Alcho Dee

And wasn't given as much opportunity as others..........

I think a lot on here share your hurt.

And at some stage these kids must be given game time to develop especially ahead of Byrnes who is offers FA on the ground and will be delisted at the end of the year. Tell me what is the point in playing Byrnes ahead of others like JkH especially looking into 2015 and beyond.

Is it possible that some people have not signed up for a membership based on yesterday's result?

It was a bit over the top, but I feel the same amount of disappointment as C&B. Especially for the people who mad the effort to go and support the team yesterday. That is a joke, If the team is going to turn up and play like that it would be good to let the supporters know so they can stay home and do some weeding or something equally as enjoyable.....guarantee you C&B we would have had about 30 inside 50's yesterday compared to Hawthorns 65-70.

There was clearly a change in game plan over the NAB Challenge and the boys did well by controlling the ball, apart from actually moving the ball inside 50, but there was a good display of skills and structure against both Richmond and Geelong.

Don't take too much out of that game yesterday, it was 1 game and it was a practice match, it wasn't even a NAB Challenge game. It's all about round 1.

Who has more skill and talent than the guy who couldn't get a game with Geelong and who was back playing on the VFL. And who won't be on our list next year....

I watched Hawthorn play North Melbourne down in Launceston two week ends ago, Hawthorn made North look pretty average and ran out easy winners by 65 points. I missed the game yesterday but I can only imagine what it was like. 65 points is a lot different to 110 but North Melbourne were out of the game in the first quarter and never looked like getting back into it and it felt more like a 90 point flogging than 65. Hawthorn were a class above, much like I assume they were yesterday. Their structured play with efficient quick 30-40m kicks until finding a target inside 50 Bruest, Gunstan or Roughead. Their defence with Sam Mitchell, Hodge, Suckling etc is skilled and the ball rebounds out of defence with ease. They play as a team and are fit, and as Roos says they are the reigning premiers and have experienced the ultimate success playing with each other, they play with so much confidence and these practice matches and nab challenge games are turned into training drills. They made North Melbourne look very very average on a big ground in Tassie and my thoughts of North Melbourne were they looked like a team to finish 12th 13th or well out of the 8. We have seen how the top dogs play their footy and the boys can either drop their heads and get beaten by St Kilda round 1, or do as North Melbourne have done and bounce back the following week. I'm glad I didn't see the game but hopefully the boys are strong enough mentally to learn from how Hawthorn play and to show it agains St Kilda.

Just someone looking for another excuse.

Any stats from the game?

We're in trouble if Byrnes is getting a game round 1.

Thats poor quality Mcqueenie, move on loser.

Are you talking about yourself again

Dont get upset about it, it's a discussion mate. If a player doesn't care what his supporters think about him as a player, then he is probably playing for the wrong club.

Must say old chap, very nice to read your honest opinion of Watts. I would love to see him cop a hit to the ribs and for him to jump straight back to his feet, even better I would love to see give out a few hits!!!

I disagree, I don't think he puts his body on the line enough, Leo Barry like, I think Melbourne supporters and others would respect him much more if we could see a bit of this. But you seem to think he has been doing this "for years!" ...and it's not just because he doesn't lay a great tackle that people call him soft

And tell me why Jack is constantly being referred to by opposition supporters as a soft [censored]?

For years, you make it sound like he is a ten year veteran, half of his small career has been spent in the forward 50, so I don't think he has been taking defence intercept marks 'for years'. That's right....intercept marks, not, pack marks, get it right.

Might be worth the wait in the end......be patient, but yeh I agree with you.

You have isolated the 2012 grand final, but this stat wasn't misleading for the whole 2013 season mate, and for the whole nab challenge so far, there is nothing misleading about the inside 50 statistic what so ever, not a big deal, just saying mate.

Which one-off factors would they be......?

Yeh I think a defender must have enough support from his other defenders to be able to leave his man and take an intercept mark, Grimes' move back to the backline has changed the look of our defence, it's great to have a leader like him back there and players like Frawley and Dunn should be able to show their attacking side of their game more often in 2014 and taking intercept marks, not just worrying about their man. 2 players who I always see taking intercept marks between the 50's are Brendan Goddard and Dyson Heppel, but these blokes aren't afraid to put their bodies in front of opposition forwards and take a grab, hopefully Watts can show a bit of that this year.

If you look at all the stats for inside 50's in nab challenge games there is a consistency for all teams, except for ours, with possessions-inside 50's-final score. Generally, 55 inside 50's a game resulting in 100 points. Breaking that down to quarters winning teams are getting 25 points a quarter with 15 inside 50's a quarter, so getting a goal 1 out of 4 times going inside 50. Our first nab challenge game vs Richmond...40 inside 50's score 98. Second game vs Geelong 31 inside 50's score 84 This a statistic we will need to improve on to be competitive in 2014 Surprise suprise the more we go inside 50 the more we score and the more games we win.

We had 31 inside 50's compared to their 62. You know that this is a long way off the mark. To be a finals team average inside 50 (last year) averaged about 55 inside 50's, which generally resulted in 100points on the scoreboard. This is a big concern as over both pre season games we have averaged 35 inside 50's. This number may be lower because we are not bombing the ball in long, more trying to be patient and hit a target. But still, as you know, this number is a big concern and it will be hard for us to win any games in 2014 with an average of 35 inside 50's!!!!