Three Collingwood fans charged over alleged bashing

[H_T 3,032]

The AFL rightfully have condemned the actions of those arrested.

However, aside from cancelling a Club/AFL membership if they have one, how do they possibly ban people from games?

It's nearly nigh impossible. If those thugs wanted to attend a AFL game, I'm sure they would get in. Who's going to know and identify them 6 weeks down the track if they entered? Unless you had highly skilled staff and surveilance, that could identify them or a member of the public recognise them knowingly, they'll get in. Ie. They could purchase a General Admission Ticket at just about any outlet, pay cash. Walk in on the day.

[Kit Walker 225]

The AFL rightfully have condemned the actions of those arrested.

However, aside from cancelling a Club/AFL membership if they have one, how do they possibly ban people from games?

They do it in soccer quite regularly in Europe. I'm not sure of the mechanics of it, but I believe they use CCTV and reports from the public as well.

Generally if these people do something bad enough to warrant a banning order, they are recognisable enough that someone will notice and dob them in, even if they do get through the front gate.

I believe they would then be charged with criminal trespass as well. The English have additional legislation on top of this as I understand it for further penalties.

[45HG 1,539]

They shouldn't be able to HT, they should be in prison

[H_T 3,032]

They shouldn't be able to HT, they should be in prison

It angers me too, mate. Maybe they could have those micro-chips - like a GPS, to monitor movement...

[pitmaster 3,447]

Three charged - one denied bail and has spent three nights in the clink (good result) and according to police two more are being sought. These would be the heroes who sunk in the boot while Brad Jones was on the ground.

[titan_uranus 24,654]

The AFL rightfully have condemned the actions of those arrested.

However, aside from cancelling a Club/AFL membership if they have one, how do they possibly ban people from games?

The same way any venue applies bans to patrons. Use of skilled security staff, CCTV footage, and public awareness. It's hard, but at least by attempting to do it they're sending the right message.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

They do it in soccer quite regularly in Europe. I'm not sure of the mechanics of it, but I believe they use CCTV and reports from the public as well.

Generally if these people do something bad enough to warrant a banning order, they are recognisable enough that someone will notice and dob them in, even if they do get through the front gate.

I believe they would then be charged with criminal trespass as well. The English have additional legislation on top of this as I understand it for further penalties.

I can understand the security surrounding soccer is greater including the segregation of opposing supporters at and coming to and from the game but I cant see how they can ban anyone.

For example if a person was banned for a previous incident how do you isolate that person in a crowd of 90,000. Its a needle in a haystack situation.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

The same way any venue applies bans to patrons. Use of skilled security staff, CCTV footage, and public awareness. It's hard, but at least by attempting to do it they're sending the right message.

Did the CCTV footage pick up the assault on Jones Dad?

I cant see how it can isolate one person on film if it cant show footage of a fight.

It would appear they cannot ban individuals from a sporting function.

[Kit Walker 225]

Did the CCTV footage pick up the assault on Jones Dad?

I cant see how it can isolate one person on film if it cant show footage of a fight.

It would appear they cannot ban individuals from a sporting function.

I'm not sure of the CCTV coverage at the MCG, particularly outside the ground and there has been no statements one way or the other as to whether the alleged assault was recorded. Either way, I would expect that any video coverage would be much more significant inside.

Titan is right in saying that it is difficult, but it really is no different from banning a person from any other venue, just that the scale is larger. It can also work by legislation enforcing an exclusion zone (say 500 metres) from the venue between certain dates/times.

To say that it cannot be done is incorrect though, because it is done elsewhere in stadia of comparable size to the MCG. It just hasn't been in Australia as yet (as far as I know) - although there was talk about Peter Hore being banned from a number of venues a few years ago.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

CCTV is best used for post event investigations.

Unless the offender is in prison (unlikely) or is subject to police/security observation (cost/ civil liberty) there is no realistic way they can prevent a banned spectator attending a game.

Legislation is useless and only works if the individual accepts the law. Drivers are not allowed to speed or drink/drive but a large number disturbingly do.

Peter Hore is proof of this. How do we know he has not attended games at banned venues.

How do other stadiums do it then?

[H_T 3,032]

Is it true that in the EPL, they do not serve alcohol at games?

[45HG 1,539]

Don't think so HT.

Saw a list of prices for pints at various grounds, some are insane! So, perhaps in a roundabout way, they don't

[Kit Walker 225]

CCTV is best used for post event investigations.

Unless the offender is in prison (unlikely) or is subject to police/security observation (cost/ civil liberty) there is no realistic way they can prevent a banned spectator attending a game.

Legislation is useless and only works if the individual accepts the law. Drivers are not allowed to speed or drink/drive but a large number disturbingly do.

Peter Hore is proof of this. How do we know he has not attended games at banned venues.

How do other stadiums do it then?

If operated properly, CCTV can and should be used to prevent incidents, stop those that are in progress, and to investigate the aftermath. And CCTV is one tool that is used along with the vigilance of security, police and to some degree, the general public.

