Here are my observations

Don't give Beamer a week off in the pre season, the engine cools too much

McKenzie and Trengove having first hit out...rusty

Davis being kept on Hale, learnt more in four quarters than five or six games at Casey

Frawley being subbed out for last quarter

Stef Martin missing, he is becoming an important player for structure

Pettterd missing ditto

Green missing ditto

Centre square first bounce, no Jones or Bate, downhill from there, Magner does a finger

Players kept at it all game

Hawthorn are really going to give the Prem a shake this year

Neeld will stick to his guns and not give a stuff what anybody thinks......good

Mitch Clark is going to be great for us

I left Etihad with a few questions, but will watch the Port game with interest and rock up on March 31st

Here are my observations

Don't give Beamer a week off in the pre season, the engine cools too much

McKenzie and Trengove having first hit out...rusty

Davis being kept on Hale, learnt more in four quarters than five or six games at Casey

Frawley being subbed out for last quarter

Stef Martin missing, he is becoming an important player for structure

Pettterd missing ditto

Green missing ditto

Centre square first bounce, no Jones or Bate, downhill from there, Magner does a finger

Players kept at it all game

Hawthorn are really going to give the Prem a shake this year

Neeld will stick to his guns and not give a sfuff what anybody thinks......good

Mitch Clark is going to be great for us

I left Etihad with a few questions, but will watch the Port game with interest and rock up on March 31st

He dropped Watts this week after a slightly improved performace from the week before.

He dropped Watts this week after a slightly improved performace from the week before.

May not be a bad thing, all players have had a brke during the preseason. I wouldn't read too much into it

May not be a bad thing, all players have had a brke during the preseason. I wouldn't read too much into it

He's running around at Casey - wouldn't call that a break.

Just thought it was ironic that the comment was made about Neeld not giving a stuff what anyone says, then all of a sudden, the man most talked about in AFL ranks has been dropped!

Don't think winning a certain amount of games is important? You're kidding aren't you?

Regardless of the fact that Neeld is in his first year, and the obvious change to game plan will take place, but the fact is that basically the same players will make up our Round 1 team this year as to most of those that played last year in the seniors, so I expect improvement. A season of 8 or less wins is a fail, quite simple. Our young guys are a year older than last year.

To not have an expectation on the amount of wins we should have this year is poor planning, and is not setting goals high enough for this current group. We need to get tougher on them, and give them less opportunity to use anything as an excuse.

If we win 8 games but get belted everytime we lose that is a fail and the reason why Bailey got the ass, not because of the amount of games we won. We have a totally new game plan and structure, don't expect miracles in Neeld's first year. Expections need to higher in his second year and I would be concerned if we weren't in the 8 by his 3rd year.

We have to realize that this a total rebuild due to Bailey stuffing up in a big way.

If we win 8 games but get belted everytime we lose that is a fail and the reason why Bailey got the ass, not because of the amount of games we won. We have a totally new game plan and structure, don't expect miracles in Neeld's first year. Expections need to higher in his second year and I would be concerned if we weren't in the 8 by his 3rd year.

We have to realize that this a total rebuild due to Bailey stuffing up in a big way.

So you would be happy if we won 3 games and lost 19 by under 5 goals? I'm sorry if you accept that.

Expectations should be as high this year as they should be next year. New coach, the old "blank canvs" comments thrown around all preseason, there is absolutely no reason why all listed players (except for thouse that are injured) not to stand up and make a statement. They have the ability, now's the time to show the new FD what they are capable of.

Then, if said players can take that next step up this year, the expectations are higher again next year becuase they will be over 12 months in to this apparent near-impossible thing to implement straight away that is a new game plan.

I couldn't care if the top 4 sides beat us by 100 points every time we play them - we are not a top 4 side yet. There's no reason why the next 14 sides underneath them should not be aiming for 5th spot on the ladder.

He's running around at Casey - wouldn't call that a break.

Just thought it was ironic that the comment was made about Neeld not giving a stuff what anyone says, then all of a sudden, the man most talked about in AFL ranks has been dropped!

