Macca

How do you miss someone that isn't that good? (Turner) We've got a soft draw/fixture so we are not out of it But by jingo's, we'll want to improve up forward if we want to somehow contend Left field but with Tommy Mac forcing the selectors hand, I'd be tempted to play Steven May forward At least we'd know he'd provide a decent contest

Spot on

Well you threw the first barb, I just reteliated. The reason I'm repeating myself is that people (a) don't like what I've got to say and (b) keep quoting me for a more detailed explanation And if you don't believe our forward line is by far our biggest issue, then what is it then? The midfield and defence was good and has been consistently good Where as the forward line continually let's us down. And that's not even an opinion, it's a clear observation We obviously view the sport differently

And GWS choked in the finals last year. They coughed it up from a strong position So if had have had a decent forward line yesterday we win by 5 goals (in my view) Our midfield & defence played well but the players in those areas of the ground can't do it all Our forwards do not like leading into the hot spot. We are no threat to the opposition in that area As a result, we often have difficult shots from near the boundary line The AJ one at the end of the game is a case in point. AJ could have presented in the hot spot area but chose to head towards the boundary line Watch where Hogan positions himself. He's rarely anywhere near the boundary line

It's both (Chaplin & Goodwin) but Goodwin has been head coach in his 9th season now and obviously overseas things And the offense starts from stoppages and half back Our game plan is Goodwin's as well (specifically our movement into the forward line) So 9 years down the track and we don't have one forward who we can rely on. Not one of them can consistently win their own ball How do you win a flag with that issue? I'm not calling for Goodwin's head but we are too defence orientated Our forward line should be the main talking point out of yesterday. GWS aren't that good and we had our chances to win the game but didn't

It would help if our forwards could win their own ball. Or if they played in front and were a lot more visible Fast ball movement into the forward line would help too (not always via the cape) We seem to have an aversion to the corridor and the hot spot

I don't care about GWS Our woes up forward are ours to fix

With a decent forward line we win by 5 goals (yesterday)

Goodwin doesn't know how to coach offense very well At best, he is adequate

And you've screamed at your own supporters a 1000 times about not turning up to games All based on a stupid myth and an idiotic perception. Fact is our forward line hasn't worked for quite some time now and yesterday was a good example of that

Yes, same story for me, Lex I once played cricket (for a short time) in the North East and the club I played for was made up of 85% Collingwood supporters It was an interesting time, to say the least! Not another Demon in sight I'd say some of the bigger clubs have 5 or 6 times as many supporters as what we have In relative terms, our crowds are quite good But the perception ...

We'd all like bigger crowds but I maintain those 20 years in the wilderness (mid 60's to mid 80's) cost us a generation of supporters And then the ongoing effect of support not being passed on The same sort of thing happened to Fitzroy, Footscray, North, St Kilda & South By contrast, the Pies have played in close to 50 GF's and 80+ finals series

Re Turner ... unproven as well And that's why our forward line is dysfunctional Too many what-if's. Right now, we don't have one forward who we can absolutely rely on By contrast, we can rely on on our midfield and defence. 2 out of 3 ain't bad but it's not great either

We lost a game we could easily have won but once again, our dysfunctional forward line cost us that victory Defence 7.0 Midfield 7.5 Forward line 3 We got close but one area of the ground continues to be our Achilles heel As for building belief, I'd say the players would feel quite deflated right now. We lost another game we could have won

With our current forward line woes I can't see us being a threat for the flag. We might make the finals Yesterday we had a chance to beat a good team but once again, the lack of marking power and quality up forward cost us Our midfield strength and backline will always make us competitive but we keep losing games because of a dysfunctional forward line 3 tall forwards not impacting is a recipe for disaster

Billings is not vanilla at all. He's not great in front of goal but as another mid/runner he is quite capable of accumulating around 20 possessions. Our 3 tall forwards accumulated 10 kicks & 3 marks for the day And Langford is another who could have been used instead (not necessarily up forward, more so as a mid) We lost the game at selection as we picked the wrong sort of team. It had to be AJ or Jeffo, not both Do we play all 3 unproven tall forwards together again? Ongoing? Is that what you are advocating?

