Look who's talking.

I assumed he was referring to himself.

I assumed he was referring to himself.

ooh epic call. got me.

Let it go, you're just embarrassing yourself.

Davey's our best player, played 21 all day

Watts or Dunn had an easy chance each to win us that game, it means nothing to you

staggering

Let it go, you're just embarrassing yourself.

how about just not talk to me you are incredibly arrogant

just snide comments with no argument, yeah you ara a hero

how about just not talk to me you are incredibly arrogant

just snide comments with no argument, yeah you ara a hero

On the contrary.

You're the one bereft of an argument.

* are

On the contrary.

You're the one bereft of an argument.

* are

your 'argument' is essentially this:

'nearly' winning is not actually winning it is the same as losing by 100, even against accomplished sides/interstate

therefore it is acceptable for us to finish on 8.5 wins again

explain to me how you agree that a 3 point loss can be counted as a 'shouldabeen', but another match included TWO shots on goal to take the lead with 3-4 minutes left is different

your mind goes 'less than 6 points' or 'more than 6 points' and you leave it there because you cannot process anything more

ignorant, defeatist garbage

and pre-defending the failue that 8.5 wins would be is extraordinary

Pure drivel.

your 'argument' is essentially this:

'nearly' winning is not actually winning it is the same as losing by 100, even against accomplished sides/interstate

therefore it is acceptable for us to finish on 8.5 wins again

explain to me how you agree that a 3 point loss can be counted as a 'shouldabeen', but another match included TWO shots on goal to take the lead with 3-4 minutes left is different

your mind goes 'less than 6 points' or 'more than 6 points' and you leave it there because you cannot process anything more

ignorant, defeatist garbage

and pre-defending the failue that 8.5 wins would be is extraordinary

That is nonsense, C&B.

I'm defeatist because I didn't think we should claim the game against Freo 'a game we could have won' if it weren't for late misses?

Does PA count the Darwin game the same? Do we diminish close wins on the same argument?

I wonder whether we were 9 goals to 2 up on a team and we got home would that be considered a loss.

I mean, come on. We were outplayed for a lot of the Freo game and the Hawks game was a case of hanging in there when the weather allowed us to. Never really felt we were a chance.

Maybe more curry and less beer is in order...

Hahaha call of the year

(sorry C&B..)

I think perhaps I may have misinterpreted the contention of the OP and failed to see the point of it, but then realised some people would start a thread if there was an audible fart on the telly.

Carry on...

Anyway...

Close wins and close losses, just like favourable and unfavourable umpiring calls, even out over the course of seasons. The opposition could just as easily say they should have won games that we narrowly won. The ladder generally doesn't lie at the end of 22 home and away games.

That said, I'd like to think we could win at least half of our games this year and be a genuine challenger for the lower reaches of the eight. Somewhere around that mark anyway.

Does PA count the Darwin game the same? Do we diminish close wins on the same argument?

I wonder whether we were 9 goals to 2 up on a team and we got home would that be considered a loss.

fair point but there was only 1 such match vs 5 that DIDN'T go our way. Go ahead then and cancel one out you are still left with 12 wins. Your second scenario never happened did it? If it did you might have a point!

anyway, what is your point? Do you think that a repeat of 8.5 wins is a pass mark for 2011 or not? Because my point is that 2010's 8.5 wins is misrepresentative of the actual season that transpired so to repeat the same would actually be going backwards.

fair point but there was only 1 such match vs 5 that DIDN'T go our way. Go ahead then and cancel one out you are still left with 12 wins. Your second scenario never happened did it? If it did you might have a point!

anyway, what is your point? Do you think that a repeat of 8.5 wins is a pass mark for 2011 or not? Because my point is that 2010's 8.5 wins is misrepresentative of the actual season that transpired so to repeat the same would actually be going backwards.

Well, my main point was you were being unreasonable.

My secondary point was we lost games because we deserved to lose.

My third point is that having targets in terms of ladder position and games won is arbitrary and unfair - hence the reference to Mark Thompson as the two-time Premiership Coach who wouldn't be a two-time Premiership Coach if Frank Costa placed hard and fast measures on the team.

We should be close to making the finals injuries permitting but as long as I see our best players progress (those 22 and under) I will be satisfied.

I want to win a flag.

6th place finishes do not excite me.

Maybe more curry and less beer is in order...

Na. More beer and less curry.....

Well, my main point was you were being unreasonable.

My secondary point was we lost games because we deserved to lose.

My third point is that having targets in terms of ladder position and games won is arbitrary and unfair - hence the reference to Mark Thompson as the two-time Premiership Coach who wouldn't be a two-time Premiership Coach if Frank Costa placed hard and fast measures on the team.

