Lucifers Hero

The commentators lauded that pass and others like it. Yet, last year they were criticising them as "hollywood handball" Changed their tune quickly!

In the table I showed players who voted in more than one final. Fritsch got 8 votes in the GF. Only so many votes to go round.

LOL, so HP isn't a modern day Don Juan!

Coaches votes were: QF PF GF Petracca 7 6 10 23 Oliver 10 4 5 19 Gawn 1 10 0 11 Salem 0 6 2 8 Lever had 3 vs Lions, Viney had 3 vs Cats and there was a few 1 votes for other dees.

I think it was Roos who was big on Oliver. He was still building the mid-field/on-ballers core. But to answer your question, the top 10 in 2014 were: McCartin, Petracca, Brayshaw, Pickett, DeGoey, Marchbank, Ahem, 2'metre Pete, Moore (F/S), Cockatoo. As things turned out Brayshaw was the best choice @ pick 3. Roos and JT nailed that draft! Roos' mind games with the Saints helped as they blinked and took McCartin instead of Petracca.

HeartBreaker???

An interesting discussion on the current chasing of ruckmen: rucks-set-to-roll-around-again-until-trade-music-stops The proposition is: "...most clubs now want to take four ruckman into a season, which ideally includes the first ruckman, a ruck-forward, a back-up ruck and a developing ruckman, maybe two". Looking at that proposition of 4/5 ruckman, we have: First Ruck: Gawn Ruck-Forward: Jackson Back-up Ruckman: Daw Developing ruckman (or two): ? We did not renew Bradke's B Rookie contract and with Mac Andrew seemingly out of reach any ideas who could be our 'developing ruckman'? Other sport prospects? Or will we not bother with a 'developing ruckman', for now?

Damn it! I should have known you would be lurking and should have triple rather than double checked!!

Another shout out to the player's at the club for 186 who didn't play that day but stayed true and got to win or be part of a premiership campaign. Max Gawn. Tom McDonald. Neville Jetta. Along with Jones, they are loyal and true Demons who stuck fat through our darkest days on and off the field.

A shout out to Col Garland. In the article he says: "The club means a lot to me. I was there from age 18 to 30...After your time, you just become a supporter...And it's just like anything in life. When you see close friends, who are good people, achieve success in whatever field - that's a really good thing." I always was a fan but he went to the top when he commented on (his good mate) Frawley winning a premiership. He said something like: If I don't win one with Melbourne it won't mean much'. Little doubt Garland's heart still beats true.

That game was wiped from my demon history when over. What I can't forget is the distress at watching a terminally ill Jimmy struggle though the press conf to sack Dean Bailey. And then watching Bailey all alone to front the media, stripped of club colours and of a sponsor board. He was a good man, gave us his all and deserved better. I had tears all the way for both of them and for our beloved club. For mine the aftermath of 186 was more ignominious for our club than the loss itself. Any lingering feelings about 186 were wiped with the rnd 23, after the siren goal to give us a redeeming win at the scene of the crime. Ultimate redemption was thrashing the Cats in the penultimate game of our season; a Preliminary final on the second biggest stage of all with the footy world watching. All was atoned that day.

Agreed. That is effectively what we did with Jordan except that Jordan got 2 years on the main list. There is a fair chance Crows were offering him a main list spot, perhaps 2 years. For him to reject that would suggest we offered something better, perhaps similar to Jordan: 1 rookie year, 2 senior years = 3 year contract. I'm only guessing but that looks like a plausible reading of how things have panned out.

On Trade Radio, Lamb has said we will try and get as high as we can and there are a few things they are looking at. So every chance pick 17 could move up the order.

From today's session: But the premiers haven’t finished their wheeling and dealing just yet. “We’ll look at every opportunity to try to get as high as we can. We’re certainly having a little bit of look at some things,” Demons list manager Tim Lamb said on Continental Tyres AFL Trade Radio “We've had a habit of trying to get back into the first round of the draft or improve our position in the draft and that was something we wanted to do again this year. By being back in the first round again that will give us five first-rounders over the last three years. “We’d seen the impact at Hawthorn of a group of young players that come in together over a two- or three-year period and they can really grow together, their relationships become really strong, and they go on the journey together. So that was our real focus.” That looks like another 'drafting cluster.' The first cluster was under Roos over three drafts from 2013, when we took Salem, (Tyson), AVB, ANB, Stretch, Hunt, Harmes, Petracca, Brayshaw, Oliver, Weideman, when Roos' goal was to build the midfield first and have 10-12 on-ballers. Some have moved on but they are our core players now in their prime. The second cluster started 5 years later and is the one we are in now: Jackson, Rivers, Pickett, Laurie, Bowey, x and y from this year's draft. And a few choice picks in between: Spargo, Petty, etc etc.