Fritsch at least got involved and picked up a dozen touches. Right now, Fritsch is way ahead of the 3 tall forwards JVR, Jeffo & AJ (as a collective) did very little ... a combined 10 kicks & 3 marks is low impact On a damp day you play 2 of the 3 only (remembering that all 3 are unproven forwards) and play another runner

Ah yes, but when you factor in a damp day, would the masses gave gone into the match with 3 rookie tall forwards? I don't think so We were effectively a man (or 2) down yesterday and were far too top heavy up forward on a damp day. The selectors got it wrong AJ, Jeffo & JVR had 10 kicks & 3 marks between them. On top of that JVR is attempting marks with one arm only (Watts-like) So JVR is still unproven and we add 2 rookie tall forwards against a good side? On a damp day? Makes no sense Billings and/or Langford should have been in the 22 as on a damp day, medium/tall up forward would have been the smarter play By the way, I was saying the above before the game, so it's not a hindsight comment.

I'd have had Billings in today ... he has an innate ability to find space for himself and is usually quite good in finding a teammate with good disposal That same innate ability often sees him bob up in the forward line with an easy mark. And we know what happens from there!! It's such a shame he's such a lousy shot for goal So on wing but as a link from half-back and then connecting to the half forwards is an ideal role. In other words, just get him to stay on the wing and let Langdon & Windsor drift forward

I reckon the whole thing is completely overplayed and I'm not sure we should care about crowd numbers at all. I know I don't care and any Demon friend or acquaintance I have doesn't care either It never gets brought up in conversation. Ever Yeah sure, from the outside we are often the focus but the whole thing started out as a joke related to the snow and then just grew legs. It's a perception much like Richmond are known as ferels and the Pies as the filth Fact is Gonzo is that we are not a big club. And until we are a big club (if that ever happens?) we're going to continue to draw low crowds against low drawing opposition You won't guilt people into going to games either. I'm not an MCC member but I have family who are and I'm forever amazed how quiet our fans are in the MCC as compared to the outer where I usually watch games It is what it is So we're not going to be shipped off to Siberia for being quiet and reserved or if the numbers aren't great Also, footy fans do gave an obsession with crowd numbers which I've always thought was quite odd. I mean, why sweat the small stuff? To me it's a non story

10 kicks (not bad) 4 Goals (good) 9 Tackles (good) 3 Marks (below par) Not a bad day out for a forward (one forward) But combined numbers for 3 different tall forwards? I doubt we'll be going in with that combo again. Turner for Jeffo or AJ or maybe Turner & Jeffo (or AJ) misses out

Swapping Jeffo for a slow player? I didn't say that and besides which, who is slower than Jeffo anyway? Jeffo is not exactly Gout Gout We could have played Langford or Billings as another runner (or both if we wanted to match GWS' running ability) Prior to the season there was hardly anyone here advocating playing Jeffo, JVR & AJ in the one team so I'm not sure why suddenly that can be a workable plan Maybe down the track where the actual output from all 3 is more than adequate but right now? It's like we're playing 1 or 2 short

The issue surrounding Jeffo's selection is the 2nd ruck duties If AJ is needed in the ruck (if we don't want to use JVR) then can we play JVR, AJ & Jeffo every week? None of the 3 are proven forwards (although, JVR can make it to that level)

We were at least one runner short and the match was lost at the selection table. JVR, AJ, Jeffo & Fritsch in the one forward line on a day where rain was forecast? Being top heavy allowed the opposition to run the ball out of our forward line far too easily. Our defensive forward line pressure just wasn't up to it If you are going to go that tall in the forward line then fast corridor entries are needed so as to catch the opposition out. But instead of kicking to 1 on 1's in the hot spot, the ball (once again) ends up being kicked to packs near the boundary line

Yep, GWS outskilled us But we probably all knew that going into the game But the script wasn't much different ... we kick into a crowded forward line and the opposition move the ball rapidly into an open forward line It's why teams like the Pies have our measure