Watts has played all pre season games, not many others have without a break, Neeld probably thinks this will be the freshen up he needs, repeat Neeld will not be swayed.....watch his press conference again.....you can tell who he served under for a couple of years...got the 'death stare' going a couple of times

This is a footy team of 22 individuals who one individual is trying to mould into a Prem winning team, I don't care who we drafted, picked, dropped, traded etc, you can do this till the cows come home.....if this is the group (including the coaches) that is going to win a Prem then it will....no amount of analysis, hand wringing, comparing etc is going to change that.......just buckle up for the ride.....I have missed 3 games in 5 seasons with the seatbelt tightly strapped....expect the same this season....but god it's fun...that is why I turn up each week....

So you would be happy if we won 3 games and lost 19 by under 5 goals? I'm sorry if you accept that.

Expectations should be as high this year as they should be next year. New coach, the old "blank canvs" comments thrown around all preseason, there is absolutely no reason why all listed players (except for thouse that are injured) not to stand up and make a statement. They have the ability, now's the time to show the new FD what they are capable of.

Then, if said players can take that next step up this year, the expectations are higher again next year becuase they will be over 12 months in to this apparent near-impossible thing to implement straight away that is a new game plan.

I couldn't care if the top 4 sides beat us by 100 points every time we play them - we are not a top 4 side yet. There's no reason why the next 14 sides underneath them should not be aiming for 5th spot on the ladder.

Bloody oath. I would have rather had Brisbane's season than ours. Our constant lack of fight when we are down should be our biggest concern, beating a handful of ordinary sides does nothing for our development.

Bloody oath. I would have rather had Brisbane's season than ours. Our constant lack of fight when we are down should be our biggest concern, beating a handful of ordinary sides does nothing for our development.

In the past decade, North have been a great example of the issues you face if you don't improve your win/loss record but remain cometitive. You regularly finish 9th, 10th, 11th, miss out on better draft picks, and your players don't learn from playing the different brand of footy called finals.

120

dont say that, i'll be at subi for the game and wouldnt be able to stand another thrashing like last year

In the past decade, North have been a great example of the issues you face if you don't improve your win/loss record but remain cometitive. You regularly finish 9th, 10th, 11th, miss out on better draft picks, and your players don't learn from playing the different brand of footy called finals.

What about Sydney? Well we've had a heap of early drafts picks, so there are no reasons why we should be worried about being in North's position.

In the past decade, North have been a great example of the issues you face if you don't improve your win/loss record but remain cometitive. You regularly finish 9th, 10th, 11th, miss out on better draft picks, and your players don't learn from playing the different brand of footy called finals.

Yes i agree. But you have to begrudgingly admire the way they hang in there onfield.

A bit of spirit through our team like that is needed. Be it an older player or a first gamer.

I am hoping that is at the top of Mark Neeld's agenda, because many before him have not been able to ignite it.

Yes i agree. But you have to begrudgingly admire the way they hang in there onfield.

A bit of spirit through our team like that is needed. Be it an older player or a first gamer.

I am hoping that is at the top of Mark Neeld's agenda, because many before him have not been able to ignite it.

Absolutely WYL, and let's be honest (or to some degree arrogant), we should have a far better list than them.

That's why I couldn't understand the mentality of not caring how many games we win this year. We've been through hell for years, we've stockpiled a heap of good draft picks, it's time.

As I said in my earlier, there is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't be looking at 5th spot as a target for us. Take out Geelong, Collingwood, Hawthorn and probably Carlton, it could be argued the West Coast be included in that group, the field should be fairly even right down to the bottom two (GC and GWS). We won 8 games last year with what most believe was zero game plan, minimal direction from the FD, and absolutely no leadership from our senior players. This year we have a game plan, we hopefully have direction from the FD, and we hopefully have a new breed of leadership. Surely we are hoping to see our win column in the doube figures???

We have to realize that this a total rebuild due to Bailey stuffing up in a big way.

It isnt a total rebuild at all. Neeld has to mature the existing list of talented youngsters. Alot of the hard work and pain has been done. There is still some hard steps to go.

I would have rather had Brisbane's season than ours. Our constant lack of fight when we are down should be our biggest concern, beating a handful of ordinary sides does nothing for our development.