From The Age: Melbourne is talking with the management of Rising Star winner and premiership big man Luke Jackson with the Demons categorically denying they have had any talks with Fremantle about the WA native. Jackson is out of contract at the end of season 2022 and Melbourne wants him to extend his stay with the former Australian under-17 basketballer developing faster than many expected culminating in his ruck work in the grand final helping to turn the game to the Demons in the third term. Demons list manager Tim Lamb shot down any suggestion they had talked with the Dockers about Jackson. “At no time, has there ever been a conversation internally, or with Fremantle, about Luke Jackson,” Lamb told AFL trade radio. “I can categorically say that has never occurred. “He’s out of contract at the end of next season, we’re talking with his manager and happy with where it sits.”

My reservation is that we will have almost zero flexibility to add players in the PSD or the MSD. There will probably be very good Vic players who miss the draft because they have very little exposed form. By next year they will have a chance to perform but unless we get LTI we won't have the room to draft them.

I am 99.9% certain that Jordan was effectively made a senior player in April this year: Club announcement JJ signs on It doesn't state he has a senior spot but we would not have been able to recruit Declase and Turner in the mid-season draft if he remained a rookie as we would have exceeded the 6 allowed rookies. Using a draft pick (94 or 112) is a mere formality.

How to upgrade pick 17. We have 4 'live' picks with value: 17, 37, 49, 57, (and later picks 94 and 112 which can be used to promote players from the rookie list). We won't have enough list spots to use all 4. Hypothetical: GWS and Freo are playing a bit of cat and mouse re Lobb. GWS have picks 2 (untradeable), 13, 53, 71. 13 is too much and 53 not enough. We can 'help'! We get GWS #13 and give #17 and #49 (or 37 and something back to us if we really want to sweeten the deal). GWS will have a better hand to deal with Freo. We improve our hand and still have 3 'live picks' if we want to fill all our senior list spots. Freo have a fistful of picks and if they were to get #17 as part of the Lobb deal they could then deal with Geelong for Clark. As an aside Geelong would take out the 'grandstanding' award by demanding a 1st round pick for a player they have had for several years but haven't played very often.

Thank you. Are we sure they had it right? The club was specific on: "Baker and Bedford have been retained on the senior list, while Brown, Daw, Smith and Turner will remain on the rookie list for 2022" but was moot on Chandler so for now I'll leave him as a Rookie. On my next Contract thread update I'll note the uncertainty on Chandler's status.

I didn't see the 2 years in the announcement. Did I misread? Agreed under the new rules he can do a 4th year on the rookie list. For the 'Contracts' thread I usually wait until there is something 'official' so for now I'll stick with Chandler as a Rookie in that thread.

Thank you. Good analysis. From what I can see the only difference between our respective lists is that I have Chandler as a Rookie and on your list he is in the Seniors. Without him and with Hore included in the Seniors we both have 34. Again Chandler is the difference in our count of Rookies. Include him and we both have 6. Total 40. We have maxed the A Rookies at 6, so have 2 senior spots to get us to the max allowed of 42 but no A rookie spots for now. Agreed we can open more senior and A rookie spots if we lose Hore and or Declase. If we lose both that gives us 4 list spots. The number of senior/ A rookie spots depends on how Chandler is classified.

Last year the rules were a bit different. This year Hore would need to go into the NAB Draft first and if not drafted he can be rookied.

I found the club's announcement a bit vague so have taken the Chandler re-signing as an A Rookie for one year, not as an upgrade to the senior list. What did I miss? Is there another report somewhere?

Thanks BMj. Not sure if I'm reading your post correctly. I'm still including Hore and Declase as they are officially still on our list. The mfc announcement is a bit vague on Chandler's status but for now have included him as a Rookie. So I make our count: 34 Senior players and 6 A Rookies. As an aside, B Rookies are additional to the max total allowed of 42. We can't substitute a senior or A rookie player for B rookies. So at this stage our total will be 42. Unless we move on Hore and Declase we have only 2 senior list spots and zero A Rookie spots.

Updated for today's signings: Baker and Bedford as senior players. Chandler, Turner, D. Smith, Daw as Rookies. All have been assumed to be for one year. The club's announcement is a little vague. If anyone has seen other official info on the above please let me know. This leaves Hore, Declase and Hibberd as unsigned altho it is reported that Hibberd has been offered a one year deal. On what I could find, today's signings don't change the List numbers or mix. We have 34 senior players and 6 A Rookies for a total of 40. The max allowed across those two categories is 42 so we have two (Senior) vacancies. To open more vacancies we would need to lose Declase or Hore.