Lucifers Hero

So summarising the above advantages Lions have over Demons: Full club acilities (even if not great better than the make shift we have) Better/more stable forward line Stable and proven medical/fitness staff. Ours are being overhauled and Burgess impact not yet known. Stable and more experienced coaching panel. Better odds that they play finals in 2020 Our 2018 and their 2019 success net out. Our advantages: Two blockbuster games at the G: Anzac Eve and QB. And staying in Melb might give us a tiny edge except we are next door to the Pies. Not a betting person but not liking our chances.

I can not conceive the club would not replace the departed coaches. He may have just worded 'no more new coaches' poorly and meant the new coaches just haven't joined us yet.

I would be worried if there are no more coaches in terms of the roles required. It seems Richardson's role will primarily be supporting Goodwin and the other coaches. What about other roles: Forward Coach (Rawlings), Strategy (Jennings) Player Development (Macca) We will have Goodwin with Plapp and Chaplin as line coaches. Process that for a few seconds. All 3 are first time incumbents in their roles with very little experience. This year they struggled. How will they manage with 2 or 3 less direct coaches next year? If the reason, as some have surmised, is to save money in our sal cap we have our football spend all wrong. My hobby horse all year has been to have an AFL level experienced forward coach. It just horrifies me that we would not have one at all. Mahoney hesitated for a while before answering the coaching question. I'm praying that his response was just keeping his powder dry for now.

Oliver has a history of shoulder surgery. September 25, 2018: Oliver 2018 shoulder surgery "Clayton injured both his shoulders during the year and will require surgery... Oliver will not begin contact training until January at the earliest. "He was unable to complete many contact drills at training in the last two months, so to perform the way that he did in that period is remarkable." That was 12 months ago. Last year he had the surgery after the bnf. Could be the same this year. Absolutely amazing that he played so well in 2018 with those injuries And his performance in 2019 equally as amazing if the shoulders have again been an issue. It is conceivable that he needed work again. But would like to hear more than a rumour.

Classy as always. He not only fulfilled a childhood dream he captained our beloved club thru some of its darkest times. He did it with distinction.

If you don't rate him I would rather stick with Charlie. See if he gets over his second year blues.

Lewis Taylor? Jason Taylor et al were keen on him in his draft year. iirc the plan was to take him at #9 if Salem was off the table. Lewis won the Rising Star award so has some talent. I wonder why is has fallen down the pecking order this year. His height/size maybe?

That is what my post was questioning...

An interesting comment: Cleary said the Lions’ medical department was a big sell.trade-period-rumours-whispers Tough for us to compete on that one.

If he gets that he will roughly equal our highest paid players: May and Lever the only Demons around that mark. At a guess, Max might be getting close. Huge risk for a perenniallt injured player. It won't go down well if he breaks down next year, especially after our other big plays in the aforementioned May and Lever. Not to mention it will deliver pick #17 to the Pies!

Crikey, I hope that is a guess...? FA comp pick assessment made based on all AFL players aged over 25. "First-round picks are awarded to players who rank in the top 5 per cent, based on the points, while end-of-first-round picks are given for free agents in the 5-15 per cent bracket. Second-round picks ...are for free agents in the 15-30 band. End of second round is for those ranked in the 30-50 per cent group" .afl-s-secret-formula-for-free-agency-compensation We are offering a 3 year deal for a 27 year old so it must be a huge $ base contract to generate a first round comp pick ie #17. If the pies get that or end of first round (#20) they are laughing all the way to the bank and won't try to keep him.

I wouldn't discount him based on experience. He's had more experience (7 years in a variety or roles through 3 premierships) than Goodwin when he joined the Demons (4 years at a flaky club) and some other first time coaches. If he gets the senior coach at Adelaide they will put a mentor there with him. Seems to be the go with first time coaches..

Several credible posters here have said Hawks and Saints withdrew respective offers. Both Elliot and Tomlinson upset at leaving their clubs. Your point is valid but from that info it isn't MFCSS at least not on my part.

Just great! Another player who is desperate to stay at their club which won't do enough to keep them and other suitors have pulled out; Hawks pull out for Elliott as Saints did for Tomlinson. They come to us because we are the last ones standing. Not a ringing endorsement for us.

It is futile to argue who has Clarkson improved/turned into a star. Probably very few. Silk purse/cows ear and all that. Anyway, n-oone knows and it matters little. Regardless of how well Frosty played this year he is not in our best 22 because we have 3 regular and 1 back up Tall ahead of him. No room at the inn. I just wish Mahoney hadn't made it so obvious as it effectively talks down his trade value.

