures within itself. Drugs are also more prevalent in prison. Ben would more than likely be idolized and sit well up the order of prison life. Drugs may come easily for him. Especiallly if it's true he has organized crime mates

It is well documented that he is an associate of big crims in WA and here .

I predict he will be dead in ten years unless he gains some perspective

[Tassie Devil 28]

It is well documented that he is an associate of big crims in WA and here

Perhaps if we took the crime out of drugs there would be less victims of crime.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Perhaps if we took the crime out of drugs there would be less victims of crime.

How so? Are you suggesting Drugs for all, Government supplied?

What would you propose to do with the additional drug addicts that would be out on the streets? We could have crack rooms in the workplace and allow workers time to slip down to the Chemist to get a refill of their prescription at morning tea time?

Sorry I did say i wouldn't post on here anymore but this is becoming a bit ridiculous.

Edited March 29, 2012 by RobbieF

[daisycutter 29,308]

Perhaps if we took the crime out of drugs there would be less victims of crime.

why not have anarchy then there'd be no criminals?