We should be close to making the finals injuries permitting but as long as I see our best players progress (those 22 and under) I will be satisfied.

I want to win a flag.

6th place finishes do not excite me.

Agree but they are a hell of a lot better than Last!

Well, my main point was you were being unreasonable.

My secondary point was we lost games because we deserved to lose.

My third point is that having targets in terms of ladder position and games won is arbitrary and unfair - hence the reference to Mark Thompson as the two-time Premiership Coach who wouldn't be a two-time Premiership Coach if Frank Costa placed hard and fast measures on the team.

We should be close to making the finals injuries permitting but as long as I see our best players progress (those 22 and under) I will be satisfied.

I want to win a flag.

6th place finishes do not excite me.

well yes we deserved to lose, but the question is whether you expect to win in the same situation next time around. In our situation with our blossoming youth, the answer is of course you bloody do! I watched that Freo game recently, Bruce was rubbish and Macca didn't play. So take that out of the equation straight away. PJ was also there being the proverbial [censored] on the bull. So sub in Spencer and Gysberts for them and add a year of experience for all the other youngsters. We don't have a Freo at Subi match this year. If we did, I would not expect the same side to turn up and concede 9 of the first 11 goals. That's what a young side does. I would expect it to be closer to the side that came out in the 3rd quarter and kicked 6 goals in 20 minutes (or something like that) and we win the match easily. All Bail had to do in the draw was dish it off to Davey and we'd have beaten the premiers. Are you saying that game too is just a loss like any other? Are you saying 8.5 wins is good enough for a side capable of that? What's your par score?

I genuinely don't understand what you are on about when you talk about some sort of disconnect between winning games of football and overall team improvement, surely the two go firmly hand in hand.

well yes we deserved to lose, but the question is whether you expect to win in the same situation next time around. In our situation with our blossoming youth, the answer is of course you bloody do! I watched that Freo game recently, Bruce was rubbish and Macca didn't play. So take that out of the equation straight away. PJ was also there being the proverbial [censored] on the bull. So sub in Spencer and Gysberts for them and add a year of experience for all the other youngsters. We don't have a Freo at Subi match this year. If we did, I would not expect the same side to turn up and concede 9 of the first 11 goals. That's what a young side does. I would expect it to be closer to the side that came out in the 3rd quarter and kicked 6 goals in 20 minutes (or something like that) and we win the match easily. All Bail had to do in the draw was dish it off to Davey and we'd have beaten the premiers. Are you saying that game too is just a loss like any other? Are you saying 8.5 wins is good enough for a side capable of that? What's your par score?

I genuinely don't understand what you are on about when you talk about some sort of disconnect between winning games of football and overall team improvement, surely the two go firmly hand in hand.

Says it all really...

Wouldn't be surprised if (at least from the outside) it remains Jack Watts.

My vote will also go to Jared Rivers.

(Yes, replying to the OP and ignoring all the malarkey above).

Says it all really...

says more than you have managed in about your last 20 posts which have had nothing to do with football

well yes we deserved to lose, but the question is whether you expect to win in the same situation next time around. In our situation with our blossoming youth, the answer is of course you bloody do! I watched that Freo game recently, Bruce was rubbish and Macca didn't play. So take that out of the equation straight away. PJ was also there being the proverbial [censored] on the bull. So sub in Spencer and Gysberts for them and add a year of experience for all the other youngsters. We don't have a Freo at Subi match this year. If we did, I would not expect the same side to turn up and concede 9 of the first 11 goals. That's what a young side does. I would expect it to be closer to the side that came out in the 3rd quarter and kicked 6 goals in 20 minutes (or something like that) and we win the match easily. All Bail had to do in the draw was dish it off to Davey and we'd have beaten the premiers. Are you saying that game too is just a loss like any other? Are you saying 8.5 wins is good enough for a side capable of that? What's your par score?

You are basically saying that our win/loss record for 2010 doesn't reflect our performance.

I genuinely don't understand what you are on about when you talk about some sort of disconnect between winning games of football and overall team improvement, surely the two go firmly hand in hand.

You are basically saying that the win/loss record reflect a teams performance.

Ugh.

check...mate?

You are basically saying that our win/loss record for 2010 doesn't reflect our performance.

You are basically saying that the win/loss record reflect a teams performance.

Ugh.

well obviously the equation changes a bit when you lose 4.5 matches closely. so you're saying we'll improve but it won't mean wins. so we will lose 10 close ones I guess.

how long are you going to go before stating your par score

or would that be too much commitment.. that way you couldnt vaguely snake around your argument as easily, i understand

check...mate?

how many in a row

check...mate?

I think so.

Anyone agree?