We will miss Lewis' leadership. Totally agree that May and Lever are our best bet for on-field leadership. Viney needs the help and I hope he accepts it. As an aside, I'm increasingly impressed with Oliver's on-field direction of team mates (excepting the public spray he gave Fritsch). He has a good footy brain and his public speaking is very good for his age. Very good speech at the bnf, one of the few that thanked people. Wouldn't mind him as captain in about 4-5 years.

When asked about the best leaders Macca said that Gawn and Viney were those most aligned to the team and totally invested in the direction of team. Macca commented on one aspect of leadership and I'm sure there are many other off-field aspects he is good at. The leadership that fans are crying out for is on-field. Leaders that have footy IQ, can read the play, help change momentum, ensure the game plan is followed, direct players to correct positions, ensure set plays are followed, bring recalcitrants into line etc etc. Viney has not shown much in that regard and until he does he will be criticised for it, fairly in my view.

Last week Matthew Lloyd suggested Daniher be traded for Syd picks #5 and #9 (after Papley trade to Carlton for #9 +/-). At first I thought he was a puppet for a stunt by Essendon. Now Barrett is going with the same daniher three club deal I'd say both are hypothesising (click bait style) but it is so far fetched they look like dills. Even with a swap of other picks and faux draft point count, in what universe is Daniher worth anything like 5 and 9! Sydney are fair traders and they are no dills. Just can't see it happening. Patton who has similar games and injury time out history is set to go for 3rd round pick. Both have one year to run on their contracts. Surely, the AFL would have to investigate if both those trades eventuate. A futile hope!

Sydney are reportedly interested. Harley Bennell Having been de-listed from Freo he is a Free Agent and can nominate a club to join. We already have 2/3 players with chronic injuries: KK, AvB and maybe J. Smith. Just can't see us potentially adding another to that list especially if we get Elliott. That is a lot of players and money to potentially spend a lot time in rehab.

He knows GWS need the $cap space and are moving him on. I would think the right things to say are how much he enjoyed GWS but looking forward to the next chapter of his life. The interview had the markings of someone who hasn't accepted he is being shown the door. Must be difficult to know his club is closing the door and there is only one club (17th on the ladder) that is embracing him. If he comes I hope he cheers up about it.

If he is committed to leaving GWS, someone forgot to tell him. There is no reason to shadow box at this stage if he wanted to/accepted he was leaving. He sounds very genuine that he desperately wants to stay.

I don't have the answers to all the questions. So best guess on the 'extra elements' is there are things in his job that are more related to the captain role eg setting an example, motivating/supporting teammates, ensuring the game plan is being followed, playing the 'General' role and ensuring set-ups occur. As you suggest all players should be able to do those things but Viney would I suspect have them in his on-field remit. But tbh his score differential suggests he didn't necessarily succeed in those, which is what fans have observed. But that is all guesswork on my part based on what I see other team captains do and how their on-field jobs differ to their players. Other players may have their own individual on-field KPI's to be scored highly for a game. That is the best answer i can give. But my perceptions could be all wrong. The bnf isn't equitable. It is skewed in favour of how many games are played. The more games the more opportunity to get votes. It usually wouldn't be an issue as most players would play 19-22 games. This year only 12 players reached those numbers. 10 of those made up the top 10. Those to miss were Jones (22 games), Hibberd (19 games).

Criticisms of Viney's position are a bit churlish. His score (323) has an extra element of his leadership role, which we can't rate. Without that element he probably would have been below Harmes (319) and Petracca (293). You could say Viney, Harmes and Petracca were about equal. Sounds right to me as the difference between their scores is miniscule over 22 weeks. I'm delightfully surprised with Fritsch's performance and I thought Salem's year was better than the scores show. Well done to Max and Clarrie.

2018 Result Comparing the two boards shows how poor the coaches thought our year was! Last year it was won with 657 votes; this year with 464. 10th position came in last year at 366 votes. This year at 199 votes. As I understand it (and could someone please confirm) 4 coaches give each player a score out of 10 for each game making the max number of votes available as 880. This year a lot of players had 0 to 2 out of 10 scores from all four voting coaches. The comparison accurately reflects our season - it was poor but someone has to win (the right people did) and someone has to be in the top 10 albeit it with a very low score.

A hidden gem in the pps to GCS is the first pick of the second round (currently #20). It is very valuable due to the structure of the draft schedule (Day 1 is for round 1 only) and of live pick trading. Last year the first 3 picks of the second round were traded overnight after round 1 as clubs traded up the order for any preferred players not taken in round 1. Those picks are so valuable the AFL has left Day 2 of the draft free this year for clubs to set up live-pick trade positions. GCS can extract maximum value for pick #20 should they trade it. Whoever holds it, it will be a very valuable chip in live trading come the end of Day 1 of the draft. The live-trade premium for our pick #20 is the reason we reportedly do not want to trade it to Freo for Langdon. I would really like the club to stand its ground on this and find another way to give value for Langdon. Please don't blink, Dees!