I wouldn't want Brisbane season or list for quids. There's a good reason they experienced quality players like Clark and Riscitelli are deserting the ship. They're doomed to bottom 4 or 5 for the next year or two with no easy way out.

But you have to begrudgingly admire the way they hang in there onfield.

North cant beat the quality top sides and whenever they face a test against higher runged opposition they dissolve like dispirins in water. They are a middle rung traveller at the moment. They're doing their best from a limited songsheet but its not enough to make them a serious finals participant or challenger

It isnt a total rebuild at all. Neeld has to mature the existing list of talented youngsters. Alot of the hard work and pain has been done. There is still some hard steps to go.

I wouldn't want Brisbane season or list for quids. There's a good reason they experienced quality players like Clark and Riscitelli are deserting the ship. They're doomed to bottom 4 or 5 for the next year or two with no easy way out.

North cant beat the quality top sides and whenever they face a test against higher runged opposition they dissolve like dispirins in water. They are a middle rung traveller at the moment. They're doing their best from a limited songsheet but its not enough to make them a serious finals participant or challenger

thanks SM you have covered all that well

It isnt a total rebuild at all. Neeld has to mature the existing list of talented youngsters. Alot of the hard work and pain has been done. There is still some hard steps to go.

I wouldn't want Brisbane season or list for quids. There's a good reason they experienced quality players like Clark and Riscitelli are deserting the ship. They're doomed to bottom 4 or 5 for the next year or two with no easy way out.

I'll agree to disagree on the on the first sentence.

On Brisbane, at least they showed some fight last year, could have one a few more games than they did. We showed no fight at all. Never mentioned that I wanted Brisbane's season, I just would have preferred it than ours.

Clark and Rischtelli left for money, you could say the same thing about us regarding Bruce and Scully.

North cant beat the quality top sides and whenever they face a test against higher runged opposition they dissolve like dispirins in water. They are a middle rung traveller at the moment. They're doing their best from a limited songsheet but its not enough to make them a serious finals participant or challenger

Yes i agree...But as you say they are doing there best from what they have....Consistently....Can we say the same for the MFC over the past few Decades...No. And that is why i bought it up.

We should be better than North....Yep that should have transpired in 2010.....But we are not. And the only reasons for that are excuses..

Absolutely WYL, and let's be honest (or to some degree arrogant), we should have a far better list than them.

That's why I couldn't understand the mentality of not caring how many games we win this year. We've been through hell for years, we've stockpiled a heap of good draft picks, it's time.

As I said in my earlier, there is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't be looking at 5th spot as a target for us. Take out Geelong, Collingwood, Hawthorn and probably Carlton, it could be argued the West Coast be included in that group, the field should be fairly even right down to the bottom two (GC and GWS). We won 8 games last year with what most believe was zero game plan, minimal direction from the FD, and absolutely no leadership from our senior players. This year we have a game plan, we hopefully have direction from the FD, and we hopefully have a new breed of leadership. Surely we are hoping to see our win column in the doube figures???

Between positions 6-13 are all open this year IMO

Depends how hungry each club is...We have no more years to hide...done that...It is now time to get dirty & win respect.

Yes i agree...But as you say they are doing there best from what they have....Consistently....Can we say the same for the MFC over the past few Decades...No. And that is why i bought it up.

We should be better than North....Yep that should have transpired in 2010.....But we are not. And the only reasons for that are excuses..

Spot on WYL.

It's amazing how after 1 flogging in the NAB Cup, and people raising concerns about the season ahead, the word "excuses" is starting to raise it's ugly head. I got a new one torn when I said our membership slogan should be "No More Excuses".

Even in this thread alone we have seen some say that Watts has been put back to Casey to "freshen him up". Sounds like an excuse to me, I think he was dropped.

Then someone else has said that they don't care about how many games we win this season, bascially it's in the way we lose that needs to improve. Sounds a lot like an excuse for us to use if we don't make finals.

I'm sick of it. We have no excuses not to be better in 2012.

I'll agree to disagree on the on the first sentence.

Your problem then.

On Brisbane, at least they showed some fight last year, could have one a few more games than they did. We showed no fight at all. Never mentioned that I wanted Brisbane's season, I just would have preferred it than ours.