As I've written previously, it is difficult but it is not impossible. The experience overseas shows us that.

Soccer Hooligan Article

Unfortunately this is a very long article, and some of the measures used are far in excess of what is required here, but it does highlight in particular the use of "spotters" and the assistance of supporter groups. Given the reaction of the vast majority of Collingwood fans to this particular incident, that is not unrealistic in my view.

Your argument regarding legislation is fallacious, and quite frankly disturbing. There are two rationales for criminal penalties, deterring the individual and deterring the rest of society. Even if the individual is not deterred, the majority of society will not act in this type of manner because of either their general lawfulness, or the fear of the penalty. Those that do are punished accordingly.

We don't know for certain if Peter Hore has subsequently attended venues from which he has been banned. But when was the last time you saw an article or news report showing him making a nuisance of himself?

[The Emblem 1]

Is it true that in the EPL, they do not serve alcohol at games?

Sheep's eye pie & "Saudi champagne" (Appelitise)

[H_T 3,032]

Don't think so HT.

Saw a list of prices for pints at various grounds, some are insane! So, perhaps in a roundabout way, they don't

I thought I heard on SEN the other day someone spoke of the non serving of alcohol 'during' the game within the EPL.....I could be wrong.

Even if the AFL banned the serving of alcohol during games, it still wouldn't stamp out violence. But it may prevent regular occurance.

The problem in some circles is 'binge drinking'. That's not to say this is the cause of everything, but it does contribute and is a problem for society in general.

[Little Lucifer 2]

It is amusing to see the positive reaction to physical abuse of of one of own. (Nathan Jones's Dad) Very commendable. Pity there is not the same level of outcry for the verbal abuse of players on this "fan" based website. If there was, a few of the regular posters might cop a weekly ban too. Words are just as powerful as fists. You just can't see the bruises.

[45HG 1,539]

You could be right HT. But sometimes these things will happen anyway, those fruitloops on the weekend were probably on something other than alcohol - which are the bigger causes of public violence at the moment IMO

[H_T 3,032]

You could be right HT. But sometimes these things will happen anyway, those fruitloops on the weekend were probably on something other than alcohol - which are the bigger causes of public violence at the moment IMO

Yes. You're probably on the money in that regard. Wouldn't surprise me either.

[Dnic 5]

I thought I heard on SEN the other day someone spoke of the non serving of alcohol 'during' the game within the EPL.....I could be wrong.

Even if the AFL banned the serving of alcohol during games, it still wouldn't stamp out violence. But it may prevent regular occurance.

The problem in some circles is 'binge drinking'. That's not to say this is the cause of everything, but it does contribute and is a problem for society in general.

I used to run a bar in the West Stand at Stamford bridge (Chelsea), and that used to be open only before kick off and at half time. Originally served plastic stubbies of Bud at 3 quid a pop (seriously, why would you bother...) until someone chucked one on to the pitch against Spurs, then they went back to cups.

You weren't allowed to take your cups up in to the stand either; cue mad swill to down as much as you could during half time.

It's just soccer though: I used to watch rugby out in Richmond, and they had Heineken servers going round the crowd using the "drenching packs" to serve beer to you in your seat. You could take spirits out of the bar as well.

I think sitting down drinking, away from the bar slows your consumption down, rather than standing watching the game where you have easier access.

The scum bags involved in this incident are more likely to have been using something from a backyard lab, or just have an extra chromosome each. Dangerous animals belong in a cage.

[45HG 1,539]

I just read on a random website that they don't allow alcohol to be taken into the stands at Craven Cottage either, so probably is a league-wide rule now.

Thanks for that Dnic, cool piece of info

[Trisul 664]

You'd be surprised how good facial recognition software can be these days when used in conjunction with CCTV. Prohibitive cost wise and logistically, but I can see it being implemented in stages - just like surveillance on transport, in retail hubs and city streets.

[Sir Why You Little 36,670]

The AFL rightfully have condemned the actions of those arrested.

However, aside from cancelling a Club/AFL membership if they have one, how do they possibly ban people from games?

Tattoo "FILTH" on the Forehead for easy recognition.

[45HG 1,539]

Anyone see 10 news tonight?

Some filthy filth fan who was supporting his "mates" - "The melbourne guys started it, he got what he deserved."

Disgusting, absolutely disgusting. Hate these filthy humans who go out of their way to defend their disgraceful actions.

Probably not even "real" Collingwood fans, probably couldn't name 4 fans.

Just trying to be "tough" guys, far out it makes me angry.

[H_T 3,032]

Anyone see 10 news tonight?

Some filthy filth fan who was supporting his "mates" - "The melbourne guys started it, he got what he deserved."

Disgusting, absolutely disgusting. Hate these filthy humans who go out of their way to defend their disgraceful actions.

Probably not even "real" Collingwood fans, probably couldn't name 4 fans.

Just trying to be "tough" guys, far out it makes me angry.

How many teeth did he have 45hotgod, 3?

[Sir Why You Little 36,670]

Is it Possible to Hate Collingwood & all they stand for more now than i did last week?......Yes it is!!