They were 4 and 18 with a worse percentage than us. They lost games they should have won if they were good enough but werent and in a few games they ran the white flag. If you wanted their trainwreck season rather than ours then it consistent with your judgement on rebuilds.

Clark and Rischtelli left for money, you could say the same thing about us regarding Bruce and Scully.

Clark was going home to Freo before we lured him away.

Rischtelli was horseflesh trade in the Fevola debacle. Said heaps about the Brisbane culture that you seem to admire

Scully and Bruce were different situations. Scully vastly different

We should be better than North. But we are not. And the only reasons for that are excuses..

We have a fitness coach, a backline coach, a development coach etc. etc. We can obviously fix that quick smart by employing an excuses coach.

Thank you for your profound analysis.

Spot on WYL.

It's amazing how after 1 flogging in the NAB Cup, and people raising concerns about the season ahead, the word "excuses" is starting to raise it's ugly head. I got a new one torn when I said our membership slogan should be "No More Excuses".

Even in this thread alone we have seen some say that Watts has been put back to Casey to "freshen him up". Sounds like an excuse to me, I think he was dropped.

Then someone else has said that they don't care about how many games we win this season, bascially it's in the way we lose that needs to improve. Sounds a lot like an excuse for us to use if we don't make finals.

I'm sick of it. We have no excuses not to be better in 2012.

Billy i love the MFC, but it seems that the club and a fair wack of supporters over the years have happily accepted mediocrity...I am not saying the club has not worked hard..but clearly whatever it has done has consitently been below the mark..for decades..

Now i hope the Stynes/McLardy Board can break the mould...and if that means a few people resign in tears, so be it.

As supporters we are too soft in general....The idea that a season of 2 wins 20 losses can be seen as acceptable is a sad sad reflection of what has happened to Norm Smith's Melbourne.

Coaches. Players, Board Members, Club employees, Recruiters, Supporters...we are all to blame for the mess this club is in...it has improved, but unless the players improve we are all wasting our time..

The Media has been very friendly to us, maybe too nice.

As i said positions 6-13 are available on the ladder this year...so we should be aiming for 6.

Anything less we then work out why it wasn't acheived...and act.

We have a fitness coach, a backline coach, a development coach etc. etc. We can obviously fix that quick smart by employing an excuses coach.

Thank you for your profound analysis.

You disagree? Be interested to hear your take on the last 5 decades...i have seen most of it.

Yes i agree...But as you say they are doing there best from what they have....Consistently....Can we say the same for the MFC over the past few Decades...No. And that is why i bought it up.

We should be better than North....Yep that should have transpired in 2010.....But we are not. And the only reasons for that are excuses..

The fact is that are not showing that at all consistently on the ground where it counts. They look good against the bottom half and melt against the top half. Just like MFC. In fact they also lost to Collingwood by nearly 20 goals in one game. Its eeriely like MFC.

http://stats.rleague.com/afl/teams/kangaroos/allgames.html

I disagree we should be better than North. They have a better stable of senioor players in Harvey, Petrie, Wells, Firrito and Rawlings than we do. Better leadership. They were on average about 1 year older in their playing list and had about 500 games more experience week to week.So we are a younger more inexperienced team which was also dealing a number of off field issues including leadership crises.

Its a case of your impatience overriding better judgment based on the facts.

The fact is that are not showing that at all consistently on the ground where it counts. They look good against the bottom half and melt against the top half. Just like MFC. In fact they also lost to Collingwood by nearly 20 goals in one game. Its eeriely like MFC.

http://stats.rleague...s/allgames.html

I disagree we should be better than North. They have a better stable of senioor players in Harvey, Petrie, Wells, Firrito and Rawlings than we do. Better leadership. They were on average about 1 year older in their playing list and had about 500 games more experience week to week.So we are a younger more inexperienced team which was also dealing a number of off field issues including leadership crises.

Its a case of your impatience overriding better judgment based on the facts.

i wouldn't call winning nothing in 48 years being impatient...The Facts are this organization has not run properly for a very long time, which is how our list became so negected by 2007...

That Being said...What is your honest opinion of how many more years grace we can give this list?

At some stage the babies have to leave the nest and fend for themselves.

I have already shown them the door...this year they must swim

But you obviously have a different slant